GR-50 - Got one coming...

Started by BROCKSTAR, January 22, 2022, 03:02:22 PM

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admin

#25
Perform a factory Reset-explained in Service Manual

http://www.synfo.nl/servicemanuals/Roland/ROLAND_GR-50_SERVICE_NOTES.pdf

BROCKSTAR


gumtown

Factory reset and re-load.
Also recommeded with Roland gear of that period, switch off the power, remove the battery, let the sesidual memory drain for 1 hour, then return the bsttery, power, then factory reset.
If the old battery was down, memory gets corrupted.
Free "GR-55 FloorBoard" editor software from https://sourceforge.net/projects/grfloorboard/

BROCKSTAR

Reset it a few times and it does the same thing each time

admin

#29
Quote from: gumtown on February 04, 2022, 12:15:36 PMFactory reset and re-load.
Also recommeded with Roland gear of that period, switch off the power, remove the battery, let the residual memory drain for 1 hour, then return the bsttery, power, then factory reset.
If the old battery was down, memory gets corrupted.

Perform above steps

But after all this  was brand new in 1991 -over 30 years ago

So it's likely to have bad electrolytic capacitors and a margininal power supply-common issue today

Often it's cheaper to find another as going rate is under $150 these days

A tech might want $200 to fix it -but then it would have extended life

Folks who use them do have them serviced by their favorite tech -some Roland Service Centers are better than others -but there will be cost to get it working

BROCKSTAR

#30
resetting it does nothing... and old battery and new battery both keep popping up with battery errors and everything else... so yeah that doesn't work, so probably bad capacitors or something else being weird.

It makes no sense that the LOW E string on both of my gk guitars would make the screen flash and sound lost.... or why some presets if you strum the strings it loses sound and reverts back to patch 1 etc...

Not worth getting it fixed at that kind of price.

admin

#31
Quote from: BROCKSTAR on February 04, 2022, 12:22:19 PM
resetting it does nothing... and old battery and new battery both keep popping up with battery errors and everything else... so yeah that doesn't work, so probably bad capacitors or something else being weird.

It makes no sense that the LOW E string on both of my gk guitars would make the screen flash and sound lost.... or why some presets if you strum the strings it loses sound and reverts back to patch 1 etc...

The low E presents the highest DSP /CPU  workload , marginal power supplies introduce memory R/W errors

Count the Capacitors -probably  $100 in parts, + 3 hours labor = ouch

BROCKSTAR

Quote from: admin on February 04, 2022, 12:25:06 PM
The low E presents the highest DSP /CPU  workload , marginal power supplies introduce memory R/W errors

I don't understand what you mean about power supply? The power supply is hard wired into the gr-50, can't change it.

admin

Quote from: BROCKSTAR on February 04, 2022, 12:26:30 PM
I don't understand what you mean about power supply? The power supply is hard wired into the gr-50, can't change it.

The internal power supply- most of the system CPU  is 5VDC

Study the GR-50 Service Manual
http://www.synfo.nl/servicemanuals/Roland/ROLAND_GR-50_SERVICE_NOTES.pdf

BROCKSTAR

Quote from: admin on February 04, 2022, 12:28:02 PM
The internal power supply- most of the system CPU  is 5VDC

Study the Servive Manual
http://www.synfo.nl/servicemanuals/Roland/ROLAND_GR-50_SERVICE_NOTES.pdf

I don't see how any of that is going to fix my problem though lol.

gumtown

Sounds like its a lemon,

Don't know if you let the memory drain for an hour before inserting the new battery,
that method cleans out any corrupted memory cells which might cause the operating system to do funky stuff,
even after a factory reset.

As Admin has said, a 30 year old device will have depleted electrolytic capacitors,
which cause all sorts of crazy issues with voltage sag from sudden or increased current use (in microscopic amounts).
They only remedy for that is a capacitor replacement (approx 30~40 items in a GR-50).

Maybe on sell the unit as faulty, others here more geared towards electronic skills might want to buy it.
Free "GR-55 FloorBoard" editor software from https://sourceforge.net/projects/grfloorboard/

BROCKSTAR

Here's the inside of it if anyone wants to see it for future reference etc..


admin



30 year old Electrolytic Capacitors to replace circled in blue


BROCKSTAR

Ok so i opened it and took battery out and let it sit for 1 1/2 hrs, put it back in and hooked it back up and still the same thing.

