Antares Luthier kit with Quicco Sound mi.1 Bluetooth MIDI

Started by cags12, October 12, 2017, 03:37:22 PM

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cags12

After some reverse engineering of the ATG DSP board and correlating my findings with the Official MIDI specification update (2014), I identified the reason as to why some users were unable to use the Quicco Sound mi.1 and Yamaha wireless MIDI BLE adapters with their Luthier Kit.

The DSP board DOES provide enough power ~22mA @ 5v on the MIDI OUT. However, the "ground" line (purple wire) depicted in the Installation manual is NOT directly connected to ground but to a capacitor as optionally recommended by the official MIDI specification. This is to improve resistance to RF interference (see image below).



To making the BLE MIDI adapters work, you will need to establish a direct ground connection. Luckily, pin 8 of the MIDI of the connector to the DSP is a true ground connection. You can use this or any other ground point. 



Do this and Voila. No major hack and no hassle.

I installed the mi.1 internally on my guitar and tested functionality with my iPhone and to Windows 10 with CME Widi-Bud. PC and CC messages work great with long range despite being inside the guitar.

On Windows I still cannot use the Settings manager because the built-in Windows MIDI driver truncates long SysEx messages. It should work fine with MAC. I will investigate if there is any patch or settings on Windows to allowing long SysEx messages.

Btw. Regardless of the issue with Windows. The Widi Bud works great and connects automatically to the mi.1 within 2 seconds of either of the two devices being powered on. This is excellent for my planned installation with a USB to MIDI adapter to my MIDI foot controller. is truly plug and play.

UPDATE:
Using CME's WIDI Master BLE adapter solves all the issues with the settings manager. You can now connect wireless to use Settings Manager with no issues since CME's adapter is much more reliable and have a large Sysex buffer. Also Windows 10 has improved its MIDI over Bluetooth support

cvsucu

cags12 - you are a genuis!!!
I could hug you now if you were here :-)

I have been trying to figure out how to get Quicco to work with my ATG for the last week or so... with no luck.
Exchanged some emails with the Japanese guys - no luck.
Tried to provide power from a 5 or 3.3V power adapter, as per their recommendation - no luck.
I only managed to make it work (and boy, it works beautifully) by connecting the IN Quicco half to my Casio Piano and the OUT Quicco part to my 8 pin ATG connector.
Which of course makes me tethered to my piano - not ideal :-)

And now - such a simple hack of the DSP and we can use this amazing little thing to be completely wirelessly controlling our ATGs from iPphones/iPads?
Crazy good. Crazy good!!!

I am not an electronics guru (neither handicapped), so I would like to ask for a bit more guidance.
Could you kindly share some pics with the exact installation you achieved with the Quicco and the connections you made between it and ATG?

So you don't actually plug the Quicco in the 8 pin connector at all? You have the device totally inside the guitar?
The actual change is that you solder wires between these points - from the Quicco pins to the ATG 8 pins?
This is on the inside? - so the port remains empty from the outside?

By the way, I have just posted my attempt to an iPhone MIDI Guitar template, if you didn't have and needed one.

Many thanks, you made my week, let alone my day ;)

Brgds,
Cris

cags12

Quote from: cvsucu on October 12, 2017, 09:19:31 PM
cags12 - you are a genuis!!!
I could hug you now if you were here :-)

I have been trying to figure out how to get Quicco to work with my ATG for the last week or so... with no luck.
Exchanged some emails with the Japanese guys - no luck.
Tried to provide power from a 5 or 3.3V power adapter, as per their recommendation - no luck.
I only managed to make it work (and boy, it works beautifully) by connecting the IN Quicco half to my Casio Piano and the OUT Quicco part to my 8 pin ATG connector.
Which of course makes me tethered to my piano - not ideal :-)

And now - such a simple hack of the DSP and we can use this amazing little thing to be completely wirelessly controlling our ATGs from iPphones/iPads?
Crazy good. Crazy good!!!

