First two days with the unit! Please help!

[panixgr]

Hello All, first message in your forums!  ( I am located in Greece so English is not my forte pls bear with me!)

I just got the boss gx-100 this Monday (two days ago), and I got mixed feelings. I am coming from boss me-25 which served me very well for over 11 years, I am loving it, and still have it. At some rehearsal I just noticed some volume drops with me-25, and so I decided it was time for an upgrade. Being a boss-boy (joke word I am 54 yrs old !) I went for the gx-100 after the needed research. And I played one gx-100 live at a shop nearby, so I thought it was good to buy (remote/internet) from this same shop, just to be safe in case I want to withdraw and return.


I have some observations, excuse my newbie-ness:

- the unit seems so so more complicated than me-25 (and this is expected)

- it assumes greater knowledge of tone and sound engineering from the user than the me-25 (expected)

- some of the defaults sound crappy, e.g. the juggernnaut amp, which can be transformed into a EVH 5150 just two clicks away! But this is not the default operation.

- I get confused by when the wah is activated, what is activated and how, the "memory" vs "manual" mode seems kinda confusing and counter - intuitive , as I thought that memory-mode would be 100% read-only, which manual read/write. Anyway the UI interface and the logic behind it is not so clear (at least to me).

- Also I find myself unable to have a boost pedal without any amp selected (or even with an amp). People suggest using an EQ effect for that, but still haven't done that.


Now, the positive points, I managed to have the best and sweetest tones available, more info + pics when I get home, by :

Code Select Expand



                                  /----> stereo delay          \

Distortion --> div  -->                                          --> mix --> Master

                                  \----> stereo hamronizer    /




Div in mix mode with both paths active at the same time. The tone? a beauty !!

However, if I place an amp after the mixer, I get a undefined awful sound that rings badly in my ears. Not this stereo sweetness I get without. How can I add a speaker simulation to that? if not with an amp? How do I retain the stereo with an amp? I tried with all neutral amps, e.g. transparent and natural like that :  but didn't like it at all.

Code Select Expand



                                  /----> stereo delay          \

Distortion --> div  -->                                          --> mix --> amp --> Master

                                  \----> stereo hamronizer    /




I tried to place an amp in each of the two sub-paths, but didn't like it either :

Code Select Expand


                                  /----> stereo delay    --> amp      \

Distortion --> div  -->                                                    --> mix --> Master

                                  \----> stereo hamronizer  --> amp  /



So, how do I add a speaker simulation to this setup? with amp/speaker or without ? How do I add something like a solo boost to that ? Or have the default setting without the delay and the harmonizer ( only keep the distortion) and then activate the delay/harmonizer path + solo boost for solos ?


Thank you !!

[Brent Flash]

Welcome to the group panixgr! 

[panixgr]

Thank you!

[Magic Russ]

Welcome.  It sounds like you are starting to discover that there are cases where order of effects matters.  This is not unique to the GX-100.

One of the biggest issues is whether things should go before or after drives or amps.  You typically don't want your harmonizer in front of the amp because the amp will end up muddying the harmonized signal.  It will sound much clearer if you put it after the amp.

In most cases, you want compressors first, followed by overdrives, wah, amps, delays, modulations, and reverb.  However, there are some cases where classic sounds can be had by going against this convention.  For example, a reverb pedal into an amp is part of the shoegaze sound of the 90s.

Some orderings make a bigger difference than others.  For example, it doesn't matter that much if you have delay before or after chorus.  It makes a lot of difference if you have delay before or after a volume pedal.

[panixgr]

Welcome.  It sounds like you are starting to discover that there are cases where order of effects matters.  This is not unique to the GX-100.

One of the biggest issues is whether things should go before or after drives or amps.  You typically don't want your harmonizer in front of the amp because the amp will end up muddying the harmonized signal.  It will sound much clearer if you put it after the amp.

In most cases, you want compressors first, followed by overdrives, wah, amps, delays, modulations, and reverb.  However, there are some cases where classic sounds can be had by going against this convention.  For example, a reverb pedal into an amp is part of the shoegaze sound of the 90s.

Some orderings make a bigger difference than others.  For example, it doesn't matter that much if you have delay before or after chorus.  It makes a lot of difference if you have delay before or after a volume pedal.

