ROLAND - Internal GK-KIT-GT3 Installation questions

Started by chipstar, January 30, 2008, 01:40:21 PM

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RoC1909

Fantastic looking job on that Fredo! When I get my next guitar, I'll probably be going the GK-3 Internal route.

RoC

scarr

Quote from:  fredo on March 24, 2008, 11:53:25 AM
I just don't get why Roland made it that wide and why they do not put the "extra width" needed for the cable to go out on the other side. It would be much less bothering.
Since you can reverse the pickup direction on the VG-99, you can install the pickup upside down without any problem.  I did that on my Ravelle (with the external pickup) and it works very well.

fredo

Yes I hesitated about reversing the pickup, but did not wanted to take the risk since the documentation states that it has to be installed this way. I guess it is to stay compatible with older units (VG-8 / GR-33 ?) that may not have the "reverse pickup" parameter.

Anyway good to know that a reversed pickup works fine with the 99 !

prongs_386

Hey guys, sorry to bring up an old thread but i thought this would fit in nicely here.
I was wondering how well the gk3 external fits into most cases. Does the case need to be modified at all?
I think I should be right as my guitar has a thin body with a raised top.

chucky

Fredo,

The GK-3 install looks great.

I'm considering the internal kit as well.  I only see one of the switches installed on the top of the guitar.  Did you not install the up/down switches, LED, and GK volume?

I'm trying to map out the install for my Charvel strat-type guitar and wonder if all these switches are necessary.

Thanks,

fredo

Chucky,
Actually I placed an "on off on" switch for S1/S2, instead of the two ugly push-buttons provided by Roland. I also replaced the original tone control of the guitar by the GK-Volume. I did so to preserve the overall aspect of the guitar.
To me the led is useless as well as the guitar / mix / synth switch (since it only sets the GK-Volume to 0 on guitar position, and sets the guitar volume to 0 on synth position).
Fredo.

chucky

Just got my kit in the mail today.  I'm planning on installing it in a Charvel guitar that has active electronics (battery in body cavity).  Does anyone know if there are any issues with installing an internal GK-3 in a guitar with this type of pickups?

Thanks,

Elantric

Should work just fine - besure to retain the existing battery for your existing active electronics.

read the latest GK-3 Internal Install manual
ftp://ftp.roland.co.uk/ProductSupport/manuals/GK-KIT-GT3_OM.pdf

chucky

Thanks for the feedback.

I think the instructions I got with the kit are more current.  The footer on the last page says

03782690   08-02-03N

Elantric

Cool,

If you spot a difference  - post any changes you see, or better yet -if you could scan and make a pdf of your version and post it here.  The Internal GK-3 Kit Install manual has always been an elusive beast. I had to dig to locate a download-able version from the Roland UK web site. Most Roland Dealers are un aware this item actually still exists. 

chucky

I'm getting close to having my internal GK kit installed and want to install only the components that I need.

I'll be using the GK guitar primarily for live performance in a classic rock tribute band.  So I'll be using mostly the amp and effects models, with occasional guitar modeling especially for acoustics and alternate tunings.

I've played around with the display VG-99 at Guitar Center and the unit was not set up with any function for the Down/S1 and Up/S2 buttons.

What are these buttons for?  I've read that they can be used for changing virtual pickups and in reading what little mention of them is in the VG manual, sounds like they can be assigned to anything.

If I don't install them I will punch two less holes (actually one since I'll go with an on-off-on toggle per recommendations on this site) in my guitar but I don't want to pass on having them installed if there is some value for live performance.

Any feedback on how people are using these buttons and if they are worth installing will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

Charlie


Brent Flash

I would put them in. They are very useful. As you said you can assign them to almost anything like tap tempo, leslie fast/slow, pickup select, alt. tuning, etc.


dhaiphi


Darter

Oh my! I use mine for program up/down on one guitar and pickup bridge/both/neck (3-way/5-way switch). Scroll through the assignable uses via the system/ctl menus. Really, there are so many was to assign control functions to the sw1/sw2 that they are indispensable. You can control the ctl 1,2 of the FC300. Learn why they are there so they don't go unused but I can't imagine you won't like the options.
D.

Kostas Greece

You can do ANYTHING with s1, s2. Any assignment can be activated by these. Think them as controllers or as a switch as you can think the gk volume as an exp pedal. It's the same thing! We are talking about midi!!!

For example if I don't bring my fc-300 on a live performance, I use them as patch swiches, or add a little amount of volume for solo etc.
Most of the guitarists use it as virtual pickup switcher!

I suggest you to install them even if you don't use them. You will see in the future how usefull they are.
Fender American Lone Star Strat (HSS+floyd rose), Roland VG-99, FC-300, Roland GR-20

feloniouspunk

 :o  Install everything!  I use the S1/S2 all the time.  You will too! 
Lots of Gear. :)

cy2989

One option to think about is instead of two pushbutton switches you could install a single momentary contact double throw switch.  One position is up the other is down and center is the neutral point that the switch returns to.  That's the switch that the Graphtech system comes with.

