Boss GP-10 - How to implement 5 pin MIDI I/O with Raspberry Pi

Started by loulea, July 31, 2014, 01:22:19 PM

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loulea

The Raspberry Pi embedded Linux Computer performs USB to MIDI I/O chores specifically for the Boss GP-10, and GT-001  - which both lack 5pin MIDI I/O and are not USB Class Compliant "MIDI over USB"

This is because the Raspberry Pi embedded Linux Computer includes "Jack Audio/MIDI" for Linux" code - and years ago the development team for JACK Audio tweaked the code to be compatible with Roland USB devices which typically require a factory Roland USB Driver for Windows/ Mac OSX before they work

Jack Audio in Linux is the secret that "talks to the Boss GP-10 over USB"  without the factory Roland /Boss USB driver. 

Details below
======================


Hi,

I'm new to this forum and the prime reason why I joined was to see if the GP-10 was worth purchasing. A couple of weeks ago I finally did buy after waiting a couple months. After being used to the GR-50 (bought it in the late 80s), I needed something I can take to gigs that have a combination of synth plus real sounding guitar effects. The GP-10 fits the bill nicely! It is fast, versatile and compact. The only thing I don't like is that I cannot connect a midi foot switch to it to do patch changes. The only way I cold do it is with the PC running MIDIOX and connect the two. Cubase works as well. I found another way to do it using Raspberry PI and using the QJackCtl utility. The only thing is I have to use mouse and a keyboard. I'm investigating having it boot up configured. I can mount everything on a pedal board and go. Laptop would work as well but too expensive. Other that I would definitely recommend the GP-10. Great reviews by all so far and thanks! :)

Music is in everyone!!

Elantric

Loulea, Welcome to the forum!


QuoteI found another way to do [Boss GP-10 remote MIDI] using Raspberry PI and using the QJackCtl utility. The only thing is I have to use mouse and a keyboard. I'm investigating having it boot up configured. I can mount everything on a pedal board and go.
Please keep us all informed (and supply all details!) on your Boss GP-10 remote MIDI  / USB control progress with Raspberry Pi & QJackCtl

http://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=31598&p=563597
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qjackctl

Did someone get Roland/Boss MIDI support working with Jack / QJackCtl?
Curious how Raspberry Pi folks are circumventing / work around the requirement for official Roland/Boss GP-10 USB Driver (Win/OSX Only) - since GP-10 is NOT USB Class Compliant ! 
http://jackaudio.org/

Boss GP-10 remains NOT USB Class Compliant :(
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=11854.0

=================

EDIT: - For folks just browsing in here - check these alternate threads in this same topic

Boss GP-10 Midi I/O for Dummies (Using Raspberry Pi)
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=12082.0

Add MIDI I/O to Boss GP-10, Simple Raspberry Pi Setup
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=12067.0




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https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=11998.msg158067#msg158067

chopsuey wrote>

After struggling some time with images, wrong sd-card sizes, connecting monitor keyboard ect. and setting everything up, I found another way that may be of interest for some of you. I am using a 'Raspberry Pi Zero W' and 'MakerSpot 8-in-1 Raspberry Pi Zero W Mega Starter Pack' which comes at around 25-30 euros. *everything runs headless*

here are the steps I took:

1) Get PiBakery (https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/pibakery/), Setup hostname/Pw/WIFI and flash Raspbian Lite
2) Find client IDs of your MIDI-USB devices (e.g. by connecting to pi via putty) running the command "aconnect -i"
3) Create another image which connects MIDI-USB devices on every boot (in my case SA-HH->OP-1, SA-HH->GP-10, GP-10->OP-1) by adding "aconnect <src id> <dst id>"

after that, hopefully everything runs and connects at every boot! (credit goes to bleo from https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=91&t=64340 )

edit: as the port number may change it is even better to use the device names instead, i.e., "aconnect 'GP-10':0 'OP-1 Midi Device':0"  instead of "aconnect 20:0 24:0".





loulea

#2
Ok,

Here is an update! I'm happy to say that I have a solution using the raspberry Pi to control the GP-10 with a MIDI foot pedal. I have an old Roland FC-100MKII, that with a simple mod, I was able to convert it to a MIDI foot pedal. Through a USB to MIDI converter, I was able to connect it to the PI along with the GP-10 and used the JackCtl software as part of the basic NOOBS install to connect the GP-10 and the footpedal. All this info was available on the internet which is great. The tricky part was having the PI boot up with the software running and configured without having to connect a keyboard, mouse or a monitor. I can say now that I have succeeded. I now have the PI powered with two USB cables plugged in with the GP-10 and my MIDI foot pedal which is all I wanted from Roland in the first place. The last hiccup was a script I had to write to have the JackCtl utility to auto start. This allowed me to not have anything hooked up to it except for power and the USB cables. I have connected the output of the MIDI converter end that would normally connect to the foot pedal MID IN, to a sound module and I can change patches on my sound module by changing patches either by the MDI foot pedal or the GP-10.  So this solution also allows control of other devices in my setup.

