Author Topic: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing  (Read 1474 times)

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Offline utensil

Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« on: March 05, 2016, 01:14:19 AM »
Am planning to order an Antares Luthier Kit with 2 encoders to try and place in an external housing . The ATG-1 is too large so was planning on a small external box driven by the 13 pin out on my guitars.
Is there a difference in the LP or strat type DSP board? I get that the pickup spacing is different but are they supplying different boards depending on your order?

Offline Elantric

Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #1 on: March 05, 2016, 11:03:42 AM »
Remember  to use the Group Buy for Antares Internal Kit
http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=16603.0

There is no difference in the internal Kit DSP boards (LP vs Strat)

The big deal is the string Spacing of the Mag Hex PU - you can choose Strat wide spacing ( same as GK3) or a narrower Gibson string spacing Mag hex PU.

Once you get it installed you use the ATG Program Editor in Luthier Mode , which exposes controls for changing scale length and PU placement. And how many encoders you use - I ordered the 2 encoder version

And remember the ATG internal DSP board supports piezo PUs too. ( if you prefer)

Offline GuitarBuilder

Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #2 on: March 05, 2016, 11:21:37 AM »
Am planning to order an Antares Luthier Kit with 2 encoders to try and place in an external housing . The ATG-1 is too large so was planning on a small external box driven by the 13 pin out on my guitars.
Is there a difference in the LP or strat type DSP board? I get that the pickup spacing is different but are they supplying different boards depending on your order?

Also keep in mind that the switch is different for the two kits.  One other consideration is that our 13 pin guitars' output is not directly compatible with the Antares board; it cannot supply the voltage needed by GK and the output level is higher than is expected, which necessitates the use of attenuators.

Offline utensil

Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #3 on: March 05, 2016, 11:54:20 AM »
Hey thanks, yes am planning to make a similar attenuation as for the 13 pin to fish man triple play adapter. With the fish man triple play the actual tone that gets through is not too important as it's mainly for pitch detection. In this case though the actual tone will affect the modeled sounds so will have to give it a bit of thought. Might consider making an external box housing both the triple play and Antares kit driven via same 13 pin port. I think that with a MacBook running  main stage would be a pretty versatile rig.

Offline abhijitnath

Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #4 on: March 22, 2016, 03:18:51 PM »
Hi,

Very interested in this. Would you also build in MIDI control into the external box?

Also, is there any difference between this and hacking up a AT-200 guitar? The latter seems to be a cheaper option...

EDIT: Saw the Group buy post- now there isn't!:)
« Last Edit: March 22, 2016, 03:28:46 PM by abhijitnath »

Offline Elantric

Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #5 on: March 22, 2016, 03:44:13 PM »
MIDi control can occur just like the MIDI control for ATG Luthier kit - ( RTM)

They recommend a Peavey AT-200 MIDI Sync Cable




VGuitarForums Group Buys are here
http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?board=175.0

Offline abhijitnath

Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #6 on: March 22, 2016, 04:56:57 PM »
Just did a quick RTFM. So the luthier kit has an analog out and an 8 pin MIDI out but no 13 pin out?

If I want to feed an external box, I will have put 13 pin input into an attenuator that then goes into where the board would normally "see" the input from the luthier kit's hex pickup?

Offline Elantric

Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #7 on: March 22, 2016, 05:00:53 PM »
It's true with ATG internal kit ,  we must "roll our own" GK13 pin output solution

A few are doing this inside a guitar
http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=15974.0

Easiest is run the Antares mag Hex PU to feed two target boards ( ATG Luthier Kit + GK-KIT-GT3)

Get the GK-KIT-GT3 for $135 from Anderton's UK
http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=11241.0
« Last Edit: March 22, 2016, 05:37:18 PM by Elantric »

Offline abhijitnath

Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #8 on: March 23, 2016, 06:26:03 PM »
That thread is very interesting. I wanted to retain the flexibility to use it with different guitars (which have different pickup systems in them, one RMC, one GK-3). Is there a way to allow for that?

Offline Elantric

Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #9 on: March 23, 2016, 06:30:52 PM »
Quote
That thread is very interesting. I wanted to retain the flexibility to use it with different guitars (which have different pickup systems in them, one RMC, one GK-3). Is there a way to allow for that?
Employ a similar strategy as used for the DIY GK13 pin input to drive FTP
Read Utensils's Details here
FTP - DIY adapter to use GK 13 Pin Guitars with Tripleplay
http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=8413.0
http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=8413.msg78842#msg78842


Or buy the ATG-1



« Last Edit: March 23, 2016, 06:39:16 PM by Elantric »

Offline Majiken

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Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #10 on: June 04, 2016, 12:36:18 PM »
If I could use the ATG-1 as a standard midi controller I could live with the footprint- but if I read correctly elsewhere, that is neither possible now nor in the cards for the future, right  :-[?
Take what you need, put back a bit more, leave the place behind you better than it was before :-)

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Offline abhijitnath

Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #11 on: October 15, 2016, 08:04:58 PM »
Quick question- if you rehouse the internal kit, there is no 13-pin out (to plug into a GP-10, for example) like the floor pedal, right?

Offline Majiken

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Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #12 on: October 16, 2016, 06:02:01 AM »
Correct, not on the kit as it exists- but I am going to planning to split the signal from the hex pickup to go parallel into the ATG PCB and a 13-pin jack.  This will put 3 jacks on the guitar: the 13-pin for Roland and related equipment, the 1/4" output with the processed ATG sound, and the seldom-to-be used 8-pin midi jack for updates & ipad control.