Chris

VG-99, GR-20, GI-20, US-20
custom Parker Fly w/GK-3, custom Silent Guitar w/Ghost

RoC1909

As others have mentioned, they can be used for pretty much anything. I have mine set at the default where they control the UP and DOWN for patch selection.

RoC

Virtual Madness

#43
Hey Guys,
I'm trying to find some photos online of the step by step process (or any, really) of installing a GK-2A internal kit in a stock Strat..I know that the Roland Ready Fender Strat has a cover plate on the back of it for the Roland electronics, and i'm just wondering how the electronics fit if your Strat isn't routed for them like the Roland Ready Strat is...Thanks, Royce

P.S. Is there any reason why it would be better to use the GK-3 instead of the GK-2A with the VG-99?
in other words, do you lose any important functions by using the GK-2A?
The greatest power in the universe is imagination!

chipstar

Hey VM,
I have an internal GK-3 installed on a stock Strat HH but I don't have any photos of the install process. Regarding your P.S., the only difference in the GK-2A and GK-3 is the form factor and the pickup radius. There is no performance gain or loss. Best of luck.

later,
Chipstar

Virtual Madness

Thanks Chipstar for that info about the two GK pickups in regards to the VG-99, i wasn't really sure.

So it sounds like the roland electronics will fit inside a stock Strat without routing..boy am i happy to hear that!  :)
The greatest power in the universe is imagination!

chipstar

Yeah VM,
There's a guy at the Tampa Sam Ash that installs the mod board under the pickguard with no additional routing. My guys actually did create another cavity but he mangled the job and I had to have it repaired. Not cool.

later,
Chipstar

Elantric

And then there's the 13 pin output jack.

Every Strat install I have seen- this was the most daunting aspect of the job - cutting the side of the body for the 13 pin output.
Gk3 Kit install labor seems to vary a lot in each region. My local luthier charges $500 just for labor - go figure.


I know many who simply check Ebay each week for Roland Ready Strat - or Roland Ready Strat Body - then swap necks and stuff to build the perfect GK strat - then sell the excess.

Virtual Madness

Sorry to hear about the mangled job on your Strat Chipstar, I would be upset about that myself..

WOW Sustainiac, $500.00 LABOR!..Maybe I just don't understand what all has to be done, or how long it takes, but that price for labor alone seems awfully high!

If anybody else reading this thread has had their internal Roland electronics professionally installed,
what were your experiences like, and how much were you charged?

The Roland Ready Strat would be a perfect solution for me, but I have never been able to get along well with Strats..The tummy cut and forearm contour (not to mention the volume control placement!) make me feel like i'm wrestling with them instead of playing them!
The greatest power in the universe is imagination!

Elantric

#49
Quote'm trying to find some photos online of the step by step process (or any, really) of installing a GK-2A internal kit in a stock Strat.

QuoteThe Roland Ready Strat would be a perfect solution for me, but I have never been able to get along well with Strats.

Oh - now I totally understand  ???

What Guitar do you have in Mind for YOUR GK-3 internal install?

RTM
GK Mag Hex PU with Internal Electronics Install Guide
==============================
ftp://ftp.roland.co.uk/ProductSupport/manuals/GK-KIT-GT3_OM.pdf


The bulk of labor is for drilling cutting routing and installing this:



+ Add the cost of Wiring labor and a Brain that can read and understand a schematic.

And based on the questions/ reports/horror stories  I get in my email  on a monthly basis - I think only 60% of the Luthier installers can get a GK-3 Internal kit wired alright and functioning correctly the first time around.

Often they omit a crucial wire during the install - and then the Guitar's Owner cant figure out why the VG-99 cant process their Mag PU's  - pointing the finger at the VG-99, when in fact its due to a botched GK-3 internal install.

I would call around and get a referral from someone who owns a guitar that has had this type work done

Roland US is no help here
I would start with RMC Pickup installation luthier list
http://www.rmcpickup.com/builders.html

If a Luthier can tackle an RMC installation - they should also be able to handle  a Roland GK Internal Kit installation.

The typical problem installations are a result of  substitution of wrong parts.

They see the Guitar/Mix/Synth switch and assume its an ON-ON-ON switch for audio signals - WRONG - it actually switches control voltages and its an on-off-on type.
Same with S1/ S2  - they either use the wrong type momentary switches. or the wrong spring loaded (On)-Off-(On) switch (like Ibanez Uses) and cant figure out the wiring.

Another aspect of GK-2A vs GK-3 is the damn introduction of the "GK Type" sensing signal on Pin 9  with the GK-3 - If it were me I would cut that signal wire on the GK-3 internal. It makes the Roland gear go into this "Auto Sense" routine for the GK use - in an attempt to be user friendly - but actually it just restricts your options.

more here
   https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php/topic,73.0.html


FWIW -I'm happy with my Yamaha G1D GK PU.  - it works better with Gibson spaced bridges.

And Bela Fleck agrees with me.