VB99 vs SY1000

Started by ped, September 10, 2020, 08:20:22 AM

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ped

Hi there
I appreciate there are several threads about the SY1000 and I'm sure to catch up at some point but can anyone tell me in a nutshell:

- what's does the SY1000 do that the VB99 doesn't?
- Vice versa?
- using the Send and Return jacks can I use synth pedals in an effects loop and dive these pedals using a bass with GK pickup?

Thanks
Chris

Nobulusprime

I never owned a VB99, I have a VG99 and an SY1000 and have used the bass mode quite a lot. They're very similar but the SY1000 has the edge in terms of functionality. There's bound to be stuff that was present on the VB99 that just isn't there on the SY and vice versa

The VB99 can run 2 models simultaneously, SY1000 can run 3
The SY has different synth engines (which have more controls) so they sound different the SY is more flexible
The VB99 has more tactile functionality than the SY with the D-Beam, Ribbon and control knobs
The SY1000 can Run 3 separate 16 step sequencers which is great fun
The SY1000 has more up to date effects 
The effects chaining is more flexible with the SY1000
The VB has balanced XLR outputs, the SY doesn't
The SY1000 has a dedicated mono send and return loop, the VB99 has a 'guitar' in and a 'guitar' out which is really the same. They both have main outs and sub outs.

The SY1000 has a lot of the same models (fenders, Ricks, Upright, fretless etc) as the VB99 I'm guessing that these are of a similar quality

All in all not much between them, so your choice could be made on cost VB99 might be cheaper if you can find one, the SY1000 has the edge in terms of functionality IMO

Hope that helps!

ped

#2
Thanks a lot for your helpful answer. I e had a VB99 for several years and just love it and prefer the physical format of having it on a stand for one thing.

The only thing I find myself wanting is an effects loop because if I want to use other pedals I have to chain them before the VB99 and therefore have to use a 1/4" cable instead. Are you saying I can use the guitar in/out as an effects loop whilst using a 13 pin cable from my bass?? Because that would be perfect if so...

I'm sure I've tried having something plugged into the 'bass in' Jack and the GK input at the same time, but it cuts the 13 pin input out when you do that?

Nobulusprime

No worries. The guitar in and out on the VB is not an effects loop, it just allows you to plug in a bass and lets you output that signal dry but it is an effect loop on the SY1000.

ped

Thanks, I thought so. Shame, it would be useful. I did wonder if using the 'bass in' button (green) would activate that input alongside the GK input but don't think it does.

I use the 1/4 in a lot actually even though two of my three basses have the GK pickup installed.

aliensporebomb

Just know:  Guitar and models on the VB-99/VG-99 are approximately ten years old in terms of DSP processing and the like.  That being said, you can still do a heck of a lot with it.  I've always said if I ever see a VB locally I'll have to get it to see if it does what all the other GK stuff does in my hands.
My music projects online at http://www.aliensporebomb.com/

GK Devices:  Roland VG-99, Boss GP-10, Boss SY-1000.

ped

Indeed - I had the original V-bass until about 2015 and I'm really happy with the VB99. I have a very specific headphone/bassboard setup and the VB99 has beaten every analogue preamp I've tried, plus of course it can do so much more. I certainly have no reason to upgrade but you know it's fun to look!!

ped

Ok so here's a question - can I put my two synth pedals from any of the affected outputs so I can play them from the VB99 being driven with the GK cable?

I assume if I put them coming from the bass out Jack then they'll only get the clean signal and will need to be run into a mixer to hear them.

fokof

#8
I have and use both.


Check that thread :
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=28119.0



SY1000 > Way More synth parameters and Flexibility wich is it's bread and butter for me BUT (make that an immense BUT ) tracking is not as good as VB99 for OSC synth ,  with either piezo or GK3B
            > I'm really not into amp sims , but from what I heard , it's more accurate
            > Some bass sims sounds better
            > Upright sim is better
            > The insert jack is Immensely useful

VB99 > Faster Pitch to MIDI tracking ( if you use it )
         > Better and faster OSC synth tracking
         > RRC2 : the FC300 has became a must !!!!
         > Multiband compression
         > POLYFX that are placed AFTER POLY instrument   ( POLYFX ringmod )
         > The D/A sounds better ( as a soundcard )
         > Some bass sims sounds better
         


ped

Thanks for that. I have some reading to do, it seems.

