GM-800 Rigs?

[admin_shawnb]

It might be helpful & fun to toss rig ideas around in one place. 

I do 100% studio work - jamming with friends weekly and occasionally doing songs in my home studio.  No covers.  I tend to mix & match sounds as the mood fits, so I want perfect flexibility.  No "set".  I might want a piano & acoustic bass to double-up, then an arpeggio with a guitar lead, then pads with arpeggios, piano with pads, etc. 

I never do the same thing twice.  It's 95% improv on Fridays with friends.  Even my studio songs are largely improv around a song structure.  (https://soundcloud.com/sjrb-1/grounded, https://soundcloud.com/sjrb-1/builder)

I am fortunate to be within 10' of a mixer both in the studio and at home, so I haven't needed a KeyLargo or similar.  Yet...  I just deal with 3 pairs of stereo outs.

I've never done a pedalboard before - learned quite a few lessons recently...  Things I should've obviously known after reading up here on VGuitarForums for the last umpteen years, like, use angled jacks...   

Basically, it's:
 - GM-800 for synths, pads, synth leads, holds, pianos, horns, electric pianos & organs, etc
 - SY-1000 for guitar leads, pads, synth leads, sequences
 - Blofeld for arpeggios; I *love* their approach to arpeggios, very flexible & musical; the Blofeld is fed from the GM-800's MIDI out
 - A US-20 to switch back & forth between the GM-800 & the SY-1000 or both
 - An FS-5U is CTL3 on the GM-800 - for 3-pedal piano, but also for global string mutes when using the Blofeld arpeggiator, & I want the arpeggio on repeat/hold, & subsequent GM-800 usage not to affect that
 - The two EV-5s are EXP1 & EXP2 on the SY-1000 (https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?msg=211766 - @Nobulusprime is a minor diety in my book...)
 - Note that on the SY, I tend to use EXP1 as feedback level & EXP2 as effect level - insanely flexible on delays, reverbs, for a wide variety of sounds
 - Disaster Area Smartclock Gen3 to keep everything in sync - I'm a stickler for all tempos across all devices being in sync...

Not perfect, but highly flexible & functional, which is what I want.  Easily moved between home & studio.

I do need to crouch down when tweaking arpeggio parameters on the Blofeld, but other than that, it's all hands-free. 

The Blofeld is totally separate & velcro'd, so I can easily move it over to my FTP rig.

I need a better solution than the US-20...  Some day, either a modded US-20, or better yet, a Primova unit...  After the wife has recovered from my last spending spree.

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[Chumly]

Very nice!

[keitht]

Here's my newly assembled rig. DIY GK cable switch, VG-99, FC-300, Graviton M1, GKC-AD, and the GM-800, new stand. Still shaking out bugs and plans but loving it.

[admin_shawnb]

Very nice!  The VG-99 is just so versatile...

[whippinpost91850]

Nice setup. 
Here's my newly assembled rig. DIY GK cable switch. How did you make the switch is this for 2 GK inputs or outputs

[admin_shawnb]

Nice setup. 
Here's my newly assembled rig. DIY GK cable switch. How did you make the switch is this for 2 GK inputs or outputs

@whippinpost91850 - attachment?

[keitht]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/271164665960 This is a start but needs modifications including cut some wires and add diodes and switches. See this topic for details and pictures https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=36189.0 Bottom line is ~$50 in parts versus a US-20 plus 13 pin cables.

Based on the GK-3 schematic, the pin 8 volume signal is buffered by an op amp with an output series resistor of 100 ohms. The voltage divider created with a 4700 ohm load gives a loss of 4700/4800 = 0.979 or about -0.18dB, not an audible volume shift compared to the mix levels.

I am building this now. I've added a second switch to lift the ground going to the selector switch. With a center on selector switch, that add a "Both" mode regardless of the selector position and gives a convenient center mute choice when Both is off. The Both switch makes this design equivalent to the US-20 switches except they are hand height toggles instead of floor buttons. I'll have my GKC AD soon and will report here on its real world performance.

