Line 6 VDI Interface

Started by Elantric, January 30, 2015, 09:31:21 AM

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admin

#25

https://web.archive.org/web/20150810124803/http://bencraven.com/?p=1616
Variax MIDI breakout cable
Posted on April 13, 2015 by Ben
Got a Line 6 Variax you want to hook up to use the Workbench software, but don't own a POD device you can use as an interface to a PC?

Nope? Well it's my blog. And I'll probably forget how I did this if I don't post it here.

With a network cable, a couple of 5-pin DIN sockets, and just the right amount of electrical tape, I achieved the classy result you see below:


Variax Midi Cable

I borrowed this hard-to-find diagram from the internet
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=13484.0

and added pin numbers for MIDI sockets. I used sockets so I could connect it to one of those USB-MIDI cables on the run. You could just as easily use plugs. Just pay attention to the orientation of pins 4 and 5. I accidentally had them reversed at first and the result was not immediately spectacular. (Ignore the AES and 7V stuff.)



Voila! Line 6 Monkey and Variax Workbench now happily recognise my Variax 600 via MIDI cables.



http://www.epanorama.net/sff/Audio/Musical/Products/Line_6/Variax%20Service%20Manual.pdf




Jobol

Quote from: admin on November 28, 2018, 09:17:35 PM
http://bencraven.com/?p=1616

Voila! Line 6 Monkey and Variax Workbench now happily recognise my Variax 600 via MIDI cables.


I just want to make sure I understand something.

I have the JTV Variax but do not have the Workbench USB, or any other line 6 control device (POD, POD HD, Helix, etc.)

Would building this cable allow me to be able to control my Variax from the Workbench HD software and do all the manipulations, like updating firmware, uploading presets, and changing parameters? So even though I will be using the MIDI IN and MIDI out on my sound interface and not a USB port, the Workbench HD will still recognize my Variax with this cable?

Thanks.

sixeight

#27
The diagram seems to be missing one connection from pin 5 of midi in to pin 8 on the VDI connector. Unless Line6 skipped the optocoupler in the Variax or connected it to ground . Then that connection may not be necessary.

Jobol

I will shop for the parts, build it and report back.

I have a hard time imagining the Workbench HD application detecting the Variax if it is excepting it to be on a USB port.

TweakGeek

#29
I'm kind of in the same situation. I was trying to build something to control the JTV Variax via MIDI but made the breakout cable and had no luck with it. Checked and double checked all my connections but couldn't find anything wrong.

Once I build the breakout cable, am I supposed to send some sort of sysex message to the Variax in order to "engage" the software into receiving MIDI messages to change Variax models?

jimmyj

I finally got my diy Rackvax (Variax in a box) working after buying a 9 volt power supply and using my Brian Moore instead of a GK guitar. I was hoping I could plug it in the back of my VG99 for some of the effects but when I do it cuts out the mag pickups of my guitar. My question is if I make this VDI to midi cable can I just create the cable with the midi out plug and omit the midi in part ? I only want to change models with my midi controller so do I need both both midi in and out. Another question is if I only need the midi out plug then is it correct that I only need the two wires from the midi plug to the RJ-45 plug ?


jimmyj

The question may be a moot point anyway. I just connected the Rackvax to my computer using a JTV usb interface and it's not connecting. The red light is blinking on the guitar side of the adapter. I don't have the older interface but the newer interface, which is what I have, sold on Sweetwater states it works with all Variax guitars. So I guess I'll go ahead and create the cable with the midi in and out since on the bencraven site it states that you can connect to the workbench software via midi. The board in my Rackvax appears to be from a Variax 500 and there is a wire sticking up on the VDI circuit board that goes nowhere so I just hope that's not the problem or possibly the old Variax just used a plain RJ45 connection and the newer Variaxes use some sort on Ethercon connector which may be wired different. It sounds like no one on this site actually created this cable.

admin

#33
Quote from: jimmyj on March 26, 2019, 09:24:49 AM
The question may be a moot point anyway. I just connected the Rackvax to my computer using a JTV usb interface and it's not connecting. The red light is blinking on the guitar side of the adapter. I don't have the older interface but the newer interface, which is what I have, sold on Sweetwater states it works with all Variax guitars. So I guess I'll go ahead and create the cable with the midi in and out since on the bencraven site it states that you can connect to the workbench software via midi. The board in my Rackvax appears to be from a Variax 500 and there is a wire sticking up on the VDI circuit board that goes nowhere so I just hope that's not the problem or possibly the old Variax just used a plain RJ45 connection and the newer Variaxes use some sort on Ethercon connector which may be wired different. It sounds like no one on this site actually created this cable.