I am not an electronics guru (neither handicapped), so I would like to ask for a bit more guidance.
Could you kindly share some pics with the exact installation you achieved with the Quicco and the connections you made between it and ATG?

So you don't actually plug the Quicco in the 8 pin connector at all? You have the device totally inside the guitar?
The actual change is that you solder wires between these points - from the Quicco pins to the ATG 8 pins?
This is on the inside? - so the port remains empty from the outside?

By the way, I have just posted my attempt to an iPhone MIDI Guitar template, if you didn't have and needed one.

Many thanks, you made my week, let alone my day ;)

Brgds,
Cris

Thanks man, I am just simply very stubborn and did not want to give up using the mi.1. I am like you, not an electronics guro at all, but neither handicapped and consider myself a logical person. You will see a few of my posts asking very noob questions about electronics.

I will post specific pictures of my installation when I get home. It is a bit messy right now because I received my mi.1 yesterday and I just rushed to get it up a running. I will work in the following days for a more "nice" installation.

You are correct, the 8 Pin DIN connector is not used as described in the Installation manual or how the AT-200 ships. As you may know the 8 Pin DIN connector is a workaround to not have two separate IN/OUT connectors to save space. If you think of the 8 Pin DIN connector as a "basic" 5 pin DIN, or you only connect a regular 5 pin MIDI cable; The standard pinouts will serve only as MIDI IN. This means that the mi.1 will not turn on because it will not find the right pins with power (regardless of the hack described in my initial post).

There are few options for this installation, I chose internal that required extra DIN connectors with the pin outs as described in the second picture of my initial post. I used the 8th pin (ground) (originally not connected) of the connector that goes to the DSP to Pin 2 of the DIN connector. But you can also opt to take the ground connection from any other point like the tone pot case, etc.
In addition to this I used a third DIN connector that is accessed externally on the jack plate for phantom power. The next step I will look at is to have this also wired for MIDI as backup connection.

Another option is to use an external Y cable. For this option you will need to arrange all the DIN connector pins accordingly and more importantly, provide the true ground connection as I mentioned above which ultimately is the "Hack".

cvsucu

Thanks a lot for the details man.
I will be waiting to see your pics before I get down to doing mine.
I definitely would also like to place the two buds inside the guitar - it would be the neatest setup of all.
I checked and there is enough space without squeezing anything too much.

Are you saying that with this setup we would be able to interact both ways (IN and OUT) with ATG via the Quicco's BLE?

I am going today to buy two female 5 PIN connectors and some coloured wires to be ready for soldering.
So basically I am thinking to keep the 8 PIN connector as it is and solder the 6 wires onto the respective PINs as per your scheme, connect Quicco's two Male 5 PIN connectors to the bare female ones and solder away.
Does this make sense?

What do you mean by this " The next step I will look at is to have this also wired for MIDI as backup connection"? - sorry if the question is stupid.


admin

You will need a genuine wired MIDI connection to use the Antares Setup / patch librarian app, where MIDI  SYSEX is employed, and Wireless Bluetooth MIDI hardware tends to not support long SYSEX data streams   - so dont eliminate the ability for a genuine 5 pin MIDI I/O hardware interface connection to a PC/Mac

I understand the Ipad MIDI  Designer app with ATG template  ( the principal use for the Quiccosound m.1. wireless MIDI )  only supports a one way MIDI connection. In other words,  if you start changing the Antares controls on  the guitar, the Ipad MIDI  Designer app with ATG template will be out of sync

Suggest study this post

QuiccoSound mi.1 Bluetooth MIDI Controller with Antares Luthier Kit
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=11231.msg127213#msg127213




whippinpost91850


Elantric

Quote
By the way, I have just posted my attempt to an iPhone MIDI Guitar template, if you didn't have and needed one.

YEs please share! send me a PM

cags12

Quote from: cvsucu on October 13, 2017, 06:54:27 AM
Thanks a lot for the details man.
I will be waiting to see your pics before I get down to doing mine.
I definitely would also like to place the two buds inside the guitar - it would be the neatest setup of all.
I checked and there is enough space without squeezing anything too much.