Note that the 13-pin jack will be a straight hex-through signal not containing ATG content; I believe this is the same as the ATG-1.
Take what you need, put back a bit more, leave the place behind you better than it was before :-)

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Offline GuitarBuilder

Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #13 on: October 16, 2016, 10:46:26 AM »
Correct, not on the kit as it exists- but I am going to planning to split the signal from the hex pickup to go parallel into the ATG PCB and a 13-pin jack.  This will put 3 jacks on the guitar: the 13-pin for Roland and related equipment, the 1/4" output with the processed ATG sound, and the seldom-to-be used 8-pin midi jack for updates & ipad control.

Note that the 13-pin jack will be a straight hex-through signal not containing ATG content; I believe this is the same as the ATG-1.

I got all the way to this point and realized that I couldn't use the 13-pin and ATG signals simultaneously; it's one or the other if you don't want to be out of tune with yourself! ;D

Offline Majiken

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Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #14 on: October 16, 2016, 01:39:22 PM »
Chorus from hell  :P
Take what you need, put back a bit more, leave the place behind you better than it was before :-)

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Offline GuitarBuilder

Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #15 on: October 16, 2016, 02:11:15 PM »
Chorus from hell  :P

Like a middle school band performance.... ;D

Online whippinpost91850

Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #16 on: October 16, 2016, 04:54:13 PM »
What about if you don't use the auto tune function

Offline GuitarBuilder

Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #17 on: October 16, 2016, 05:20:09 PM »
I don't think ATG without auto tune is all that exciting; you would be better off with a VG-99 IMHO.

Offline abhijitnath

Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #18 on: October 16, 2016, 09:33:03 PM »
Correct, not on the kit as it exists- but I am going to planning to split the signal from the hex pickup to go parallel into the ATG PCB and a 13-pin jack.  This will put 3 jacks on the guitar: the 13-pin for Roland and related equipment, the 1/4" output with the processed ATG sound, and the seldom-to-be used 8-pin midi jack for updates & ipad control.

Note that the 13-pin jack will be a straight hex-through signal not containing ATG content; I believe this is the same as the ATG-1.

Bummer. I'm actually interested in an external box rather than one mounted on the guitar, and am trying to figure whether to buy the internal kit and house it, or buy the pedalboard and cut some wires. I'm just scared to do the latter in case I flush $500 down the toilet:(.

Offline Elantric

Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #19 on: October 17, 2016, 10:45:18 AM »
Quote
I don't think ATG without auto tune is all that exciting; you would be better off with a VG-99 IMHO.

If using a different ALT Tuning for each song is something you do at live shows, then the Antares systems are the best at achieving that with a DSP "warble free".

And i think Antares Guitar modeling (both Acoustic and Electric models ) is very convincing with more dynamic range and less "hiss" at all volume levels compared to Line-6 or Roland / Boss systems.

one of my tests was feeding ATG-1 into a pair of ZT LunchBox Amps  - and I had convincing Les Paul, Strats, DanElectro  sounds   

The Antares Auto Tune I can take or leave.

Many folks think the whole point of the Antares ATG system is the "String Tune" system which is a constant effort of a DSP analyzing each string in real time and to output  "perfectly tuned notes and chords  in tune for all chord positions up and down the neck - while this is neat, its not a crucial attraction to me.

But its true that if Antares String Tune is activated on ATG-1 , then your downstream GK 13 pin connected Guitar to MIDI systems (GP-10, Axon, VG-99, GR-55) may sound sour, because the resulting output of the Antares DSP is only heard from the 1/4" output on internal Kit or dual 1/4" output jacks on ATG-1 - and that may be a different pitch than the genuine pitch of the strings that are feeding the ATG-1 GK-13 Output   - you may hear a warble or clash when those sounds are combined         
« Last Edit: October 17, 2016, 10:54:25 AM by Elantric »

Online whippinpost91850

Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #20 on: October 17, 2016, 11:29:23 AM »
I haven't tried it, is  the 13 pin output on ATG-I a pass through signal? Or does it apply whatever tuning you have on the ATG-1 to the 13 pin out

Offline Elantric

Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #21 on: October 17, 2016, 12:59:46 PM »
13 pin output on ATG-I is just a pass through signal

Online whippinpost91850

Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #22 on: October 17, 2016, 02:02:31 PM »
Thanks That's what I figured

Offline TravisWildcard

Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #23 on: January 16, 2017, 01:43:31 AM »
I know this is an old thread but has anyone pulled this off yet? I  just want to take advantage of the Antares features and I'm not worried about feeding a synth.  Is it possible for me to use the hex pickup included with the kit and run a longer cable to a box on my paddleboard with the rest of the kit installed?

 I'm new here but I've been poking around reading for a while.  Thank you to everyone who takes the time to contribute to these kinds of message boards.  They are such a great resource to have!

Offline Majiken

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Re: Antares Internal Luthier Kit In External Housing
« Reply #24 on: January 16, 2017, 04:27:34 AM »
I got the luthier kit installed in a guitar; from that experience I would not recommend putting the kit into an external box, as much of the control comes from push-pull switches on the volume and tone pots to be controlled by hand.  I got a chance to briefly test the ATG-1, and I found the layout sensible and ergonomic for foot control, albeit with a footprint beyond available space on my board (I think they have full midi switching in the meantime, which could compensate a good deal for the size).

I haven't looked at the ATG-1 innards, but if you want it on the floor I would really recommend buying one and making a smaller package for that as opposed to trying to reengineer foot control for a hand-controlled design.  My 2 cents.....  ;)
Take what you need, put back a bit more, leave the place behind you better than it was before :-)

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