Fractal Audio AX8 - floor based modeler

Started by mchad, February 22, 2015, 02:34:36 AM

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Alec Lee

Interesting for sure.  I wonder when it's going to ship.  Fractal has been teasing the FX8 for months now and the Atomic Amplifire (finally shipping) had a ridiculous period between announcement and availability.  There's a part of me that wonders if the AX8 tease was meant to rain on the parade of the Atomic release.

mchad

Quote from: Alec Lee on February 22, 2015, 12:36:35 PM
Interesting for sure.  I wonder when it's going to ship.  Fractal has been teasing the FX8 for months now and the Atomic Amplifire (finally shipping) had a ridiculous period between announcement and availability.  There's a part of me that wonders if the AX8 tease was meant to rain on the parade of the Atomic release.

Good point. The expanding field of options for us players is cool though.

merman93

The FX8 has "officially" been delayed a bit further, due to quality control issues. Fractal announced they were unhappy with some printing on the metal and had ordered a new run, and as its manufactured in China, the Chinese New Year holiday is preventing the beginning of that process.

When a company delays a product for quality issues, I commend them. A companies reputation means everything.

I'm a Kemper fan boy but, I really took a shining to the effects DSP in the Axe when I was lent a unit to do some programming for a friend. Very powerful effects, but, in my opinion, far, VERY far, from being user friendly.

I think a less expensive Axe in a foot pedal format will sell very well.
Ibanez RG 1520 GK
Ibanez RG 420 GK
Ibanez RG 920 (GK KIT)
Ibanez RGA 121 (GK 3)
Fender Deluxe Players Strat (GK KIT)
Roland GC 1/G 505/G 707
Hamer Phantom A7 (24 pin)
BX 13 (24 -13 pin converter)
GP-10
FishmanTripleplay (2)
VG 88 2.0
Apple Imac/Logic 9
MOTU Utralite 3
Kemper (2)
Gemini 2 Active FRFR

polaris20

Has anyone heard a price point yet? Ive got the Amplifire coming tomorrow, but as with any musical gear, the more the merrier!

Elantric

#5
 
Maybe I'm odd, but I seldom touch my Amp's Tone controls mid gig.
So having  8 dedication knobs for Amp Tone control eating up UI real estate seems a drag, as  I ALWAYS need fast access to Tremolo Speed / Depth, Reverb depth, and Delay time / depth at my gigs, yet all these appear to remain buried under layers of menu trees - similar to the equally clobbered use Interface  of the Line-6 HD500



oh well!

admin

#6
http://forum.fractalaudio.com/lounge/100939-1500-bucks-you-say-line6-5.html
QuoteQuote Originally Posted by Clif at FractalAudio
I'll just say a few things:

It is not an Axe-Fx. It won't be able to do two amps or two cabs. It won't have things like the Vocoder and other esoteric blocks. It's a stripped down floor version at an aggressive price.

It will have G3 modeling and user IR slots. It has two dual-core DSPs, one for amp modeling the other for effects. These DSPs are slower than the ones in the Axe-Fx so it won't be able to do two instance of amps.

There will be block compatibility between the Axe-Fx and the AX-8 meaning you can copy blocks from your Axe-Fx presets into the AX-8.

It has USB, XLR outs for FOH, 1/4 outputs for local monitoring and an FX loop. Four expression pedal inputs. AC powered, no wall-wart.

http://forum.fractalaudio.com/lounge/100939-1500-bucks-you-say-line6-27.html
QuoteLet me straighten all this out.

1. The Axe-Fx II is still the most powerful guitar processor ever created. A TigerSHARC is about twice as fast as a SHARC clock-for-clock. Additionally the TigerSHARC's we use run 33% faster than the fastest SHARC. The Axe-FX II has two of these. Therefore it's got about three times the power of a Helix.

2. The upcoming AX-8 has the exact same DSP complement as the Helix. It will therefore be equal in processing power. We also have many years of experience in code optimization. I've been writing DSP code for Analog Devices DSPs for over 20 years. I guarantee our algorithms are at least as efficient if not more so.

3. Our modeling algorithms are the best in the world. They are very detailed and require lots of processing power. We could've easily designed the AX-8 to run four amp models but the decision was made to use the same algorithm as the Axe-Fx II. This algorithm is extremely detailed and only one instance would run with the available processing power.