Are you saying that with this setup we would be able to interact both ways (IN and OUT) with ATG via the Quicco's BLE?

I am going today to buy two female 5 PIN connectors and some coloured wires to be ready for soldering.
So basically I am thinking to keep the 8 PIN connector as it is and solder the 6 wires onto the respective PINs as per your scheme, connect Quicco's two Male 5 PIN connectors to the bare female ones and solder away.
Does this make sense?

What do you mean by this " The next step I will look at is to have this also wired for MIDI as backup connection"? - sorry if the question is stupid.

Quote from: whippinpost91850 on October 13, 2017, 12:37:46 PM
I'ld love to see some pictures as well

As promised.




As I said, this is a temporal installation. My AT-200 serves as a Lab Guitar. (Noticed I left the stock 8 Pin MIDI connector loose inside the guitar.)

Quote
Are you saying that with this setup we would be able to interact both ways (IN and OUT) with ATG via the Quicco's BLE?

Correct, IN and OUT are functional with this arrangement. ATG send PC via Quicco's BLE. As for the ATG Settings Manager, if you have a MAC, it is most likely it will work. On Windows, its built-in MIDI driver won't allow large MIDI SysSex. I am still looking for a solution to this. I contacted CME to see if they have an optional driver for the Widi-Bud that overcomes this limitation. In the meantime, I am upgrading to Windows 10 Anniversary update which added support to BLE MIDI to see if there is any change.

QuoteWhat do you mean by this " The next step I will look at is to have this also wired for MIDI as backup connection"?
I mean that instead of having a dedicated Wireless MIDI solution, I'd also like to have the wired standard one as backup.

The issues I see with this for the moment is the fact that if you connect via cable (Standard way) and you keep the Quicco connected (Internally), you may cause an issue with the voltage input of the MIDI input as you would be connecting two separate sources of 5V in parallel. I mentioned I am not either an electronics guru so I do not really know if this would pose an issue. If anyone else can advise on this. I would appreciate it.

An alternate solution to this is to NOT connect the +5V (MIDI IN +) coming from the cable (similar to the solution proposed by QuiccoSound when not enough power is present on the OUT connector).

cags12

QuoteBy the way, I have just posted my attempt to an iPhone MIDI Guitar template, if you didn't have and needed one.

Quote from: Elantric on October 13, 2017, 12:47:29 PM
YEs please share! send me a PM

Please share with me too.

Elantric

QuoteThe issues I see with this for the moment is the fact that if you connect via cable (Standard way) and you keep the Quicco connected (Internally), you may cause an issue with the voltage input of the MIDI input as you would be connecting two separate sources of 5V in parallel. I mentioned I am not either an electronics guru so I do not really know if this would pose an issue. If anyone else can advise on this. I would appreciate it.

Correct - you will want to remove the Quiccosound before you connect the hardware 5 pin MIDi I/O connection

whippinpost91850


cvsucu

Cags, thanks a ton.
This is almost how I pictured it in my head as well after reading your post.
If I read the pics correctly, you went with wires straight from the PCB connector to Quicco.
Your stock 8 Pin connector only has two wires going to the PCB?
Mine has all 8 connected. This is maybe because I am using the Luthier Kit and you are using the AT-200?

I am thinking to solder the 6 wires recommended by you from the 8 PINs to Quicco. Any objection with that approach?
I am going to try and do this today and report back my success... hopefully :-)

Best,
Cris
.............

QuoteYEs please share! send me a PM

QuotePlease share with me too.

Gents, please find below the link on the MiDI Designer Forum with the iPhone template.
I will also add a few more variations which came out from Thomas Nordegg's requests - with all CAPS and the Pitch Shift slider included in the Main Page (squeezed in).

http://mididesigner.com/qa/6259/sharing-antares-template-iphone-potentially-other-models

cags12

QuoteIf I read the pics correctly, you went with wires straight from the PCB connector to Quicco.
I did not go directly to the Quicco. I go directly from the PCB connector to a female DIN connector where the Quicco connects to. It could be seen as "straight" but just wanted to be super clear that I am not soldering anything to the Quicco's.