Hello, thank you!
Yes, surely order of effects matters. Let me update the thread with my current status on the unit :
I didn't try putting the harmonizer after the amp yet.
I just kept the two amps in their sub-paths, tweaked mixer from stereo to pan and instantly I got some clear and defined stereo tone. Very very nice.
Also, I managed to have (clean!!!) solo boost for my patch + wah activated by the Exp pedal switch !!! I little bit involved process, and hmmm with some level of redundancy which IMHO adds some obscurity/uncertainty to the whole process , e.g. whats the point of defining Ctrl-1 both in "Control Function" and "Assign Settings", I could control Wah by defining it in the "Control Function" and/or in "Assign Settings", but amps solo boost (which btw is CLEAN!!) could be defined successfully only in "Assign Settings", not "Control Function"...

Today I was able to emulate solo boost via Master Memory level from "Assign Button" functionality. So I love it! It will take days till I can replace my me-25 for live performance usage, but it will be ok, I think!

[Elantric]

It may not be apparent on carpeted floors or hand operation , And you must use GX-100 on a hard surface before it functions, but there is a Toe Switch on the built in Expression pedal that typically enables the Wah wah after the expression pedal toe down is firmly pressed

If you calibrate the expression pedal , it typically yeilds easier access to the expression pedal toe switch .

[panixgr]

It may not be apparent on carpeted floors or hand operation , And you must use GX-100 on a hard surface before it functions, but there is a Toe Switch on the built in Expression pedal that typically enables the Wah wah after the expression pedal toe down is firmly pressed

If you calibrate the expression pedal , it typically yeilds easier access to the expression pedal toe switch .

thanks, coming from the me-25 (which has exactly the functionality you are describing) I expected the wah to work on a system-level, but I realized that with gx-100 it takes a little bit of configuration. I know what you mean about sensitivity of the expression pedal. Being in the 14-day "cooling off period" aka withdrawal period, I don't risk extensive usage. Nevertheless, I doubt I'll return it, this sounds so nice!

[Magic Russ]

I little bit involved process, and hmmm with some level of redundancy which IMHO adds some obscurity/uncertainty to the whole process , e.g. whats the point of defining Ctrl-1 both in "Control Function" and "Assign Settings", I could control Wah by defining it in the "Control Function" and/or in "Assign Settings", but amps solo boost (which btw is CLEAN!!) could be defined successfully only in "Assign Settings", not "Control Function"...

The Control Functions have some shortcuts, like being able to set the pedal switch to be wah/volume or wah/pitch bend.  They also have the option to make any of the controls global (system) so that they apply to all patches.  It's common to use C2 to engage tuner and/or manual mode.  The default is a click on C2 goes to the tuner and holding it goes to memory mode.  I actually prefer it set the other way.

Today I was able to emulate solo boost via Master Memory level from "Assign Button" functionality. So I love it! It will take days till I can replace my me-25 for live performance usage, but it will be ok, I think!

Both the amps and the distortions have solo boost functionality.  It's not the same as boosting the master level because the solo boosts can have a bit of an eq boost depending on which amp/drive.  You may prefer boosting master level, but just be aware the solo boost is there too.

[panixgr]

Hello @Magic Russ and @Elantric . Thank you, I will keep all this in mind! So far, this looks like I found my pedal board for the next years to come!

Just a question, how do you guys keep it safe during lives? How do you keep it safe from getting stolen?

[Boisdelac]

In my opinion ... during gigs it is safe, it´s unsafe before the gig starts and after the gig. If you like you may fix it to a pedal board, where also an external expression switch, a di-box, a power-supply ist mounted, which is too heavy and too big to carry. Or you can use a notebook security cable and nail this to the stage.

I never had a GX100 yet, but i got my first GT1000 in 2018, and my second one early in 2019. I bought it to be safe in case it breaks down during rehearsals or during gigs.

I'm currently using one at home, the other is in my gig bag that I always take with me to rehearsals. And that's only because I'm too lazy to take the one at home and set it up at rehearsals. Actually i never needed the second one. And I expect, the GX100 is the same in reliability.

[Elantric]

In public , I'm never further than 50 feet from my gear. I setup 30 minutes before the gig , play 3-4 hours and pack it away into an unmarked white  Van and drive away  immediately after.
I never carry the gear in public in its colorful cardboard box - get a black bag
I never paint the name of my band on my vehicle- it only invites thieves

And lucky me,  I' m not gigging in high crime areas

[panixgr]

Thanks guys for your advice!