4. The Helix is a "check the boxes" product. It's all about features. If a myriad of features is what you want then it's the product for you. A big, color LCD is pretty and all but it doesn't improve the sound quality. It's also very expensive which means that you can be sure that pennies were pinched elsewhere to meet the cost target. Our research shows that most people do their editing on a computer so why put an expensive color display into something when it's not necessary. Put the money into the important stuff like signal path and processing power.

5. We don't skimp on the design inside. All Fractal Audio products use full-differential analog processing which is expensive. I can almost guarantee that the Helix will be a single-ended design as all their previous products are single-ended. We also use premium op-amps and film caps whereas competitors use cheap TL07x op-amps and electrolytic caps. The results of this philosophy are manifested in the FX-8. It is the first all-digital effects processor that has zero "tone suck". No one else was able to do it until now. But it wasn't cheap to do that. It requires expensive components and careful design.

It's about a difference in design philosophy. Do you want something that looks pretty and has a bunch of bells and whistles or do you want something that is purpose-built for the absolute best sound quality. The Helix is an attractive product with a lot of features. Our products aren't as pretty and don't have all those features. But they are the best modelers in the world and that's our design philosophy. Do you want an Olympus or a Leica. I'll take the Leica.

Paresh

impressive... I wonder if it's any more user-friendly than the AXE-FX??
paresh

Paresh

I was just over at the fractal forum & they are talking about needing an invitation in order to buy the AX8...is that how it works? not offered to the general public?
paresh

admin

#9
QuoteI was just over at the fractal forum & they are talking about needing an invitation in order to buy the AX8...is that how it works? not offered to the general public?

Correct - Initial batch for all new FRACTAL products sold only by invitation.
http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/gear-equipment/290148-fractal-announces-axefx-ax8-floorboard-amps-effects-5.html
Quote
Apparently Cliff mentioned something about this coming fall 2015 (though I haven't seen the post myself). If anything, I speculate (woo, more speculation) that it would be an official announcement with an amps/effects/features list and projected price.
http://wiki.fractalaudio.com/axefx2/index.php?title=AX8:_amp_modeling_and_multi-fx_pedalboard

http://forum.fractalaudio.com/axe-fx-ii-discussion/98511-ax8-any-updates-12.html

http://forum.fractalaudio.com/lounge/100939-1500-bucks-you-say-line6-17.html#post1211480


Eventually AX-8 will trickle down to their hand picked dealer network  - but, not until 2016


http://www.fractalaudio.com/international.php

http://www.g66.eu/
http://www.g66.eu/en/news/latest-news


http://www.fractalaudio.com/purchase.php

http://tonemerchants.com/news/axe-fx-ii-xls-back-in-stock/

vanceg

Quote from: Elantric on April 08, 2015, 02:29:04 PM

Maybe I'm odd, but I seldom touch my Amp's Tone controls mid gig.


Amen Brother!

HAMERMAN409

It would be very nice if you could make presets to map the 8 controls to whatever you want - especially if the LCD could be set up to show the 8 parameter names.

Elantric


NEW WIKI for Fractal AX-8
http://wiki.fractalaudio.com/axefx2/index.php?title=AX8:_amp_modeling_and_multi-fx_pedalboard

AX8: owner's manual

Open the Owner's Manual.
AX8: forum

Visit the AX8 forum.
AX8: AX8-Edit software editor

AX8-Edit is the free software editor for the AX8. Available for Windows and Mac.
Read more about AX8-Edit.
AX8: hi-res AX8 pictures

High-res picture of the front.
High-res picture of the rear.
AX8: specifications

Dimensions and weight:
--
Processors:
Two dual-core ADSP-21469s and two microcontrollers.
Connectivity:
expression pedal inputs: 4
USB
XLR outputs
1/4" outputs
Effects loop
SPDIF
Footswitches:
--
Display:
--
Sample rate:
--
Impedance:
--
Power:
Built-in AC power supply.
AX8: official product information