[whippinpost91850]

Thanks , looks like what I want

[Nobulusprime]

Thanks Shawn! you're too kind  2 x EV5s is essential!

I will get around to getting a GM800 (or at least trying one) when finances permit. I'll need to build a new board to fit all on if I do!

[arkieboy]

So here is where my rig is at, at the moment.  The layout of the bottom 2/3rds is I think fine, I might sacrifice the FS5U and share the FS6 between the SY-1000 and the GM-800, but it all just fits inside the foam when the lid is on, and its nice using the 'B' pedal as a tap tempo for the guitar signal from the SY.  The GK splitter is Six-Eight's unit which I think lots of people ought to be picking up!

The top third is going to see most of the cabling replaced for flat pedalboard leads to tidy it up, and the GKC-AD might move into the corner where the power supplies live at the moment.  The FS6 and GKC-AD are powered by splitters off the Boss power supplies - plenty of amperes to go around.  The red and black jacks and the USB cabling is for monitoring and control in my home studio.

I'm currently running the GM-800 mono into the SY-1000 return which isn't ideal when its in my studio, but as I only have mono monitoring for rehearsal and no gig I've done in the last 6 months has failed to offer me a pair of DI boxes for FoH sound, it isn't really a problem anywhere else. 

I'd like a small mixer on the board with a mono aux send and a stereo main out but I'm spent up for a while.  The ideal mixer would be one of these ...

https://www.dpeffects.com/2022/12/4ch-stereo-effects-mixer.html

... but €159 + €20 delivery feels a bit pricey for what you get.

Probably pick up a Berry or a SubZero mixer, which will mainly live in my studio. https://www.gear4music.com/PA-DJ-and-Lighting/SubZero-SZ-MIX06USB-6-Channel-USB-Mixer-Interface/SJ0

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[Jim Williams]

A little simpler but it does the trick.

[arkieboy]

A little simpler but it does the trick.

That's the really nice thing about the GKC-DA in that it has both serial and 13 pin outputs.  I have a couple of great guitars with built in 13 pin kit that I'm not willing to give up yet!  If only they had put a 13 pin through on the GKC-AD!

What is your mini-mixer like?  Any perceptible loss of quality?

[Jim Williams]

What is your mini-mixer like?  Any perceptible loss of quality?

I got it from Amazon for under $40 and it does the trick with no noise. The quality is great to my ears, I can't hear any difference.

[Jim Williams]

I can see that most of you are using your SY 1000 for guitar tones. The IR 200 I use for loading IR's for cabs and acoustic guitars. I am thing of replacing it with a ToneX pedal. I have been using an Axe Fx III and a FM 3 for some time and I still would like some more amp choices. The Boss amps sound great with my IR's but I would love some other realistic choices. I have to do some research to see if it can load IR's alone.

[BROCKSTAR]

I can see that most of you are using your SY 1000 for guitar tones. The IR 200 I use for loading IR's for cabs and acoustic guitars. I am thing of replacing it with a ToneX pedal. I have been using an Axe Fx III and a FM 3 for some time and I still would like some more amp choices. The Boss amps sound great with my IR's but I would love some other realistic choices. I have to do some research to see if it can load IR's alone.

You can indeed do IR with ToneX but it's a bit different. Read this thread

from r/AmpliTube

[Jim Williams]

after experimenting with the TONEX pedal to my Suprise, I found the Boss amp modeless to sound much bigger. The TONEX sounds great, but I think I prefer the IR 200 in the loop.

[arkieboy]

Jim, how does the IR 200 compare with the inbuilt amps and cabs in the SY-1000

I appreciate that loading your own IRs is a big plus, but fundamentally what are the differences between the amp models and the default cabs on offer?

[Jim Williams]

Jim, how does the IR 200 compare with the inbuilt amps and cabs in the SY-1000

I find the amps mostly the same however the amps in the SY have more Varity and the sag and resonance parameter. I use the IR 200 as a IR loader mostly for 3rd party IR's. The IR 200 in built cabs are very nice compared to the SY 1000.

