Powered Speaker vs Compact Line Array - running vocals/guitar/synth/BTs

Started by mordecai, November 15, 2017, 08:57:29 AM

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mordecai

Starting to think about playing out at different places than I am now.I currently just play Sunday mornings and it's the same setup every week. I run vocals, electric/acoustic guitar, ipad synths, and backing tracks all of it works great. Now that my kids are getting a little older I am thinking about starting to play out more and there are new venues to play at too! Most of the places are coffee shops, tap rooms, etc. While they are great places the sound setups they have are just starting out and I'd like to "know" how I will sound when I walk in there. I know each room will be a little different and some tweaks will be needed but once I play there a couple times I will already know what to do before I step in there. I currently run in-ears to FOH. I am thinking that I will want to not use in-ears when I play out. 

Here is the questions. Since I am running a lot through the speaker would a Powered speaker or one of these compact line arrays be the better option? It seems that something like a JBL One is the perfect thing for this purpose. I like that it breaks down into a similar size as a 12" powered speaker and I could set it behind me and not worry about monitor. The other option would be just grab a 12" Alto or Harbinger and go, certainly less expensive. I do know I am only looking for one speaker and not wanting to go over 40lbs on the weight.

Will a line array really give me that much more than just a 12" Harbinger Vari V2212? I was looking at the Harbinger MLS800 as well. Turbosound looks like another option but heavier. The JBL One or the Harbinger Vari V2212 seem to be my main candidates currently.

I do have an FX150 I use for practice at home but just don't see me using that out other than a personal monitor. 

Current compact rig:
Voicelive 3
iConnectaudio4+
iPad Air running Onsong, MiniMoog, SampleTank
iPhone 6 running LoopCommunity PRIME(backing tracks)
M-Audio expression pedal(volume and wah on VL3)
2 button pedal connected to VL3 assigned to turn to the next song and STOP the backing track(have to send CC to Onsong which turns that CC into a Midi note that talks to PRIME)

This is the best setup I have had in a long time and really happy with it. I have a full in-ear mix and I have it set up to pull up the preset, start the backing track, and working on automating effects on/off and section scrolling in OnSong.

Any help is welcomed!

Smash

Put my vg99/synth rig through my mates Bose compact and I really noticed the lack of mid range. Plenty of bass and top but too sucked in the mid for my liking. Definitely audition a line array first.

If you only want one speaker consider Yamaha  DXR. Not cheap but very light, flat response and *@#$ing loud!

mordecai

Thanks! Yes the Bose system does not have good midrange to me either. I went to GC awhile ago and just used what they had there which was a mic and acoustic. They only have the Bose Compact L1 and the MLS800. I much preferred the MLS800 for the midrange presence. But audio quality wasn't at the bose level.

HoosierMan

I have the Turbosound IP1000 and have been pretty happy with it.  The bottom end is a little light, but it does have a separate subwoofer volume control.  https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/IP1000

Majiken

I am enamored of my RCF Art 710a, I have Gen I and II, they can be combined, I hear the new Gen IVs are even clearer due to using improved crossover technology. 700 watt RMS, 1400 peak, handles anything I throw at it with ease. When I play solo I go directly from my VL3X into the RCFs, since I have everything balanced at home I don't need a mixer. Note there is no EQ or mixing on the RCF itself like a QSC or Yamaha; for my needs that isn't a disadvantage. Properly placed, I can work with a single speaker just fine using the VL3X mono output.
Take what you need, put back a bit more, leave the place behind you better than it was before :-)

www.majiken.rocks

mordecai

We use the 2 Yamaha DXR12 and 2 of their matching subs at service. They are great sounding but not sure I want to put that much into a speaker right now. I got the JBL EON612 right now and I like it but need to get into the Bluetooth EQ and see if I can get it working better,  my harmonys on my Voicelive get lost for some reason. I have a chance to get a MLS800 for $270 so I think I am going to pick it up and try both out side by side.

JimboTN

Just found this thread and wondered where you were with your sound system selection.

mordecai

When I went to GC and tested out the line arrays they had my JBL EON612, Bose L1 Compact, and the MLS800. I left with no new gear, the EON was the best choice for my uses. Line arrays were nice but honestly didn't see an advantage. I walked all around the room, way back corners, right on the edge of the speaker dispersion etc. I think these new EONs have a claimed 100 degree horizontal dispertion and I believe it. It was every bit as clear and even as the MLS800 at any angle. Not quite as good as the Bose but the Bose really had some issues with mids not really being present. Also the Bose price... The guy helping me agreed that the EON612 sounded best and appreciated his honesty when he said "I'd just keep what you have". Not many salesman out there would do that in a commission based store. I have not had my EON612 very long and honestly have not even connected my phone to the app to get access to the EQ and I think it'll be able to really get it to sound amazing. I have the speakers set to soft, medium, and loud. The Eon got was louder and didn't fall apart either. I think the lines arrays really did shine at low to mid volume and makes sense with having so many smaller speakers. 

Oh and I changed some setting on my VL3 and figured out why my Harmonies were getting lost, my fault not the speakers.

So right now the EON is the clear winner as far as SPL, and even bass, mids and highs. If I had gotten the MLS800 without ever hearing the JBL I'd of liked it and thought it was great. But I just was so shocked how even and clear all the instruments were with the JBL after changing my VL3 to line level output.  I am going to get one of those small mini stands that go up to like 4 feet. The places I play at if i'd need it taller than that, they'd have a house PA or a stand I could borrow anyway. And with that stand and speaker it's still really about the same size as a compact line array.

If I was just acoustic with some really acoustic based backing tracks I think the line arrays would be a better option. But I have very effect laden, synth heavy, bass present backing tracks that just worked better on the EON.

Not sure what someone that was just using this as a guitar FRFR would think but I still would bet the EON would be the better choice there. I did just do straight guitar into these speakers but honestly I don't think the Voicelive 3 is a good enough unit on the guitar side to make a confident comparison. What I will say is with my setup I can make the Voicelive 3 guitar side work amazingly well. I can get it to match just about any sound the genre is calling for and with the advanced EQ and cabinet settings I've made a couple very good baseline patches that I tweak each time and save as a new preset when new songs are added. I have the funds for a Helix and have been really wanting to just get one but I just can't justify it right now with how good my patches sound right now with the purposes I have right now. IF I was in a full band setting and not depending on tracks, I'd get a Helix for sure. But not when I can get all I need, match or near match the exact tones I am muting on my backing track so I can play the parts. Overall I am extremely pleased with my setup.

I may, for fun, this next Sunday connect my setup directly to the Yamaha DXR12 and see how it compares. Honestly it's so much more heavy and about the same size, the 32lbs is really hard to beat. What I am curious to know is how this EON612 stacks up next to Alto TS212. Either way I am keeping the EON612. I have their studio monitors and feel like my tones translate well back and forth from the studio speakers to this live speaker.

So if you are just doing very small coffee shops I think a line array would make sense because at very low volumes it can really shine. But at moderate to loud volumes they just don't do as well as a standard powered speaker. I did not try the JBL One which I really wanted to through in the mix. The saleman I had said it was the only line array he didn't like...not sure what to make of that.


Smash


mooncaine

I almost got the Altos but I keep seeing review after review about the horn burning out. Now I'm leaning towards this one. I kinda want an amp for modelers, chiefly my VG-99. I also want to use it for synth sounds. So, FRFR is my goal here. Do you think I could run this EON for 6 hours straight, playing hammering Southern rock and British blues with mid-range out the yin-yang? Without blowing the speakers? Can I beat it like a bad horsie?