[panixgr]

Hi, just an update, with minimal effort/reading I was able to create my second patch. The Div-Mix feature is so so great!

One question, why Stereo and Pan are different? what is the meaning of mixing stereo? I mean Pan sounds so so much better.

[802.11Guitar]

Hi, just an update, with minimal effort/reading I was able to create my second patch. The Div-Mix feature is so so great!

One question, why Stereo and Pan are different? what is the meaning of mixing stereo? I mean Pan sounds so so much better.

Hello!!

Congrats on finding the sound you like

Regarding the Stereo vs / Pan, if I´m not wrong, the second one send each repetition to each side (i think Pan comes from Panorama), like 1st repeat to the right, 2nd to the left, 3rd to the right etc, whereas the stereo delay you can have any of the delay modes on each side. For example, a mono delay on the left 400ms, and a tape delay on the right 800ms.

I´m also liking better the PAN delay rather than the Stereo

[panixgr]

Hi ppl. One more concern. Yesterday i spent 5 hrs trying to start creating my patches on gx100 to replace the old me-25 for the songs i play in our band. I aim for 3-4 banks to cover all our songs. Starting with the first bank, i got a nice clean based on the stock initialize default. Then i wanted a beefy chunky bass rich tone, think of early pantera, which is considered conservative nowadays, and i nailed it with div and two amps, the uber and x-mod. All ok. I also learned how to configure the various switches, how to have custom solo boost, so i think, i kinda learned the basics. I got 3 issues tho. 1st upto now the great tones that i got all were using div, mix and dual amps and stereo. Do you ppl get great tones in single path mode? When i tried to create a liquid creamy lead, i had little success in nailing it. Think of evh tone. Adding any delay sucked big time, same with phaser. I tried juggernaut, xmod, no luck. Both phaser and delay sucked. I would like this lead tone on hit the lights by metallica, basically the phaser in kirk's solo on this song. No luck. I did one to one tweaking based on the me-25 phaser settings to no avail. At 01:30 in the night i felt exhausted and stupid.

[802.11Guitar]

Do you ppl get great tones in single path mode? When i tried to create a liquid creamy lead, i had little success in nailing it. Think of evh tone. Adding any delay sucked big time, same with phaser. I tried juggernaut, xmod, no luck. Both phaser and delay sucked.

I liked Juca Nery´s 5150 patch, but I think all my tones are with DIV and 2 amps. In fact, I added a second amp because I felt the original JUca´s tone was lacking something.

The patch for the below song is bassically the same that I use for Unchained (shared in the patch exchange section here) but with the overdrive turned off, and the stereo chorus on. I´m not nailing EVH tones, but I´m ejoying those kind of tones, but maybe what is good for me not necessarily is for others.  You can try the patch and it may help you to find what you are looking for.

(yes, I know, I´m chasing the tempo, not playing the solo and many other mistakes  )

[panixgr]

I liked Juca Nery´s 5150 patch, but I think all my tones are with DIV and 2 amps. In fact, I added a second amp because I felt the original JUca´s tone was lacking something.

The patch for the below song is bassically the same that I use for Unchained (shared in the patch exchange section here) but with the overdrive turned off, and the stereo chorus on. I´m not nailing EVH tones, but I´m ejoying those kind of tones, but maybe what is good for me not necessarily is for others.  You can try the patch and it may help you to find what you are looking for.

(yes, I know, I´m chasing the tempo, not playing the solo and many other mistakes  )

Thnks, i will check out the patch exchange section!

[802.11Guitar]

Thnks, i will check out the patch exchange section!

I hope it works for you. I you need the patch as it sound for Summer Nights just tell me. I didn´t uploaded it because I think it is redundant having the Unchained one, since they are almost the same.

[panixgr]

I think that in order to get a nice shredy phaser tone, with no absurd cuts on the higher notes, the phaser must go in front of the distortion. That's what my experiments showed so far.

[panixgr]

Hello again.
Three questions :
- I accidentally tweaked a little the global EQ, how can I revert it to the default factory settings?
- Having long ago realized that sound via my crate 40xl sucks, I found the output settings, I set this to JC-120 input, and had an OK sound, I wonder what should I set this for playing via various amps on the rehearsals, tube amps, transistor amps, modeling amps, etc.
- for the upcoming live show, I wonder what the settings should be. Should I bypass any amp and go straight for the PA or console ? What do you guys do?