All Variax's employ the VDI cable and RJ45 Ethercon connector


Older Variax 300/500/600/700 had no mag PUs and no support for them

Only the Tyler, Shuriken, and New Variax Standard also provide a normal mag PU signal - which is A/D>DSP, then sent as AES/EBU via the Ethercon RJ45 jack and over the VDI cable 


Best to contact Corey at RackVax - with pics
http://www.rackvax.com/

http://www.rackvax.com/contact/

jimmyj

#34
After contacting Line support they stated that the new JTV adapter is supposed to work with the older Variax guitars so maybe this information will help someone else. They also stated that the connections were just RJ-45. I have tried to contact Corey at Rackvax several times over the past months and you can't send any messages now. I only paid about 300 for my Rackvax and the 12 strings, banjos and sitar are better than the VG99 so it's not a complete loss if I can't figure a way to connect to the Workbench software.  I was hoping to have only acoustic type models on the Rackvax and get rid of the electric models since I like those better on the VG99 so hopefully I can figure out someway to connect to the software.

admin

#35
Quote from: jimmyj on March 26, 2019, 02:57:21 PM
After contacting Line support they stated that the new JTV adapter is supposed to work with the older Variax guitars so maybe this information will help someone else. They also stated that the connections where just RJ-45. I have tried to contact Corey at Rackvax several times over the past months and you can't send any messages now. I only paid about 300 for my Rackvax and the 12 strings, banjos and sitar are better than the VG99 so it's not a complete loss if I can't figure a way to connect to the Workbench software.  I was hoping to have only acoustic type models on the Rackvax and get rid of the electric models since I like those better on the VG99 so hopefully I can figure out someway to connect to the software.


Remember if you have a Variax 500 DSP board inside your RackVax , then you can NOT use Workbench HD app.

Must use original Workbench app.
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=14429.0

https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/line-6-variax-workbench

jimmyj

#36
I constructed this cable and made sure the wiring was correct with the instructions in the photo. I can't get it to do anything with my Rackvax (variax 500 board). I have tried reversing the in/out midi cables with no effect. I did try connecting pin 8 on the RJ-45 and it did mess with some tunings on some of the models. I noticed some of the posts stated that they connected to a PC so is this the only way it works. I am trying to connect to my Liquidfoot midi controller. I can now get the Rackvax to connect to the Line 6 Workbench software so I know the VDI connection is good. I'm not the best at midi commands so I assume the Rackvax is on channel 1 and I don't see any way to change the channel. I used the Rackvax manual and tried to send a Program Change with the corresponding model number listed in the Rackvax manual so I assume you enter for instance 100 to 104 as the program change number for the five acoustic models. I really llike the Rackvax and I wished I had the midi connections like the original but I'm stuck with only the VDI. I'm blending the Rackvax with my VG99 and the acoustics blended on both units sound great but if I want to change patches on the VG99 I'm stuck with the Rackvax playing in the background. I was hoping to create a model on the Rackvax with no volume so when I change to a certain patch on the VG99 the Rackvax will go silent all via midi. I hope someone who successfully created this cable will chime in. For anyone who wants to create their own Rackvax in my opinion it's well worth the effort if you can still get the 13 pin adapters from the Rackvax site. I sold my JTV-59 and don't miss it at all. The Rackvax blended with the VG99 sounds far better on my system.
I've had no success contacting anyone at the Rackvax site.