QuoteYour stock 8 Pin connector only has two wires going to the PCB?
Mine has all 8 connected. This is maybe because I am using the Luthier Kit and you are using the AT-200?
My stock 8 Pin DIN connector is not in use. Notice it laying down disconnected next to the Tone POT. I left it in there because it is soldered to the Vol Pot for Audio Out (this is stock in the AT-200) and also to reverting back to full stock. The Quiccco ultimately will not live in this guitar but in another that is not ready for prime time.

I am using the wiring harness that comes from a separate Luthier Kit I have. The 2 Blue and Green wires in the 3rd DIN (spare) connector are for phantom power and is mounted in the Jack plate so I can access it externally for operating with the AT-200B breakout box.

QuoteI am thinking to solder the 6 wires recommended by you from the 8 PINs to Quicco. Any objection with that approach?
This approach would be fine as long as you never connect any MIDI Interface externally while the Quicco is still plugged in. See my last comments of my previous post. If you want to avoid mistakes, I recommend you going with my approach (for the time being - until I find a better solution) or simply do not make your stock connector available externally. In addition to this, the true ground connection must come from somewhere else. The suggested installation in the luthier kit does not connect the 8 Pin connector to true ground.


cvsucu

It works  :)
Fantastic achievement - never actually hoped to have such a perfectly wireless setup.

I just need to get a better battery autonomy - maybe a Big Joe battery, as recommended by Thomas - and I am all set :-)

I only have one problem after all this - my Line6 G10 wireless system doesn't work anymore when ATG is enabled.
It must be one of the Ground links that the new setup brought which doesn't sit well with this transmitter.
The OUT jack works fine when I switch off ATG via the G10, but goes mute when I put it ON. It used to work fine before this mod.
I am not sure what happened - any help is welcome.
The main difference with your setup is that my PCB socket doesn't have a black wire coming out of it.
However, the 8 pin connector does have a black wire going straight to a Ground (real ground? - screwed with a screw).

And as I said, all 8 pins are linked with their respective wire/colours back to the PCB (with the exception of the Black, as described).

Here are some pics - messy, but it works. I am having some trouble fitting the Quicco buds inside smoothly, but I will keep on looking to make my way through the many wires and hope to finalise this soon:









Many thanks again cags  ;)

cags12

Quote from: cvsucu on October 14, 2017, 10:28:04 AM
It works  :)
Fantastic achievement - never actually hoped to have such a perfectly wireless setup.

I just need to get a better battery autonomy - maybe a Big Joe battery, as recommended by Thomas - and I am all set :-)

I only have one problem after all this - my Line6 G10 wireless system doesn't work anymore when ATG is enabled.
It must be one of the Ground links that the new setup brought which doesn't sit well with this transmitter.
The OUT jack works fine when I switch off ATG via the G10, but goes mute when I put it ON. It used to work fine before this mod.
I am not sure what happened - any help is welcome.
The main difference with your setup is that my PCB socket doesn't have a black wire coming out of it.
However, the 8 pin connector does have a black wire going straight to a Ground (real ground? - screwed with a screw).

And as I said, all 8 pins are linked with their respective wire/colours back to the PCB (with the exception of the Black, as described).

Here are some pics - messy, but it works. I am having some trouble fitting the Quicco buds inside smoothly, but I will keep on looking to make my way through the many wires and hope to finalise this soon:

Many thanks again cags  ;)

Great you got it working!!

You have the same set-up I am pursuing as well, I am just about to order a G10 too.

Let me try to help with the G10 issue, the troubleshooting will help in my own project.

Does the G10 goes to "charging" mode when ATG is ON or you just simply lose audio?

If it goes to charging mode, then your ground connection is causing the issue. In this case, please explain more detailed how you connected the new ground to the Quicco.