If anyone is interested, I can provide more information.

The PI costs me $35 here in Canada. The Keyboard, mouse and monitor I had laying around. This is relatively cheap compared to a PC, laptop or a tablet!!
Music is in everyone!!

Elantric

This is fantastic news!

Yes, please feel free to dive deep and share with all the details.

( I smell a business plan is in order)

thebrushwithin

Wow!!!! I would pay for that, and I have the same pedal board. Would it also work with a Roland FC200, or a Behringer FCB 1010? This is, without a doubt, the very best forum!

sixeight

Great solution. If I am getting the GP10 (I am still undecided), I would try to control it from my FCB1010. The raspberry pi should be small enough to put it inside the FCB1010 together with a usb to midi convertor. Then you could have just the usb cable running from the GP10 to the FCB1010. I just feel another mod coming up... Who will beat me to it...

MusicOverGear

Quote from: loulea on August 02, 2014, 08:58:49 PMIf anyone is interested, I can provide more information.
Yes please document the process for dummies. I've done Arduino but never Raspberry Pi. From what I understand most people use it like a Linux computer with a header for sensor/control I/O?

BTW I would much prefer to use plain momentary switches (preferable to MIDI), as it would require less hardware, plus that would let me build my own foot controller more easily. I left space for one on my pedalboard, assuming the GP-10 would acquire some form of remote control someday. This scrolling through patches thing is really wearing me down.

I also have a Livid Brain Jr. that I could use to build my own controller if MIDI is the only way to do it, but I'd much rather just use the headers on the PI.

Anyway, I would love to read about how you did what you did. Many thanks

loulea

Hi,

This will work for any thing that sends MIDI control messages. The beauty of it is that the PI is basically your MIDI patch bay which you configure and connect different devices together to suit your needs. I'll provide info in a word document with appropriate links. I am an electronics engineer and have programmed in C but Linux is way over my head but I have managed to squeeze out some info out of all the resources for you. This forum has provided me some great information and this is my way to give back! :)

In regards to the question about using foot switches, this is difficult and requires writing of code to interpret the GPIO signals that would be interfacing to the switch. I'm currently looking into that by either learning a little more Linux or getting a C compiler which I'm more familiar with. Using this approach though relies more on programming than the existing MIDI standards that you can easily control via external equipment. What I mean is that the JackCtl is just a switch that connects different MIDI ports to each other just like a MIDI patchbay and then external signals are just redirected. Using a footswitch means that what ever logic you want for a given setup has to be coded and would take a great programmer (not me, I'm mostly hardware) to setup something to make it configurable for most applications; doable but I've achieved what I started. We can start this in another forum.

I will provide a document with appropriate links in the next little while. If you like the GP-10, this is the cheapest way I've found so far. Can I upload word documents to this forum? if not what format can I use?

Try the GP-10! You might like it for those who are on the fence. I bought the GR-55 but hated that I couldn't use the real guitar pickups to alter the sound. I returned it and waited for the GP-10 and It's been great so far except for the MIDI foot pedal control problem.

Music is in everyone!!

whippinpost91850

Yes please send info. This is great news ;D ;D ;D

loulea

OK,

Here is what I have tabulated. For some of the information, I just pointed to other webpages where I got the information. My apologies in advance for spelling and grammatical errors if any. Some of the information you will have to pay special attention to because if you are not familiar with Linux, it can be difficult. The instructions on the PI website I found was very good. Follow it with no short cuts and you will be fine. Enjoy and I will gladly help anyone that requests it. I could sell these thing formatted already but musicians gotta eat!!  ;D

One thing currently I'm working on is a way to let you know when the PI has booted and the patchbay is active without the monitor. I'm looking into adding an LED to the GPIO interface to light up to indicate the patchbay is running. This will be rev A later. The PI takes about 20 seconds to boot up and even if you don't have your equipment on, I found that it will connect them anyway which is great. Even if the PI is on first before any other equipment and you connect it afterwards, it will configure itself and regain the expected configuration you programmed. It is very versatile. I don't expect you to get it going the very first time but submit your findings and I can help. To remove power, just disconnect the USB power jack.