admin

#37
Quote from: jimmyj on April 06, 2019, 06:50:34 AM
I constructed this cable and made sure the wiring was correct with the instructions in the photo. I can't get it to do anything with my Rackvax (variax 500 board). I have tried reversing the in/out midi cables with no effect. I did try connecting pin 8 on the RJ-45 and it did mess with some tunings on some of the models. I noticed some of the posts stated that they connected to a PC so is this the only way it works. I am trying to connect to my Liquidfoot midi controller. I can now get the Rackvax to connect to the Line 6 Workbench software so I know the VDI connection is good. I'm not the best at midi commands so I assume the Rackvax is on channel 1 and I don't see any way to change the channel. I used the Rackvax manual and tried to send a Program Change with the corresponding model number listed in the Rackvax manual so I assume you enter for instance 100 to 104 as the program change number for the five acoustic models. I really llike the Rackvax and I wished I had the midi connections like the original but I'm stuck with only the VDI. I'm blending the Rackvax with my VG99 and the acoustics blended on both units sound great but if I want to change patches on the VG99 I'm stuck with the Rackvax playing in the background. I was hoping to create a model on the Rackvax with no volume so when I change to a certain patch on the VG99 the Rackvax will go silent all via midi. I hope someone who successfully created this cable will chime in. For anyone who wants to create their own Rackvax in my opinion it's well worth the effort if you can still get the 13 pin adapters from the Rackvax site. I sold my JTV-59 and don't miss it at all. The Rackvax blended with the VG99 sounds far better on my system.
I've had no success contacting anyone at the Rackvax site.
Should be straight forward  9 read the RackVax Owners manual
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=3928.0

RACKVAX MIDI IN 5 pin DIN connected to your third party MIDi CIntrollers, or to a PC/MAC with MIDI to USB interface cable ( Roland UM-1 MK II)





The official 19" rackmount RackVax box has an additional internal  4 x 5 inch  "CPU Board"- which initiated data  communication to the Line-6 Variax 300/500/600/700 DSP board and acted as a MIDI interpreter and added new remote MIDI CC#messages exclusive to the RackVax CPU board  ( which AFAIK has never been sold to the public by Cory  - owner of RackVax)     - so those messages will not work for you.

I believe the crucial missing element is

the Variax DSP board will not respond to external MIDI Patch change messages  - until after it receives the special "wakeup" handshake SYSEX message stated at the bottom of this pic




SYSEX: F0 00 01 0C 07 00 2A F7

(if you had a Windows PC and Line-6 Workbench, you could monitor the MIDI I/O message traffic using a MIDI sniffer tool ( MIDI-OX, SENDSX, etc) - I bet you would see Workbench initiates MIDI communication using that MIDI SYSEX message 



Additional extended  MIDI CC# messages  stated in the back of the

RackVax Manual
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=13484.0;attach=18016

,  after MIDI CC#79) will never work on the stock Line-6 Variax + your Rackvax MIDI adapter board  - as you do not have the required RackVAX CPU board

Re read Ben Cravens site
http://bencraven.com/?p=1616

Variax MIDI breakout cable
Posted on April 13, 2015 by Ben
Got a Line 6 Variax you want to hook up to use the Workbench software, but don't own a POD device you can use as an interface to a PC?

Nope? Well it's my blog. And I'll probably forget how I did this if I don't post it here.

With a network cable, a couple of 5-pin DIN sockets, and just the right amount of electrical tape, I achieved the classy result you see below:


Variax Midi Cable

I borrowed this hard-to-find diagram from the internet and added pin numbers for MIDI sockets. I used sockets so I could connect it to one of those USB-MIDI cables on the run. You could just as easily use plugs. Just pay attention to the orientation of pins 4 and 5. I accidentally had them reversed at first and the result was not immediately spectacular. (Ignore the AES and 7V stuff.)


Variax Midi Wiring

Voila! Line 6 Monkey and Variax Workbench now happily recognize my Variax 600 via MIDI cables.

admin

Quote(Ignore the AES and 7V stuff.)

Note if you do not provide +7VDC on the VDI cable, you will not get power to the Variax DSP board using the cable alone

I understand Cory's breakout board you purchased provides a separate DC Power jack for a power source 

jimmyj

Thanks Elantric for your help.  So if I understand you correctly I need some sort of sniffer program such as Midiox to find out what midi messages are being transmitted and I also need to send the sysex command listed before anything will work. I read the bencraven site many times but since I know nothing about sysex I really didn't understand. I guess I'll be spending many hours trying to learn sysex commands. I wish Cory had sold the midi board which I would gladly have bought. I installed a 9 volt power adapter to my Rackvax instead of using a battery so do I still need the 7 volts applied to the board via the cable if so how would I access something that supplies the 7 volts ? One more question that might save me a lot of time is will a computer be the only way to change models on my Rackvax or will the Liquidfoot be able to do it and will it be a program change, control change or just sysex messages ? Like I said I'm not good at midi but I don't mind spending the time to learn.

Smash

There are TWO types of RJ45 cable. I found this out when I couldn't connect my variax to the USB dongle. Standard router cables don't work.