[arkieboy]

In my allotted lunchtime I tested a rig configuration I suspected was possible.

In MIDI SETTING in the system parameters, the 'Note Source' parameter (page 18 of the Parameter Guide) allows you to globally set the GM-800 to respond to the GK input, MIDI or USB.  Some people have been using this option to control their GM-800 from TriplePlay controllers.

There is a 'CUSTOM' option for that parameter that allows you to set GK input, MIDI or USB individually on each part, according to the MIDI channel setting from 'Part Rx Channel'.  So you can set (say) part 4 to respond to midi signals on channel 13 instead of the guitar. 

My SY-1000 is the master unit on my rig - it controls the GM-800 patch, volume and any control changes from my FS-6 and Moog expression pedal.  I've just plugged my MIDI bass pedals into my SY-1000, set the SY to merge incoming MIDI with its MIDI output and been able to play GM-800 part 4 from the pedals while playing the other three parts from my guitar.

The sound that is made when note information is received depends on the part selected in the currently active Scene.  Of course, being of 'that age', and owning the vintage keys wave pack, there was only one sound I could use for the demo - needless to say it performed flawlessly and it was as if a small part of my home office was suddenly 1973 again .

The downside is of course that you lose the fourth part to your MIDI controller.  But only the most complex scenes use all four parts, and if you're in a live band situation, you're probably mainly using simpler sounds anyway.

[arkieboy]

... another thing to consider is that the 'R' part can also be set in the way I've described.  So if you had some MIDI drum pads, then they could be used to play rhythm sounds in the GM-800 while the rest of the synth was being played by guitar.

[Bluesbird]

... another thing to consider is that the 'R' part can also be set in the way I've described.  So if you had some MIDI drum pads, then they could be used to play rhythm sounds in the GM-800 while the rest of the synth was being played by guitar.

Connecting the Beatstep Pro would turn it into a capable drum machine. And you could sequence two of the other four parts as well. The Beatstep Pro has two sequencers plus a 16 track drum sequencer.

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[Jim Williams]

I have decided to go with the TONEX in the Loop of the SY 1000. What you here on the guitar parts is a profile of a clean Dumble amp with a modeled Strat from the SY 1000. all the effects are from the SY 1000, and it sounds pretty cool with the TONEX. I used the GM 800 for the synth bass and for the synth pad sound.

[arkieboy]

Further updates on the rig.

Wonks (a forum member without whom I don't think I could function - he built my current guitar controller which you can see on the left!) modded a Rolls Minimix* to give individual stereo jack outs and a resistor-mixed summed mono output (for my Laney LFR112) so I've been able to configure my rig properly for the next gig on the 2nd December.  Both the stereo and mono outs work at the same time meaning I can feed the FoH and my monitor when live.

The main issue with the layout of the board has been ensuring I can plug in the USB cables when the rig is in my home studio.  I think need to keep an eye open for a slightly wider and deeper pedalboard ...

Still work to do - I need to cut some slots and drill holes to get the GK serial patch cable under the board, I need some angled 9v connectors (for the mixer) and I need a FV30 dual expression so I can properly control the GM-800 as well as the SY-1000.

Probably also think about the power supply - there are traces of audio interference from the SY when I change banks, so an isolated supply with current doublers looks like the solution, and the mixer has higher headroom at 12v than at 9v.  There is a Hartley Benton PSU that meets this need without vast expense.

* donated by my band's keyboard player.  I'm a scrounger.  I admit.

[Jim Williams]

Here is a sample of the TONEX with a Friedman BE 100 capture with SY 1000 effects. The bass is also the SY 1000 and the organ is a stock GM 800 patch.

[gumtown]

Here is a sample of the TONEX with a Friedman BE 100 capture with SY 1000 effects. The bass is also the SY 1000 and the organ is a stock GM 800 patch.

I like that guitar tone, sounds GREAT !!