If it simply goes mute, then I suspect Quicco is causing interference, remember that Bluetooth and the G10 both operate in the 2.4 Ghz frequency. In this case, try the following: Switch ON ATG with a regular Mono cable, then dock the transmitter to the G10 receiver for 10 seconds so they select a new clean channel (hopefully one that does not conflict with Quicco) and then test if now you have audio. Remember that the Quicco must be ON while you make the new channel selection of the G10. I suggest also having the guitar close to the G10 Tx/Rx while the channel selection.




cags12

BTW.

The black ground wire you see in my set up I took it from an extra wiring harness of the encoders that comes with the luthier kit. I just simply coupled it with the 8Pinn connector that goes to the DSP board.

Some question to you:

How are you planning to be able to create presets with the ATG preset manager? Will you open the cavity and disconnect the bluetooth adapter every time you need to do this?

I am intrigued by that switch you have attached to the cavity cover, what do you use it for? could you share that part number and better picture? it can be used to disconnect the Quicco adapter with a flip of a switch when you need to connect via cable.

QuoteI just need to get a better battery autonomy - maybe a Big Joe battery, as recommended by Thomas - and I am all set :-)
What battery are you referring to?


cvsucu

Ok, one by one I will try to address all your questions/suggestions:

-The G10 can only be charged in its dock. Maybe you mean "paired" (or whatever it's called) mode - when the transmitter is out of its dock and plugged into a guitar.

-Yes, it is in that mode, even when ATG is ON, as the little led lights green, just like in any normal operation with it.

-This is a great little wireless system. However, I've been having trouble with it working with ATG. And now, recalling this, I believe the G10 DID NOT WORK WITH ATG ON even before this wiring. So all's good. ATG works perfectly fine if I use a normal cable - AND, most importantly, it works with my other wireless baby - the Samson AG1 (which is amazing, as the receiver can also work on a 9V battery). It's discontinued now though and Samson has not replaced it with anything sadly.
http://www.samsontech.com/samson/products/wireless-systems/airline/airline-ag1/

It does work with my Line6 JTV 69 guitar, both in Modelling mode and in normal mode, without having to unplug it, when I switch between the two modes.... well, I guess being both from the same manufacturer, they did think of the compatibility, which is laudable.
After months of research, Line6 support refusing to think out of the box to help me, I finally found the issue when Henrik of Antares suggested I tried a Stereo to Mono converter - and it does work.
Seems like the G10 is a stereo jack and ATG is confused by it.
Using a converter is fine, but looks odd and is a bit too long of a thingie hanging out of my guitar out Jack ;-)
I am speaking to Henrik of Antares to see if there is any other way... if not, there you have it - G10, either with a converter or not at all.

-I do not own an AT-200B box yet - have just ordered one from Thomann now.
So I did not think of how I will be using the 8 pin connection hereafter.
But now that I am getting the 200B box, I have to and please share with me your thoughts?
Will there be an issue if I don't disconnect Quicco? What may happen - worse case scenario?
If I only use the 200B for providing power to the ATG, and NOT for MIDI purposes, do I still have to be concerned about switching off Quicco?
If it is really a problem, I would have to find a way to easily connect and disconnect Quicco (a switch?), without opening the lid, etc.

-I am not sure why I would need to use Software Manager for presets.... Oh, you mean if I need more than 12, that is?
(since 12 or so can be saved and recalled using Fret Control, the Encoders and the iPad/iPhone MD template).
Good question, but I never thought that far - needing more than 12 presets.
In that case, as you rightly point out, it's better and most elegant to find an easy way to switch off the Quicco connection.
Let me know if you have some ideas here.