I'll post this question here but can start a new thread if I need to, but it's partly to do with the fx loop on the sy1000

Let's say I want to play my VB99 with a 13 pin cable. But I also want to use some effects that use a normal Jack. I can use a normal jack  and input into the bass in.

BUT can I use a breakout/breakin box to effectively add a loop in my GK 13 pin cable before it his the GK input? I'm thinking:

Bass->GK cable->box->GK cable->VB99

Where the 'box' has a 1/4" out and in

Thoughts? Would this work?

http://www.rsdsound.co.uk/product/p7-bobbib7-gk-breakout/

gumtown

Quote from: ped on September 13, 2020, 02:03:37 PM
Thanks for that. I have some reading to do, it seems.

I'll post this question here but can start a new thread if I need to, but it's partly to do with the fx loop on the sy1000

Let's say I want to play my VB99 with a 13 pin cable. But I also want to use some effects that use a normal Jack. I can use a normal jack  and input into the bass in.

BUT can I use a breakout/breakin box to effectively add a loop in my GK 13 pin cable before it his the GK input? I'm thinking:

Bass->GK cable->box->GK cable->VB99

Where the 'box' has a 1/4" out and in

Thoughts? Would this work?

http://www.rsdsound.co.uk/product/p7-bobbib7-gk-breakout/

Yes and Yes.
That box looks like it will work, any external effects will only be in the "normal pickup" route.

The S/R loop on the SY-1000 is after the GK synth/tone section, but can be placed anywhere in the chain, even right at the "normal" input, or after some or all of the tone sources have combined.
The SY-1000 with the Sub and Main outputs, can have the Stereo binding "un-linked" to provide 4 independent outputs, which any of the 4 can be placed at any point in the signal chain. And under certain circumstances, each can have its own independent amp modelling.
Free "GR-55 FloorBoard" editor software from https://sourceforge.net/projects/grfloorboard/

ped

Thanks. The sy1000 does sound impressive. I just wish it had a stand format like the VB99 that just works so well at home. The fx loop would be useful but I'd mainly want to use it to put polyphonic octaver through my synth pedals, but honestly they track so well I'm happy with them before the unit. Here's a snap of my setup. The VB99 is played through headphones and it also feeds a bass amp which powers a Bass Board giving me some physical feedback.


mooncaine

Now that you mention it, I realize that the VG99 and VB99's stand-up design is really a lot more practical when you're performing at home. It wasn't such a great advantage 15 years ago, but for the last year, I've really appreciated not having to stoop down to my pedals to make adjustments.

I wish they would reconsider that design and update it in a future line of VG stuff. Was not happy to see that SY1000 is a stoop-labor pedal AND its software is unusable. If I can't use the software, I have no enthusiasm for your floor pedal, Roland.

fokof

#13
Quote from: mooncaine on September 14, 2020, 07:47:48 AM
Now that you mention it, I realize that the VG99 and VB99's stand-up design is really a lot more practical when you're performing at home. It wasn't such a great advantage 15 years ago, but for the last year, I've really appreciated not having to stoop down to my pedals to make adjustments.

I wish they would reconsider that design and update it in a future line of VG stuff. Was not happy to see that SY1000 is a stoop-labor pedal AND its software is unusable. If I can't use the software, I have no enthusiasm for your floor pedal, Roland.

Yeah , good points !!!
The SY software is close to Un-usable for me , I'm always on my knees when I need to tweak something with it so , it has two consequences :
- My knees are sore
- I tweak a lot less the SY


On the VB on the other hand , being at hands height makes it easy.
...... and the software works

Maybe that's why I prefer the VB   :)


ped

Yes exactly. The C4 and Future Imoact can be controlled from the desktop too so I only need my looper on the floor.