I found an old post about it on a forum but can't find now. The one that worked for me had red connectors, yellow connector types did not work

jimmyj

QuoteThere are TWO types of RJ45 cable. I found this out when I couldn't connect my variax to the USB dongle. Standard router cables don't work.

I found an old post about it on a forum but can't find now. The one that worked for me had red connectors, yellow connector types did not work
I read about this also when I couldn't get my Line 6 adapter cable to connect to USB. I had a newer adapter that came with a JTV variax so I thought that was the problem. I called Line 6 and the tech told me it was just a normal RJ45 so I believe for some reason some cables just don't fit properly so finally after pushing the cable all the way in on the VDI side the green lights all lit up and my variax board connected to my computer. Apparently even some Line 6 cables have trouble. Maybe Deoxit will help since this is an older board. I'll have to use my volt/ohm meter to make sure I'm getting continuity from the variax board side to the cable.

Smash

One types a crossover and one is normal - it's not the plug

admin

Use a normal Cat5 cable

Do not use a Cat-5 Crossover cable

Elektrotanya has schematic too

hcirig

Last week I bought a Variax 500. Yesterday I tried the cable diagram with no luck and I don't know if i'm missing something.

I powered the guitar with the AB cable, then connected the RJ45-Midi to an interface but Line 6 Monkey or the old Workbench doesn't see the guitar. I also tried connecting it using the midi ports on my HD500X as an interface (since the X model can't work with the old Workbench via the Variax port).

Is there maybe some configuration I have to do on the Monkey or the Workbench that i'm missing?

what about the sysex code? that's the only thing I don't understand on the diagram. Do I have to send that code in order to start the communication with the guitar?

admin

#45
QuoteI powered the Variax 500 guitar with the AB cable,

?? What is an AB Cable?
I assume you mean the Line 6 Variax Cabled Power Kit
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/VariaxPwrKit--line-6-variax-cabled-power-kit

  - must use 1/4" TRS cable (crucial) and Variax floor A/B box

Be sure the Variax Volume knob is set above "0"


Try it with the Variax 500 Internal  6 AA Battery pack 

Quotealso tried connecting it using the midi ports on my HD500X as an interface
HD500X will NOT work as a MIDi Interface - does not pass SYSEX data


Need a genuine USB <> MIDI Adapter from the list here
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=8393.0




AFAIK - The older HD-500 was the last Floor pedal that is VDI connection compatible with the Variax 500 - which requires the older Variax Workbench app

HD500X works with newer Tyler Variax and newer Variax Workbench HD app  - not the older Variax 300/500/600/700



Variax 500 latest firmware 3.10


Variax 500 latest Variax Workbench 1.75 ( note not compatible with HD500X )
https://line6.com/software/index.html

QuoteDo I have to send that SYSEX code in order to start the communication with the guitar?
Reports say yes

Myself I own a RackVax  - never built this cable

all User reports of "Success" with this DIY cable are strictly using this DIY cable to connect  Variax to the Line-6 Workbench App  - and I understand the Workbench App transmits the necessary "wakeup command
SYSEX: F0 00 01 0C 07 00 2A F7

hcirig

#46
Quote from: admin on April 24, 2019, 12:09:05 PM
?? What is an AB Cable?
I assume you means the Line 6 Variax Cabled Power Kit
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/VariaxPwrKit--line-6-variax-cabled-power-kit

  - must use 1/4" TRS cable (crucial) and Variax floor A/B box

Be sure the Variax Volume knob is set above "0"

Yes sorry, the cabled power kit. the guitar was connected to the amp (through the a/b box) and was sounding during all the tests I made.

I didn't know the HD500X doesn't work as a midi interface, but I used my other interface that I have used many times with midi keyboards to record, so i'm assuming that it should work. It's an Audiolink Midiplus 3. Not the best interface, I know.
https://www.amazon.com/midiplus-Audiolink-III-Audio-interface/dp/B00VHL5I2G

Just to let everything else clear, i'm connecting the midi in from the guitar to the out on the interface and the out to the in.

jimmyj

If I understand correctly you can only change models via SYSEX messages and not regular PC or CC messages.

admin

#48
Quote from: jimmyj on April 24, 2019, 01:06:46 PM
If I understand correctly you can only change models via SYSEX messages and not regular PC or CC messages.