[802.11Guitar]

Hello again.
Three questions :
- I accidentally tweaked a little the global EQ, how can I revert it to the default factory settings?

I think the easiest way it is jut to turn off the global EQ. If what you are searching is for the actual values i think it was:


Low-Mid Freq = 630
High_mid Freq = 4Khz

All gains at 0, Q doesn´t matter since gain is 0, and both Low and High cut flat

- Having long ago realized that sound via my crate 40xl sucks, I found the output settings, I set this to JC-120 input, and had an OK sound, I wonder what should I set this for playing via various amps on the rehearsals, tube amps, transistor amps, modeling amps, etc.

I never heard of that amp before, but I think I readed it is a keyboard amp, so in that case, I think you chosed the right optput option. Maybe you should try to disable the cab simulation as well on the GX.
I think I would rather buy an "insert cable" and use any of the "return" ouptput options on the GX-100 or just the line/headphones ones. It is possible that the insert on the Crate 40xl doesn´t work if there is nothing connected to the input, but if it does, the amp will only work as a power amp, with no preamp and EQ. Also here try to disable the Cab simulation on your GX when connected this way. If the system doesn´t cover all frequencies, is probably better not to use the cab simulation. Your ears should guide you

- for the upcoming live show, I wonder what the settings should be. Should I bypass any amp and go straight for the PA or console ? What do you guys do?

I don´t think I´m qualified to answer you since I´m a bedroom player, but I think that depends on the equipment on the venue, and if you are going to have a monitor to be able to hear your self.

[panixgr]

I think the easiest way it is jut to turn off the global EQ. If what you are searching is for the actual values i think it was:


Low-Mid Freq = 630
High_mid Freq = 4Khz

All gains at 0, Q doesn´t matter since gain is 0, and both Low and High cut flat

Thank you, a photo of the stock settings would be great!

I never heard of that amp before, but I think I readed it is a keyboard amp, so in that case, I think you chosed the right optput option. Maybe you should try to disable the cab simulation as well on the GX.
I think I would rather buy an "insert cable" and use any of the "return" ouptput options on the GX-100 or just the line/headphones ones. It is possible that the insert on the Crate 40xl doesn´t work if there is nothing connected to the input, but if it does, the amp will only work as a power amp, with no preamp and EQ. Also here try to disable the Cab simulation on your GX when connected this way. If the system doesn´t cover all frequencies, is probably better not to use the cab simulation. Your ears should guide you

Crate made GUITAR amps!


What's an "insert cable"? The "return" output options ALL suck with my crate. It has to be "input" I guess.

I don´t think I´m qualified to answer you since I´m a bedroom player, but I think that depends on the equipment on the venue, and if you are going to have a monitor to be able to hear your self.

Thanks!

[Elantric]

One aspect of DSP Guitar Amp/Guitar cab IR simulation gear is they are designed to work best directly feeding a quality Full range PA System or recording desk. 

Many guitarists with  existing guitar amps of varying quality, assume the new DSP Amp Sim/FX floor unit will be a perfect accessory for their existing budget guitar amp with non flat response speaker , and wonder why its a battle to achieve great guitar tones


Review this important thread to understand why.
100% applies to GX-100
Amplification recommendations for DSP Guitar Modeling systems
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=230.0


Review the Crate GX40XL circuit




The "INSERT" Jack on the front is a TRS (Tip Send, Ring Return) signal flow access point after the internal front preamp stage.


But on the far right on the front control panel is a LINE INPUT

The LINE INPUT  Jack will yeild the most direct uncolored connection to the Crate Power amp. And this is where the Boss GX-100 Mono Output should be connected to your amp LINE INPUT  for best results

Use a GUITAR Cable to connect your GX-100, start with stock Line Output mode , then try other GX-100 Output modes to find the one that works best for your style and guitar type

Always edit GX-100 presets at the same volume you will be performing live at gig with your drummer.

Reduce the bass to prevent cheap speaker flub and stay clear from your Bass Players low frequency range

[panixgr]

Thank , too much reading, a long way for, but its ok!!
I look at the back of my crate, no LINE IN.

[802.11Guitar]

Sorry, the manual I found was for the G40CXL (which has insert and it for keyboard if I'm not wrong) instead of G40XL

https://www.manualslib.com/manual/33086/Crate-G40cxl.html

I think you can use the Line In on the front and just disable the Cab in the GX-100