I've spoken to a guy who's selling me his in:out box which will be great as I can mix in my pedals with the affected signal using the 'bass in' mix/magnetic pickup blend on any channel.

Antonuzzo

The main thing is that the VB-99 is designed with bass players in mind, and that is something that is really reflected in how it sounds and how it works. The SY-1000 and the GR-55 are jacks of all trades to an extent, and compromises have been made in the bass area.

I think that the SY1000 lacks the Trace Elliott amp model, which the VB-99 has - although it does add a couple of others. It also omits the Mu-Tron Biphase, which is a shame as it's a fun effect for guitarists too.

Of all the bits of kit I've acquired over the years, the VB-99 has had the biggest 'wow' factor for me. It's attracted the most attention when I've used it - 'How the hell are you getting those sounds??'

fokof

#16
Got a lot of time to play with the SY in the last weeks , even though having to be on your knees to tweak is a F*****g pain in the knees.  >:(
Software totally un-usable for me.....

Since we're on the VB99 sub-section , I'll talk about stuff I prefer on the VB:

- Antonuzzo is right : the Mu-TronIII is VERY VERY good on the VB , not present on the SY.
(I have one as hardware to compare)
The Touch Wah is miles away from the Mu-Tron emulation , sadly.

- One of my big gripe about the SY (good on the VB) is the compressors in general.
There is no "real" compressor emulation at all , only Pedal emulation on the SY.
No real parameters : threshold/ratio/attack/release
And most of all : Lack of multi band compression in the SY , so good on the VB

- The Poly-FX AFTER the instruments:
(I don't understand what the intent was with the PolyFX on the SY)
All the Poly FX are "bass player "oriented on the VB and the Poly ring is a particularly good one !

- I really like the "Vari" model on the VB wich is absent on the SY.
There is a whole category less in the SY Bass mode than the SY Guitar mode (VIO) ,

- The 2X2 chorus in the VB is my "toGo" chorus , a kinda multi band chorus , wich enables you to choose the X-over frequency and have different parameters for High and Lows.
(Never understood why that one was on the FX block instead of the Chorus block though in the VB)
   


Quote from: Antonuzzo on November 09, 2020, 02:42:54 AM
The main thing is that the VB-99 is designed with bass players in mind, and that is something that is really reflected in how it sounds and how it works. The SY-1000 and the GR-55 are jacks of all trades to an extent, and compromises have been made in the bass area.
Yep , that kinda sums it up....

Mind you , the SY1000 is a keeper but so are my 2 VB99 !!!!!!!

luca9583

Quote from: ped on September 14, 2020, 12:03:38 AM
Thanks. The sy1000 does sound impressive. I just wish it had a stand format like the VB99 that just works so well at home. The fx loop would be useful but I'd mainly want to use it to put polyphonic octaver through my synth pedals, but honestly they track so well I'm happy with them before the unit. Here's a snap of my setup. The VB99 is played through headphones and it also feeds a bass amp which powers a Bass Board giving me some physical feedback.



@ped how does the tracking of the VB-99 compare to the C4 on the low B of a 5 string bass? Is the VB-99 tighter and faster? Also can you get a true sawtooth sound on the low B with the VB-99 like the C4 does, or does it produce any unwanted 5th overtones like the SY 300 does?

ficelles

Quote from: fokof on November 25, 2020, 10:33:47 AMMind you , the SY1000 is a keeper but so are my 2 VB99 !!!!!!!

I also have two VB-99s and an SY-1000 but the SY-1000 is reserved for guitar as I find the VB-99s do all I want on bass. If only Roland would produce another bass modelling system for 13-pin but I think that is unlikely now :(

admin

Quote from: ficelles on September 14, 2022, 04:15:19 PMI also have two VB-99s and an SY-1000 but the SY-1000 is reserved for guitar as I find the VB-99s do all I want on bass. If only Roland would produce another bass modelling system for 13-pin but I think that is unlikely now :(


The official word is Boss SY-1000 in Bass Mode is the follow on update for Roland VB-99