-The switch you see there is part of my special setup on this guitar - or a SUPER guitar, as Thomas Nordegg would call it.
It is a Gibson LP Studio, with min-e Tune robots (Tronical).
Michael Spalt from Vienna (one of the best Luthiers known to man) installed my ATG kit together with two other systems - a distortion with 5 levels and a Sustainiac pickup/control.
An all-in-one monster of a guitar :-)
The only thing missing is an attached speaker, which is why I can't wait for this to be ready for shipping:
https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/jamstack-the-world-s-first-attachable-guitar-amp-music#/

Hm... and a wireless headset microphone receiver... I was hoping the Jamstack will have an Aux IN port so that I can use my super-tiny-but-great Samson Airline Micro... but it won't have one in this first iteration.
http://www.samsontech.com/samson/products/wireless-systems/airline-micro/airlinemicroearset/

Which is why, probably the Fusion Guitar (ordered two days ago) is the next best thing... or maybe even on par... as it has the iPhone integration, enabling you to create amazing sounds, record, play along with backing tracks, etc, via its in-built great speakers.
And it does seem to have an AUX IN, letting me connect my wireless microphone on top.
Fingers crossed.
Of course, this won't have ATG... can't seem to ever have it all, Uffff... it's never-ending for crazy people like me :-)... However, Thomas and I are talking to the Fusion Guitars makers to see if there is enough space inside the guitar for the ATG PCB and guts.
Fingers crossed again.

-The power pack is to enhance my wireless time.... currently, not more than 2-3 hours with the default 4x AA battery setup.
As admsustainiac sent you, this is the mother of all packs, according to Thomas:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DE8KNEW/_encoding=UTF8?coliid=I2ZOPII9L9SAEH&colid=QQY2ZT13QRV9
It will have to sit externally unfortunately, as it is quite bulky (at least compared with 4 AAs) ... as I am not routing my guitar any further - it's already quite hollow :-)

Best and let's keep this going ;-)

cags12

Hey Cristian, btw I am also Christian :) - I have the solution for you.

- When I  meant the G10 going into "charging" mode was that the G10T gets confused and think it is on the charging Dock. If you have not, read this article to understand fully the known issues with the G10: http://line6.com/support/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_id=4210

ATG can be considered as one of those systems with "sophisticated" methods for turning ON (like mentioned in the PDF above). ATG uses a "soft" power on pulling up a wire to 5v (this is in the installation manual). This causes the G10T sensing this 5V and thinking it is plugged to the the Dock station.

Solution?:
The easy one: Do not use the Stereo Jack for switching ON ATG and wire the Battery return cable that connects to the Ring of the TRS connector directly to any other ground point. i.e. the sleeve`. Or use the fancy method Antares suggests installing JP1 on the Tone Pot. Drawback? if the tone switch is pushed down on your guitar case, it will drain your batteries.
The nicer one: Use a separate ON/OFF switch attached to your cavity cover (the same way as your other switch) and wire the return battery and a ground connection to the switch. If you use a DPDT ON/OFF/ON you can even wire the Quicco to it. ON(ATG+QUICCO)/OFF(ALL OFF)/ON(ATG only). This way you can solve two issues at the time.
The clever one:Use a 9 Lug Jack (Stereo DPDT Jack) like this one: http://www.stewmac.com/Pickups_and_Electronics/Components_and_Parts/Jacks/9-lug_Stereo_Jack.html 
It has two isolated switches. You can use one of them to switching ON ATG when inserting the G10T or regular mono cable. The important part is "ISOLATED" the switch will engage without doing any electrical connection through the inserted jack. This is the method I will use ultimately.

Any of those option will solve the issues. Still, the other question remain on, does Quicco and G10 cause interference with each other? maybe try with the ugly mono adapter and tell me before I order the G10.

- The issues caused by connecting the AT-200B and Quicco at the same time are unknown and unexpected. In theory, you could end up providing two separate sources of 5V into the MIDI IN circuit, this could cause unexpected issues or nothing at all. You might want to test or simply use a separate switch as described above.
If you only want to provide power, and only power, you can wire the external connector as I did with only the two wires that provide power. You can extend the functionality to also wire the audio out as it is done in the At-200 as stock. meaning that when you are connected to the AT-200B you can also send audio through it.