Here is what is supposed to work

AFTER you transmit  necessary "wakeup command
SYSEX: F0 00 01 0C 07 00 2A F7

all User reports of "Success" with this DIY cable are strictly using this DIY cable to connect  Variax to the Line-6 Workbench App  - and I understand the Workbench App transmits the Wakeup SYSEX

(best copy I have - save and zoom in)


Old reference article from 2006

http://www.vettaville.nl/vvvetta25.html
In the latest Vetta II update, Version 2.5, a new unpublicized feature was added at request of some high profile artists. This feature allows a Vetta II amplifier to communicate with a Variax guitar wirelessly with some special cables, an off the shelf MIDI wireless system and an audio wireless system.



If this is what you would like to experiment with please read on.

Wireless communication between a Vetta and a Variax falls into the category of an "unsupported, use at your own risk" feature. (it's a category of one!)

Note: There is no intention on Line 6's part to offer a commercial solution for wireless communication between Vetta II and Variax guitar, however in the spirit of supporting the needs of our community Line 6 decided to share this bit of information with you.

While a VDI cable provides bi-directional communication between a Vetta and a Variax, the wireless link described on these pages and document provides one-way communication from Vetta to the Variax. This solution simply transmits Guitar Model patch change data, as well as tone pot data to the Variax, as they were programmed into the Vetta's patches, which must be done with a Variax connected to a Vetta with a VDI cable.



How / Why it works:

When the Variax is physically connected to the Vetta via the VDI cable, the Vetta reconfigures to accept digital audio and digital audio sync from the VDI interface. Vetta also received patch, patch name and tone pot information from the guitar whenever something is changed, that way it can store and recall the appropriate Variax information within it's own patch structure. Variax W/L (wireless) mode allows the Vetta to operate, (internal sync, analog input) without the Variax connected to the VDI connector, however it still send the Variax patch information out via the VDI connector whenever a Vetta patch is recalled.



Programming patches for use in the Variax W/L mode:

You must build your Vetta / Variax presets with the Variax W/L mode off, and with a VDI cable connecting the two products.
Once you presets are built, you can disconnect the Variax, connect up your wireless rig, and enable the Variax W/L mode.


How to set up your Vetta II and a Variax Guitar to operate wirelessly.

First you're going to need some things to get this all together. Here's a shopping list:

Vetta II with V 2.5 firmware and a Variax.
A Wireless MIDI solution, Line 6 tested the system with the MIDIJet wireless transceiver from Organworks. They also have a pro version with a longer range. Also CME recently announced the WIDI-X8.
Two special cables to adapt the MIDI cables to the VDI connectors on the Vetta and the Variax (schematics provided). You may want to ask your techie friend to help you out with this one. Basically, start with a Ethernet cable, a MIDI cable, a few simple electronic components ( 1x 1N5231 5.1V Zener Diode, 2x 220 Ohm 1% resistors) and a soldering iron...
An audio wireless to get audio signal from the Variax 1/4" output to the Vetta Input.
Loads of batteries for your Variax, the audio wireless pack, and the MIDI wireless transceiver.


Tech instructions:

Build the cables, mark the Vetta side cable with the extra electronic components: Vetta, mark the Variax Cable as well. The cables are not reversible, so please mark them to avoid confusion at critical moments in your performing career.


Vetta and Variax Wireless Diagram 1


Vetta & Variax Wireless Diagram 2


Putting it all together:

Connect the Vetta VDI to the MIDI wireless Transmitter with the VDI to MIDI adapter cable.
Connect the MIDI wireless receiver to the Variax with the MIDI To Variax VDI cable that you build.
Connect the wireless audio transmitter to the 1/4 connector on your Variax, and the audio wireless transmitter receiver to the 1/4 input on the Vetta.
Power it all up.
Set the Vetta's Variax W/L parameter to On, and you're all set.


So there you have it, everything you'll need to get your Vetta / Variax rig up and running wireless at a gig.

Note: This is an "unsupported" feature in Vetta, and yet it is something Line 6 wanted to share with the Vetta community.

A great source for advanced Vetta capabilities is the Vetta community that largely resides on the Line 6 forums, Institute of Noise and Vettaville.com and Vettaville.nl sites. Thanks go out to Line 6 for going the extra mile on this one.

Oh, and you want a .pdf to make your personal wireless system, no worries, just click here to download


jimmyj

Now If I understand correctly you only need to send the SYSEX message once to wake up the Workbench software and then you can use regular PC midi commands to change models. If that's correct my Liquid Foot controller can send SYSEX messages and I have the Rackvax manual which shows the midi commands for each model. I assumed you had to send a different SYSEX message for each model.