VC-mini

Started by sixeight, January 05, 2019, 09:45:51 AM

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sixeight

In the process of developing a small midi board. Just designed and ordered the board:



Features:
* Three switches and LEDs
* Single display
* Dual midi ports
* USB midi port
* 64 kbyte extended memory

I designed this to have an external pedal to control the looper on the Helix. But I do have more plans for this board. It is really handy and small, so a lot of things are possible.

The plan is to have a 3d printed enclosure for it.

gumbo

Well, you needed something to fill in all that free time you have on your hands....   ;D


....looking good, BTW... ;)

Peter
Read slower!!!   ....I'm typing as fast as I can...

bowtomecha

Quote from: sixeight on January 05, 2019, 09:45:51 AM
In the process of developing a small midi board. Just designed and ordered the board:



Features:
* Three switches and LEDs
* Single display
* Dual midi ports
* USB midi port
* 64 kbyte extended memory

I designed this to have an external pedal to control the looper on the Helix. But I do have more plans for this board. It is really hamdy and small, so a lot of things are possible.

The plan is to have a 3d printed enclosure for it.

Why didn't you use the 3.6? You could have used the usb host function in it.

sixeight

Quote from: Bowtomecha on January 06, 2019, 06:44:57 PM
Why didn't you use the 3.6? You could have used the usb host function in it.

It really has to do with the available space. Right now the board has the size of a display with the midi connectors on both sides.

But I may do another board for the Teensy 3.6 later.

sixeight

Quote from: Bowtomecha on January 06, 2019, 06:44:57 PM
Why didn't you use the 3.6? You could have used the usb host function in it.

Then I started to see if a Teensy 3.6 would fit for just a few minutes. Four hours later:



So there it is. Only very slightly bigger and a bit more crowded.

admin

#5
Very cool

Is there room for a USB type A Host port?



Or provide a Micro USB jack that works with generic OTG adapters - end result a USB Type A Host port?

sixeight

Quote from: admin on January 07, 2019, 07:49:09 AM
Very cool

Is there room for a USB type A Host port?



Or provide a Micro USB jack that works with generic OTG adapters - end result a USB Type A Host port?

The port is already on there. On the right side in the middle. The board is slightly larger to make room for the port.

sixeight

#7
Boards have arrived last week. These are the Rev. A boards.

The components do seem to fit. I did forget the pull up resistors for the i2c bus  :P so I need to make some modifications...

I ordered the rest of the components so I can test this board.


Smash

Mad skills on this forum - love it!

SteveO

I'd love to hear if you get the Teensy 3.6 USB Host port to talk MIDI to a Roland device. I've been using this library https://github.com/MrHaroldA/MS3 (modified one line) with an Arduino and a USB Host shield to control my Katana. I've been trying to use the Teensy 3.6 host port to control the Katana but haven't had any success. I'm not experienced enough to understand the USB magic in the MS 3 library and so I'm not able to understand how to use the Teensy USB library https://github.com/PaulStoffregen/USBHost_t36 vs the USB Host  Shield 2 library https://github.com/felis/USB_Host_Shield_2.0 .

I'm not asking you to help with my problem, however, if you get it working sometime I'd like to know how you did it.

I also noticed on the bottom of the Teesny 3.2 https://www.pjrc.com/teensy/teensy32_back_pinout.png there's a pad that says "add 150 uf capacitor for USB Host mode". ???


https://github.com/MrHaroldA/MS3

https://github.com/PaulStoffregen/USBHost_t36

https://github.com/felis/USB_Host_Shield_2.0

https://www.pjrc.com/teensy/teensy32_back_pinout.png

sixeight

#10
QuoteI'd love to hear if you get the Teensy 3.6 USB Host port to talk MIDI to a Roland device.

I do hope to give it a try in the near future. First I will test the current board, to make sure it works. Then I will have the Rev. B boards made.

But these are my first steps in the USB protocol too, so I am unsure if I can make any sense of it.

The host mode of Teensy 3.2 will not work according to Teensy guru, Paul Stoffregen.

https://forum.pjrc.com/threads/41250-USB-host-mode-cap

SteveO

You probably already know this but if you haven't tried it yet, the USB Host port on the Teensy 3.6 works just fine with class compliant MIDI devices.

admin

Quote from: TrainedChimp on January 22, 2019, 01:40:42 PM
You probably already know this but if you haven't tried it yet, the USB Host port on the Teensy 3.6 works just fine with class compliant MIDI devices.

However (You probably already know this) - most Roland/Boss gear is NOT USB MIDI Class Compliant

gumtown

I did manage to get an Arduino USB talking midi/sysx to my Boss/Roland gear last year or so ago.
I used a USB host board + Ardunino + MrHaroldA library.

I had it working to the point were I said "ah..ha !! it works, this will be handy for a Katana GAFC alternative,
and haven't looked at it since..
Free "GR-55 FloorBoard" editor software from https://sourceforge.net/projects/grfloorboard/

SteveO

#14
Quote from: gumtown on January 22, 2019, 04:28:48 PM
I did manage to get an Arduino USB talking midi/sysx to my Boss/Roland gear last year or so ago.
I used a USB host board + Ardunino + MrHaroldA library.

I had it working to the point were I said "ah..ha !! it works, this will be handy for a Katana GAFC alternative,
and haven't looked at it since..

That's about how I'm going to use it, mostly, improved programmable GAFC.