However I did find if I go to the "part" button and set strings to all the same sound and settings, i can navigate through all the sounds available on each string, therefore using it still somewhat but it's a pain in the butt once you go back to play mode and switch patch, then it goes all back to the weird craziness and have to go back and do it all over again...

So something else is corrupted again. Especially considering any patch I put in this thing via midi with midi-ox or bome, the letters come up in weird shapes or hour glasses etc lol.

BROCKSTAR

Another question... why do the names of presets not change when you upload more via sysex? The sounds change but the names of the presets remain the same no matter what you load into it?

admin

Quote from: BROCKSTAR on February 05, 2022, 12:29:11 PM
Another question... why do the names of presets not change when you upload more via sysex? The sounds change but the names of the presets remain the same no matter what you load into it?

Symptom of high power supply ripple current, from poor aged capacitors corrupting the write to SRAM memory, rendering Sysex messages as corrupt and  incomplete

The box draws highest supply current during Write to Memory

BROCKSTAR

Quote from: admin on February 05, 2022, 01:03:05 PM
Symptom of high power supply ripple current, from poor aged capacitors corrupting the write to SRAM memory, rendering Sysex messages as corrupt and  incomplete

The box draws highest supply current during Write to Memory

Is it dangerous to keep using?

admin

#42
Quote from: BROCKSTAR on February 05, 2022, 01:09:05 PM
Is it dangerous to keep using?

Yes, it may smoke additional components

plug in headphones, listen for high hum & noise

BROCKSTAR

#43
ok back to testing it and i don't think that's it... if i load the unit with .MID files of the original sounds or the sounds from the cards the names change fine...

The names only stay the same when loading presets via sysex files. So that tells me it's something to do with reading sysex files.

However I did make an error on resetting it. I was hitting the down arrow / ext / write buttons when it should have been up arrow / ext / write buttons and it reset it and been doing pretty good since, so we'll see how long before it messes up again... but I have been able to enjoy it for the time being (about 2 hours) and loading sysex presets and testing out sounds even if the name don't change (but the sound does).

BROCKSTAR

Ok so I need someone that actually has the unit to try this for me please.

Grab some sysex files from here in this gr-50 section and hook up midi in / out to your computer usb using a good midi to usb unit and load up a preset or few using midi-ox or bome program then go through some of the sounds. I just wanna see if the names of presets actually change for someone else or not. The sounds change for me but the names remain the same no matter what sysex file I put in. However if I play a .MID file into the gr-50 the names change.

gumtown

Not sure if it is to do with the different formats, where *.syx files transfer at 31.250kb/s and *.mid is used through a midi song file player at a slower regulated speed.
Free "GR-55 FloorBoard" editor software from https://sourceforge.net/projects/grfloorboard/

BROCKSTAR

Quote from: gumtown on February 06, 2022, 12:33:50 PM
Not sure if it is to do with the different formats, where *.syx files transfer at 31.250kb/s and *.mid is used through a midi song file player at a slower regulated speed.

Hmm you may be onto something. I just wanna see someone else do it so I can confirm it's not just me :D

BROCKSTAR

Anyone know of an editor for the roland gr-50 that'll work on windows 10? Not looking for something to buy, or some ipad / phone app. Need something for a computer with windows 10?

chrish

#48
Quote from: BROCKSTAR on February 06, 2022, 05:14:45 PM
Anyone know of an editor for the roland gr-50 that'll work on windows 10? Not looking for something to buy, or some ipad / phone app. Need something for a computer with windows 10?
nothing that works. There is a roland hardware editor to look out for as I do see them every now and then for sale.

Only software editor available.

https://www.squest.com/Products/MidiQuest12/Instruments/RolandGR-50

Haven't heard good things about it.


One person was asking for opinions on which old synths to write some phone editor software.

https://coffeeshopped.com/patch-base/editor/roland/gr-50

Here's a thread to read

https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=24093.0

BROCKSTAR

#49
I thought I seen somewhere about using a roland d-110 editor but can't seem to find where I read it

May have been this one but not sure yet...

https://www.gearnews.com/edisyn-synth-patch-editor-covers-over-60-synthesizers-for-free