--
AX8: Fractal Audio quotes

"When I designed the AX-8 I designed a product based on my 25 years playing as a pro and what I used 99% of the time during a gig. Even with the Axe-Fx II 99% of the time I dial up an amp, a cab and a few effects. What I care about most is a great tone. The Axe-Fx amp modeling algorithms are the best in the world. I wanted to design something portable and affordable enough to get those algorithms into the hands of a lot more players." source
"They are very cool. They're not an Axe-Fx but they're close. Same amp and cab modeling. Stripped down effects section and smaller grid (4x8 vs 4x12). Two 450 MHz DSPs; one for amp modeling the other for effects/housekeeping. Uses the same silent switch technology as the MFC-101 Mark III and FX-8. Switches are assignable per patch via our new "Switch Assign Matrix" feature." source
"It's pretty much "Axe-Fx Lite". There are send/return blocks so you can make series routings that are longer than 8. All the advanced parameters are available in the amp block, you access them via the traditional edit menu. The dedicated Bass, Mid, etc. knobs can be accessed at any time. And it sounds like an Axe-Fx, so there's that." source
"The switches are multi-function. They operate as preset, scene, looper or bypass switches. There are four expression pedal inputs. There is a stereo effects loop. The dedicated knobs control only those parameters for which they are indicated. There are five soft knobs under the display that are used for adjusting other parameters." source
"The AX-8 has two ADSP-21469s and two microcontrollers. It will only do one amp model at a time. Our amp modeling algorithms use up the entirety of one DSP. The second DSP is running at over 90% utilization. That's how detailed our algorithms are." source
"I'll just say a few things: source
It is not an Axe-Fx. It won't be able to do two amps or two cabs. It won't have things like the Vocoder and other esoteric blocks. It's a stripped down floor version at an aggressive price.
It will have G3 modeling and user IR slots. It has two dual-core DSPs, one for amp modeling the other for effects. These DSPs are slower than the ones in the Axe-Fx so it won't be able to do two instance of amps.
There will be block compatibility between the Axe-Fx and the AX-8 meaning you can copy blocks from your Axe-Fx presets into the AX-8.
It has USB, XLR outs for FOH, 1/4" outputs for local monitoring and an FX loop. Four expression pedal inputs. AC powered, no wall-wart."
"Footswitches are freely assignable. There is a footswitch assign menu." source
"There will be no pay-to-play stuff. All amp models from the Axe-Fx II will be included as well as all the Drives, etc." source
"It has SPDIF." source
"It does not have a headphone output but the outputs should be able to drive phones with ease. You'd just need a Y-cable adapter." source
"Both the AX-8 and FX-8 are made in the USA." source
"It does not have a headphone output but the outputs should be able to drive phones with ease. You'd just need a Y-cable adapter." source
"The AX-8 isn't exactly featherweight either though. It has a heavy steel chassis and aluminum end-caps. It's pretty heavy but very durable." source
"The DSPs used in the Axe-Fx are far too costly and require exotic cooling that is not suitable for a floor application. The AX-8 covers the needs of 99% of performing guitar players." source
"The Axe-Fx II can run multiple instances of amps, cabs and most effects. The AX-8 cannot. The processors used in the AX-8 are not nearly as powerful as the processors used in the Axe-Fx II. They are also significantly less expensive." source
"AX-8 and Axe-Fx II share the same code base so any updates to the Axe-Fx II apply to the AX-8." http://forum.fractalaudio.com/axe-fx-ii-discussion/103735-axe-fx-ii-quantum-rev-1-00-public-beta-13.html#post1241527[ source]

DF400

I've been kicking around the idea of replacing my aging AxeFx Ultra with one of these. However, I have already invested in a foot controller (GCP) and considering the price, it's a tough call in not just going with the II XL or wait for the next rack mount iteration...  Will wait and see how aggressively this is priced - but can say that after years of service, IMHO the Ultra still delivers impressive tones and effects.

jassy

#14
I have also an Ultra and its my most used guitar processor (despite having Kemper, vg99...). It simply delivers the sounds, amps and effects,  I want.

But this AX8 is calling my attention, so Im wainting to know the price, it seems that will be the last thing that is announced, or someone already know the price?

Alec Lee

Quote from: jassy on September 19, 2015, 05:43:41 AM
Im wainting to know the price, it seems that will be the last thing that is announced, or someone already know the price?
Even folks on the Fractal forum are still left to speculate about the price.

Elantric

#16
Certainly this provides an alternative to Helix - and its rumored AX-8 will be selling for the same price as Helix
http://forum.fractalaudio.com/axe-fx-ii-discussion/104420-ready-amp-show.html

Cliff wrote>
Ready for the (L.A.) Amp Show




FWIW - I will be at the Los Angeles Amp Show next weekend

http://www.ampshow.com/

DF400

Steve, I hope you have a chance to check out the AX8 and give your impressions. i have high hopes. A fellow guitarist and friend said the new Quantum firmware upgrade made a notable improvement on the sounds in his AxeFx II XL, especially the clean tones. I'm wondering if this unit will use the Quantum modeling upgrades. I'm not so concerned about two amp or cabs in a given patch, but hopefully the processing power will allow for the upgrade.