There are some references in the MrHaroldA library to something like getUSBtaskState and Usb.int in the USB host shield library, if I recall correctly. Those seem to be key to getting the host Sheild to talk to the Katana USB port. I have no idea how to make that happen with the teensy USB library. I'm sure some smart person will figure it out.


Back to the main topic at hand: looking forward to seeing the V-controller mini.  :)  Sorry for derailing the thread. I'll be quiet now.   :-X

sixeight

Soldered up the board today :




whippinpost91850


sixeight

The design for the 3D printable enclosure of the VController MINI is ready.




vit3k

#18
This is a great work. I was working for something similar that would allow to control effects on Katana without computer but I doesn't have enough spare time...  :(

I looked through the code of this USB Host for teensy 3.6. Unfortunately I don't have teensy 3.6 but I think that you need to remove from file https://github.com/PaulStoffregen/USBHost_t36/blob/master/midi.cpp lines:


if (p[5] != 1) return false; // bInterfaceClass: 1 = Audio class
if (p[6] != 3) return false; // bInterfaceSubClass: 3 = MIDI


Katana doesn't use those proper classes for midi.

Also if the above is not enough I think that changing:


if (p[3] != 2 && p[3] != 3) return false; // must be bulk or interrupt type


to accept only bulk (which is 2) because Katana has interrupt and bulk endpoints and the bulk is correct one. Some time ago I posted this bug on USB Host shield for Arduino https://github.com/felis/USB_Host_Shield_2.0/issues/313 with similar issue and it was solved by accepting only bulk type. With the fix Katana was recognized by this shield.

Also I don't remember how many interfaces there are on Katana and I don't have access to it right now. Maybe if someone could post a descriptor listing using USB_desc example from USB Host shield I could find out more.

I hope that his info will help you. Ahh I think I have to order teensy 3.6 now  :)

EDIT:
As I look at this code I think it will need more changes because I suppose it only looks at first interface and first endpoint and as I remember correctly Katana has more of them. It needs something like this: https://github.com/felis/USB_Host_Shield_2.0/blob/master/usbh_midi.cpp in function USBH_MIDI::parseConfigDescr which loops over all descriptors.

EDIT2:
I looked further and it looks like it loops over interfaces but in different file so maybe changes above will work...

sixeight

#19
Thanks vit3k for sharing your research on the Teensy USB mode.

I just tested my enclosure and the PCB fits beautifully. So I hope to order the Rev. B boards soon.

Here is a quick picture of the Rev. A VController mini. The top is a big rough, so I may have to wrap it in plastic - like the big VController. The 3d primter at my workplace needs a good cleaning.


sixeight

#20
I don't know how many hours I spent designing this board, but they are way too many. Anyway, here is the latest incarnation of the VC-mini board. Added a number of things:

* Small 3,5 mm jack for extra switches or an expression pedal (sorry - no space for a proper 6,3 mm jack plug)
* Option for RGB display controlled from a WS2811 chip
* Option for connecting rotary encoder boards instead of switches.
* Board can be used for Teensy LC, 3.2, 3.5 or 3.6 as they all share the same pinout.
* The position of the Teensy is moved, to make room for an optional SD-card.



I do need to get hold of a Lumberg 3.5 mm plug as I made the footprint from the datasheet, which is a tricky way of doing it - I have to check it with the real thing...

carlb

Looks great!

Coming to this late, can the board be powered by USB and/or via 7-pin MIDI?
ES Les Paul, internal Roland GK
Boss SY-1000, Valeton Coral Amp pedal
Morningstar MC8 & MC6
QSC CP8 powered speaker

sixeight

#22
Quote from: carlb on February 09, 2019, 11:42:59 AM
Looks great!

Coming to this late, can the board be powered by USB and/or via 7-pin MIDI?

Yes, three ways of powering the VController mini:

- any Roland style power supply
- both 7 pin Midi outputs. The midi in outputs 9 volts to daisy chain several VC mini boards
- USB power

HAMERMAN409

Did you ever get USB host mode working on the Teensy 3.6?

I have my own idea for a controller/translator I plan on making that on one side will talk to a Line6 FBV Shortboard and on the other will talk to the Katana's USB port. I own two of the FBV's and found them a great mix of size, weight and ruggedness and the feature set is a very good match for the Katana so it seems like a natural fit, especially given that I already know how to talk to it.

Since the Teensy 3.6 has a MicroSD card and the built in USB host port it seems ideal for what I have in mind but it would be critical for the USB host port to function.

sixeight

Quote from: HAMERMAN409 on February 11, 2019, 07:38:05 AM
Did you ever get USB host mode working on the Teensy 3.6?

I have my own idea for a controller/translator I plan on making that on one side will talk to a Line6 FBV Shortboard and on the other will talk to the Katana's USB port. I own two of the FBV's and found them a great mix of size, weight and ruggedness and the feature set is a very good match for the Katana so it seems like a natural fit, especially given that I already know how to talk to it.

Since the Teensy 3.6 has a MicroSD card and the built in USB host port it seems ideal for what I have in mind but it would be critical for the USB host port to function.

No, not yet. I want to finish the hardware design first and then see if I can get the firmware working. The pictures of the soldered up boards do not have the Teensy 3.6 and the USB host port. Once I finished the design of the new boards, I will order them and then I will see if I can get the USB host working...