- The Software manager allows you to create more accurately and easily presets. You can of course set the preset once and off you go and forget about the Software manager. However, in my case, I would like to tweak a rearrange presets depending on my needs. For this the Software manager is a must.
Also, now that you have MIDI connectivity you can access +60 presets easily that were not accessible via fret or encoder control.

- Can you point me to that Distortion system of yours? I want to take a peak, I was also thinking on adding embedded processing like you did.
Have you not considered the VOX Amplug? it is even small enough to go crazy and install internally and has aux in.

- I am curious of the exact part you used for switching on your cover plate. Please send a link where to get it.

- That power pack will give you even less autonomy, it is only 500ma, less than 2 hours of operation.
Look at this topic: https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=21889.0
and this: https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=20540.msg155651#msg155651

I personally would go for a 7.4v battery pack with a pair of Samsung NCR18650 cells rated at 3500mAH. It should give you ~13 hours of autonomy THEORETICALLY.
You can fit it inside you battery compartment (striping its guts)(the cells are bigger than AA batteries) and charge externally.

Look at my thread here. It's had some developments but when I have something to show I will update it further.
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=21555.0

cvsucu

You are really into this and too modest about your knowledge of electronics Christian... my hat off  8)
Where are you from and where do you live?
I'm from Romania and live in Abu Dhabi, UAE.

I will read your message in detail, try some stuff and come back to you.

-This is the on-board distortion I have:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B007XIW07S?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o09_s00

-I had seen the VOX Amplug, but never considered it as an on-board effect. But isn't this more or less for headphones use?
Instead, I have the Vox amPhones AC 30 for when I want to use headphones.

-I am not sure about the part used as a switch, as it was all done by Michael in Vienna. I could ask him, but he's a very busy man.
I will check if there's anything written on it to help you identify it.

-Why can't one use either Fret Control and/or Encoders to set the desired parameters and then save them via MIDI Designer/iOS device?... iso the more cumbersome (to connect at least) SM?

-I was also intrigued by the small amperage of the power pack.... but Thomas said you can play forever with it.
Anyone has experience with this in actual real world with ATG?
admsustainiac - would you kindly share?

In fact, I just ordered this yesterday:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B073FDG88G/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
thinking to cut a USB cable and use 9V to power ATG either via a 5 PIN connector or instead of the AA batteries?
Is this a stupid idea?
If it works better than the 4 AA, it's great, as it's nice and flat and can be easily attached somehow.

-Do you mean 2 of these placed in series?
https://www.amazon.com/Panasonic-NCR18650B-3400mAh-Rechargeable-Battery-Green/dp/B00DHXY72O/ref=pd_sbs_60_2?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B00DHXY72O&pd_rd_r=438P6NT4BPJKDM01JB7K&pd_rd_w=2l6M4&pd_rd_wg=yvJMv&psc=1&refRID=438P6NT4BPJKDM01JB7K
13 hours sounds good - even theoretically :-)

My cavity is 7.2x6.9x2.3cm
These batteries seem to be: 6.9 x 1,86cm, so height seems to be fine, but I am afraid that the 3mm in length difference may not be sufficient for the casing to fit?
Does this:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/7-4V-3400mAh-2S1P-18650-Li-Ion-Battery-Pack-PCB-protected-use-japan-Cells/32830066953.html?spm=2114.search0304.4.18.xxe7RS
paired with this:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B001BEXDRQ/_encoding=UTF8?coliid=I246NQRU4WGVPD&colid=QQY2ZT13QRV9
seem right?

How about these ones:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B002A31U04?psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B003SH4BV6?psc=1
Are they too much in terms of amps (4000 and 5000 mA)... or the more the merrier here? :-)
Would I need two packs of two batteries to reach to 7.4V? If yes, then they won't for for width.

Cheers,
Cris


cags12

I'm from Venezuela living in Ireland, nothing close to UAE.

- You can use Fret control yes, however only the Software Manager allows you to accurately set up the coefficients of the alternate turnings and doubling. If you use the out of the box alternate tunings then you are set. If not, then the Software manager is a must. I am waiting a reply from CME (manufactures of the Widi-Bud) as it seems this is the piece of hardware truncating the SysEx messages. More of this later when I have results.