There is a destktop file attached which you can copy to a folder on the PI to have it autostart. it is detailed in the instructions attached. I want to hear that it works for everyone!!!
Enjoy!!
Music is in everyone!!

Spider

I ordered Raspberry Pi :) It looks like this solution could be equivalent in some part to Iconnectivity MIDI4+. Thanks.

Elantric

Quote
I ordered Raspberry Pi :) It looks like this solution could be equivalent in some part to Iconnectivity MIDI4+. Thanks.

There are many versions of the Raspberry Pi
http://www.raspberrypi.org/

http://www.raspberrypi.org/help/

Be sure you are ordering the current 2014 Raspberry Pi B+ V1.2 model - its the one with FOUR USB Ports!
Raspberry Pi Model B+ (B Plus) 512MB
http://www.amazon.com/Raspberry-Pi-Model-Plus-512MB/dp/B00LPESRUK/ref=pd_sim_pc_13?ie=UTF8&refRID=0CQ0G601XY9B4DH705TG




http://www.element14.com/community/community/raspberry-pi/raspberry-pi-bplus/blog/2014/07/14/meet-the-raspberry-pi-b

http://9to5toys.com/2014/07/14/raspberry-pi-b-microcomputer-now-available-w-several-enhancements-same-35-price-tag/

I ordered this one - which includes a few accessories
Raspberry Pi Model B+ Complete Starter Kit [Made in the UK]
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00L87YMGM/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Includes Everything You Need to Build Your XBMC Media Player
Includes Raspberry Pi - Model B Plus (Latest Version-Made in the UK)
Raspberry Pi Enclousure Case (Clear)---Heatsink for Raspberry Pi - Set of 3 Heat Sink
Kingston Micro SD Card pre-loaded with "NOOB" (Includes Raspbian -- OpenELEC -- Arch -- RaspBMC-- RISC OS -- Pidora)
USB Power Supply with Micro USB Cable -- HDMI Cable -- Wireless Wifi Adapter



Micro SD card speed tests with Raspberry Pi
http://elinux.org/RPi_SD_cards

loulea

Yes it is preferable to get the B+ version. It has some improved capabilities such as more USB ports, lower power consumption and expanded GPIO ports. The older version has 2 USB ports where as this new version has 4 so you can connect more USB MIDI devices.

Looking at the iConnectivity solution, It is a little alike but does not support USB MID devices. As for class compliance in reference to IOS devices, I'm sure the code in the PI ignores the rules for being class compliant and connects them anyway. Apple is more strict on complying to standards and this is why their stuff usually works right out of the box but unfortunately sometimes it is not to our advantage for non standard applications. I think you can connect the iConnectivity to the PI as MIDI to USB adapter though if you have one.

BTW, you can even use this thing with a USB hub to expand your capability. Once you get your PI, keep me informed on how it is going.
Music is in everyone!!

arkieboy

Damn you!!  Now I don't have an excuse not to pick up a GP10  ;D
Main rig: Barden Hexacaster and Brian Moore i2.13 controllers
Boss SY1000/Boss GKC-AD/Boss GM-800/Laney LFR112

Other relevant gear: Line 6 Helix LT, Roland GR-33, Axon AX100 MkII
Oberheim Matrix 6R, Supernova IIR, EMu E5000, Apple Mainstage, Apple Logic, MOTU M4

loulea

Quote from: arkieboy on August 04, 2014, 11:41:31 AM
Damn you!!  Now I don't have an excuse not to pick up a GP10  ;D

Just trying to help man! :)

You will be pleasantly surprised once you get it going. Reading the other forums, almost made me buy a Dell laptop just to connect my MIDI foot pedal which was excessive. This is much cheaper. As Elantric pointed out, it is a good idea to get the kit so you are set from the beginning. The Wi-Fi adapter is a great idea as well for VNC communication so you can see what is going on with the PI from a remote computer wirelessly over a network.
Music is in everyone!!

Elantric

QuoteLooking at the iConnectivity solution, It is a little alike but does not support USB MIDI devices.