Another curiosity is whether they will soon update the form factor or the AxeFx series.

jassy

Quote from: DF400 on September 27, 2015, 07:30:53 AM
A fellow guitarist and friend said the new Quantum firmware upgrade made a notable improvement on the sounds in his AxeFx II XL, especially the clean tones. I'm wondering if this unit will use the Quantum modeling upgrades. I'm not so concerned about two amp or cabs in a given patch, but hopefully the processing power will allow for the upgrade.

It was answered before:

"AX-8 and Axe-Fx II share the same code base so any updates to the Axe-Fx II apply to the AX-8." http://forum.fractalaudio.com/axe-fx-ii-discussion/103735-axe-fx-ii-quantum-rev-1-00-public-beta-13.html#post1241527

And if you read the source the response was referring to the same question that you have made about the new Quantum firmware.

Elantric

http://www.thegearpage.net/board/index.php?threads/fractal-ax8-teaser-video.1624284/

Mark Day wrote>
Here is a demo of Fractal Audio's AX8 Guitar Processor. All guitars are AX8. The guys at work helped me with this one. Matt Picone played all keyboards and bass, Joe Rogers played drums and I played all guitar parts and sang all the vocal parts(well Eli makes a brief appearance too).

Toto tune Lovers In The Night.



jassy

And the price is:

$1399
Waiting list opens this week.
Units should start shipping before end of month.

germanicus

Helix vs this.

Tough choice.

The Helix is available cheaper at the moment with big box retailers and 15-20% rebates.
I don't think you can get a rebate from FAS?

Comparing:

Both run same chipsets.

Helix has VDI (big deal for me) and USB reamping. Can process multiple paths and inputs (up to 4 amps).

AX8 has top of the line Fractal modeling quality.
AX8 needs expression pedal. No dual amps.

Price is close enough to one another.

Need to hear and use both!

Choices are nice!

My albums done with modeling/guitar synth at http://music.steamtheory.com

JTV69/59P/Godin LGXT/Multiac ACS/Variax 700 AC
Helix/FTP/GP10/VG99/SY1000
Traynor k4

guitarno

Quote from: jassy on October 04, 2015, 04:17:41 PM
And the price is:

$1399
Waiting list opens this week.
Units should start shipping before end of month.

Wow! Didn't expect this to come in at this price. :o I thought it would be at least $300-$400 more. Competitive pricing indeed. ;D

Quote from: germanicus on October 04, 2015, 08:01:48 PM
Helix vs this.

Tough choice.

The Helix is available cheaper at the moment with big box retailers and 15-20% rebates.
I don't think you can get a rebate from FAS?

Comparing:

Both run same chipsets.

Helix has VDI (big deal for me) and USB reamping. Can process multiple paths and inputs (up to 4 amps).

AX8 has top of the line Fractal modeling quality.
AX8 needs expression pedal. No dual amps.

Price is close enough to one another.

Need to hear and use both!

Choices are nice!

Yes choices are very good, but this makes it a little harder to decide between these two units. I never expected them to be priced so closely.
It will be very informative to hear and see some demos & comparisons between the two from the amp show and in the coming week as helix's make there way into more people's hands and more user reviews begin to be posted.

I will be following this intently... 8)
Suhr Classic Pro SSS, PRS Hollowbody II Piezo, Breedlove Oregon Concerto E, Fractal FM3, Mesa Boogie LoneStar Special

mbenigni

Wow, $1399 is a very good price for the AX8!  Has anyone heard whether the FX8's price will drop?  I have to imagine some customers purchased FX8's assuming the AX8 would be significantly more expensive, and that a few are experiencing buyer's remorse now.

Panthersn

Interesting: 

QuoteStripped down effects section and smaller grid (4x8 vs 4x12)

Quote"It's pretty much "Axe-Fx Lite"

Quote. It's a stripped down floor version at an aggressive price

That might tilt decisions to the Helix, at $1,400 I don't want to feel I'm settling for less  ???

15 knobs and 8 buttons, that's got to set some sort of record (minus the ME80)  :o