- Thomas (Nordegg?) is a genius but I do n ot really understand why he says that. ATG consumes ~250mAh so you make the math.

- That power bank will give you great autonomy, not very "wireless" though. The only problem I see is that it uses a switching power supply to step-up the voltage, this introduces noise to the audio, the same noise you will experience with the AT-200B =/ . With a good Noise Gate you will not notice it.

- Do not buy the 18650 cells separately if you do not know what you are doing, they are unprotected and must be handled with much care. Use instead any of the battery packs on your links, the come with protection circuits already and are connected in series to give you the 7.4V.

- I am intrigued about those Tenergy 4000-5000 mAh. I thought the best you could get was Panasonic 3400mAh. Be careful though there are a lot of Chinese cells that calim to be unrealistic 5000-9000 mAh, they are B.S. However, Tenergy is a respectable manufacturer. Are they really Tenergy? Time to investigate further.

The more amps the merrier as long as they are good quality cells that deliver what they claim.

Please do come back on your results of the test with your G10 in terms of Interference.



cags12

No wait, those Tenergy are connected in Parallel, I thought they were is series.

Panasonic are still the best then. If you had the space 4 cells 2s2p would give you 7.4V 6800mAh.

GuitarBuilder

Quote from: cvsucu on October 14, 2017, 10:20:58 PM
-I do not own an AT-200B box yet - have just ordered one from Thomann now.
So I did not think of how I will be using the 8 pin connection hereafter.
But now that I am getting the 200B box, I have to and please share with me your thoughts?
Will there be an issue if I don't disconnect Quicco? What may happen - worse case scenario?
If I only use the 200B for providing power to the ATG, and NOT for MIDI purposes, do I still have to be concerned about switching off Quicco?
If it is really a problem, I would have to find a way to easily connect and disconnect Quicco (a switch?), without opening the lid, etc.

If you want to use the AT-200B, you will definitely need the 8-pin connection!  That is the only link to the box.  It is a convenient way to power the guitar without batteries.  However, you will have two cables coming out of the guitar at that point, since audio via AT-200B is not recommended.

The Quicco will still be OK if you connect the AT-200B; however at that point it makes more sense to connect your iPad via the MIDI connections on the box and not use the Quicco at all.

IMHO your best solution is to remove the 8-pin connector altogether and replace it with two 5-pin MIDI jacks.  You could plug the Quicco in externally and easily remove it if needed.  It also becomes easier to program the ATG using a standard MIDI-USB adapter.  The AT-200B box would not be needed.  You could add an external power pack on your guitar strap and wire it into your battery compartment, if desired.  Or, learn to change batteries after every few sets!

You didn't mention having encoders on the guitar - keep in mind that the wireless MIDI communication is one-way only!  If you make a change on the guitar, it will not be reflected on MIDI Designer.

"There's no-one left alive, it must be a draw"  Peter Gabriel 1973

cags12

Quote from: GuitarBuilder on October 16, 2017, 06:59:39 AM

The Quicco will still be OK if you connect the AT-200B.

You do not see issues with this? Specifically if you want to use the AT-200B with the MIDI connections? Or you meant only for phantom power as I mentioned in some earlier posts?

Quote from: GuitarBuilder on October 16, 2017, 06:59:39 AM
IMHO your best solution is to remove the 8-pin connector altogether and replace it with two 5-pin MIDI jacks.  You could plug the Quicco in externally and easily remove it if needed.  It also becomes easier to program the ATG using a standard MIDI-USB adapter.  The AT-200B box would not be needed. 
Totally agree with this approach if you are willing to drill another hole for the second connector.

admin

QuoteThe Quicco will still be OK if you connect the AT-200B.
For the Antares Luthier kit MIDI Out connection, you are allowed One connection - so its AT-200B or Quiccosound Mi.1 - but not both at same time