Actually the original Black iConnectMIDI and the latest iConnectMIDI4+ both feature a USB Host port, and support "USB Host to 5pin DIN MIDI " conversion for lots of USB MIDI Gear, like Korg Nanokontrollers and Fishman Tripleplay
But the USB device must be "USB Class Compliant - which the Boss GP-10 is not
Details here:
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=8427.msg60211#msg60211


See FTP USB Receiver inserted into the front of iConnectMIDI here:

loulea

Elantric, thanks for clarifying!

Just discovered a problem with part of my instructions at the second last paragraph of STEP 3.

Was:
"To configure JackCtl to come up with a default setting, then click the "Setup" button on the right of the QJackCtl window. Click the Options tab and place a checkmark in the option. Choose the preset you wish to have automatically loaded. ....."

IS:
"To configure JackCtl to come up with a default setting, then click the "Setup" button on the right of the QJackCtl window. Click the Options tab and place a checkmark in the "Activate Patchbay persistence:" field. Choose the preset you wish to have automatically loaded (the name of the MIDI setup file you saved ) ...."

I'm keeping track of updates. I provided both a PDF and a MS word version so all can mark up the documented and resubmit with changes based on their experience. This will make it easier for others.
Music is in everyone!!

Elantric

#17
Loulea , All Boss GP-10 owners really appreciate you posting this 5 pin MIDI I/O solution for the the Boss GP-10,

Thanks for posting the Raspberry Pi config instructions, and if I see any issues when I try to run this with my Raspberry Pi  and Boss GP-10 later this week, I will add updated clarification to your initial  instructions.   

As you should know, we are extremely grateful for your contributions here in this thread, as your Raspberry Pi solution will finally make the GP-10 usable for live performance use for most folks here.

While I'm still upset with Roland / Boss for their huge clumsy omission of 5 pin MIDI I/O on the Boss GP-10, this path should resolve that problem, and allow the GP-10 to be incorporated into much broader use!     

I'm reminded of the first time I saw the Roland GR-55, and was told by Roland USA

"Sorry, there will be no GR-55 Patch Editor"

And I replied -" that's a lame decision, but I'm sure there is someone at VGuitarforums with the skills to create one"

Shows companies should Never underestimate the power of a User group to identify product flaws & shortcomings and then come up with alternate work-around solutions never imagined by the Corporate bean counters. 

thebrushwithin

For those of us that are challenged putting things like this together, is anyone willing to charge for either an easy to install version, or ship to have it one?

Elantric

It should be rather straight forward - perhaps following a video tutorial might help.

I'll know more later this week, as i never worked with a Raspberry Pi before.

whippinpost91850

Quote from: Elantric on August 04, 2014, 03:42:09 PM
It should be rather straight forward - perhaps following a video tutorial might help.

I'll know more later this week, as i never worked with a Rasberry Pi before.
A video tutorial would be awesome

loulea

Elantric, This is really no problem because I've looked for support on this website and have gotten it. Now I have the opportunity to give back.

As far as making a shippable version for those that think they can't do it, it wouldn't be cost effective anymore after adding shipping cost, parts and the effort to do it. You might as well go and get a Dell Windows 8 tablet for 250 bucks like I almost did. Overkill! What I or someone else could do is configure the SDC card and ship them out already setup. All that would be required is knowledge of how to add your specific device JackCtl which is easy. If you can use Tone Studio, this will be a walk in the park.

If you need a video, I could put one together but I think the instructions I put together is OK.

There is probable a way where you can get an image of a typical setup and then have it somewhere (server) where others can just copy and load it on a SD card. This could be done. Let me see how many people are having trouble in the coming week/s to determine the best approach.

If you do need a card with an image, I could set it up courier it to you but you will have to pay for the shipping cost and the card. If I get 100 request, I will have to charge  ;).Sorry!!
Music is in everyone!!

Elantric

My  Raspberry Pi arrives Wednesday,

If i cant get it working with GP-10 by Friday I might take you up on your offer , and contact you about buying a pre-configed SD card

loulea

No problem at all  ;). I could also upload the image of the SD card to this site or somewhere else. You just have to download and re-image it at your end and it's basically plug and play!!

Do you have space on this site for between 8 and 16 GB? it is a lot of space that is required. I could create a 8 GB image. To re-mage the card, there are tons of free software out there. I use EaseUS.

I know what some of you are thinking. this is a money making opportunity!! I'm not that way at the moment but if more requests come in then I will have to.  :-\
Music is in everyone!!

Elantric

At this time 8 to 16 GB exceeds our available bandwidth here.

And downloading that amount would be a huge torment for most.

(Unless you are a FTP owner, then you are already accustomed to multi-day file downloads.