GP-10 - 3-way switch problem on GK-3

Started by stevesilk51, February 14, 2015, 01:11:30 PM

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stevesilk51

Hi Guys,

I've looked around unsuccessfully for a solution to this :

I have a problem when switching to the normal pickup position on the 3-way switch.
All ok in the other two positions, but I was able, previously, to put the switch in the normal p/u position when selecting Guitar only patches and get the sound.
Now when I do it - silence.
It's not the GK3 pickup as I've tried it with two different GK3 equipped guitars.
Believe it must be a software/setup setting I've changed unwittingly that is the cause, but I can't find it. The manual isn't helping, hope someone here can?

Thanks

Steve

Elantric

#1
Fastest method to restore the Normal Guitar sound on Gp-10 is perform System Reset

Next method is launch Boss Tone Studio and inspect the Normal Guitar signal path  - insuring its "on" and not turned "off

Read GP-10 FAQ for links to both options

Boss GP-10 F.A.Q.
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=11796.msg85343#msg85343

Boss Tone Studio for GP-10 sceen shots
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=11879.0

Boss GP-10 Factory Reset Procedure
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=12047.msg87407#msg87407


homeby5

#2
Don't know if it's relevant to your issue but I have been experiencing inconsistencies with the "normal" position also. Sometimes I have to turn the unit on and of again. Now I am a newbie at this and maybe it's operator error so take it FWIW....

stevesilk51

#3
Thanks Elantric,

Thought that would be the way to go, and was.

Couldn't find a way to save all my presets as a "bundle" before the factory reset, so just created a Liveset in Librarian and then reinstalled the ones I needed.
EDIT: Strike that, just seen the Backup button in Librarian.

Steve

stevesilk51

#4
Quote from: homeby5 on February 15, 2015, 04:57:15 AM
Don't know if it's relevant to your issue but I have been experiencing inconsistencies with the "normal" position also. Sometimes I have to turn the unit on and of again. Now I am a newbie at this and maybe it's operator error so take it FWIW....

Already tried that Homeby5 but didn't work, but thanks for the reply.

Steve

jwhitcomb3

I ran into an interesting variation of this problem.

I have a bunch of assigns on a patch that change several COSM amp gain and tone parameters using the GK Volume control. I had both the normal pickups and a COSM guitar as input. When I switch the 3-way switch to the normal guitar, all of the assigned parameters jump to the minimum of their range, and the GP-10 ignores the GK volume control. Flipping the 3-way switch to synth or blend brings the assigned parameters in accordance with the position of the GK volume control. Very weird.

Elantric

#6
Possibly due to the GP-10 reading the Control voltage provided on  Pin #9 sourced from the GK-3

GK-3 (Pin#9) Voltage Range, based upon GK-3's Three way Switch position

* GK/Synth  = 1.56VDC
* Mix =  1.04VDC
* Guitar =  0.52VDC


When the Three way switch is placed in the "Guitar" position - GK-3 sends   0.52VDC down Pin #9, and modern Roland/Boss Gk13 gear automatically issues a MIDI CC#7 , data "0" message - which mutes the COSM Modeling /Synth tones and any connected MIDI Tone module.

Suggest use  a third party MIDI Monitor App to debug / verify the presence of these GK-3 "Three way Switch position" MIDI transmission messages.
On the Boss GP-10 these MIDI messages are on the USB connection.



If the above behavior is not desired  - A possible work- around is  change the "GK Type" to "GK-2A", and re- adjust the string sensitivity. The GK-2A does not use Pin #9  - and its possible the GP-10 may ignore reading the voltage change on Pin #9.       


Read GK-2A vs GK-3 for details
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=2500.0

jwhitcomb3

Thanks for the quick reply. I should have mentioned I am getting this behavior with my GK-2A equipped Fender MIM RR Strat.

beatpete

#8
I finally got my GP-10 and I'm loving it. I have questions (so far) I hope someone can answer.
When I have both "modelling" and "normal pickup" selected, I can't isolate the normal pickup by changing the pickup selector to guitar, the modelling sound is still present.

Thanks in advance...

beatpete

So the three way switch should work, any Idea why I get the GK sound when switched to guitar only?

Elantric

#10
No idea

That behavior points to a separate problem you have

What type Guitar?

What type GK 13 pickup?

Try a System Reset

beatpete

I have the GK3 that came with my GP-10 on an Ibanez Roadstar 2. I had a GR55 with a GK2a a couple of years ago and I'm pretty sure it worked fine on it. Just to make it clear, I'm running my guitar into the GK3 and then into the GP-10 via the 13 pin cable.

Elantric

#12
Yes - and if you review the GP-10 Patch Sheet - you can see the patches that provide the Normal Pickup to work  - as long as the three way GK-3 switch is in the Guitar position

Review the column named:

Normal PU ON/OFF







and when the GK-3's three way switch is in the "Guitar" position  - you should NOT hear COSM Models or Alt Tunings 

beatpete

Yes, I understand what's supposed to be happening however, if I turn modelling off, I get guitar through the GP-10 (switched to guitar) but if I then turn modelling back on (so that BOTH "modeeling " AND "normal pu" are ON via Tone Studio), even though I have the switch to guitar and guitar volume off, I still get modelling output in the GP-10.

Elantric

#14
In Edit mode - you may see that type behavior

save the patch and retry

Read here to understand how the three way switch on GK-3 works

https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=5259.0

Quote
If you want the GK-3  "Guitar/Mix/Synth(GK) switch to actually work when using the GR-55 / GP-10, then all User patches must incorporate the "GK VOL" parameter assignment is set to Patch Volume.

beatpete

Saving didn't help. In the link you posted, pertaining to the GR55, you say you have assign the GK volume to "GK Vol", does that pertain to the GP-10 as well (I have the GKVol assigned to Amp Gain).

Elantric

#16
Quote. . . does that pertain to the GP-10 as well ?

Yes

Quote(I have the GKVol assigned to Amp Gain)

That explains why your GK-3 three way switch "broke"

On patches where you want to re-map the GK-VOL pot to perform other duties - you must use Boss Tone Studio and turn down / disable the "undesired" pickup source and save it to the patch.

More rabbit hole trivia is in the related thread here:

Roland US-20 A/B Selector BUG (Importance of GK-VOL Assignment)
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=3494.0


beatpete

OK, I think I'm getting somewhere although I still get nothing when GK switch is set to guitar (I can get guitar in the "mix" position). I think I may have a faulty GK3...

Elantric

#18
QuoteI still get nothing when GK switch is set to guitar

You did read the GK-3 manual ?

http://lib.roland.co.jp/support/en/manuals/res/1811530/GK-3_e11.pdf

and connect the supplied short 1/4" cable between the "GUITAR IN" jack on GK-3 and your guitar?

beatpete

Thanks, yes. I know it still could be something simple like that (although I can hear guitar in the"mix" position). That said, I've had a VG 8, VG99 and GR55 as well as countless Roland/Boss multi FX and I consider myself an "advanced" user.

Elantric

#20
I would

1 )  Launch Boss Tone Studio for GP-10 and Save all your user patches  - and document your current System Settings, ( GK-Type, String Sensitivity, Low Velocity Cut, etc) 

2 ) Verify you have the Normal pickup cable feeding the GK-3 and that your normal guitar controls are full up and not set to zero 



3 ) Perform a System+Patch Restore on the GP-10


4 )  All should work

Elantric

#21
Just know that the Roland GK interface design is flawed.

The GK-3 Three way switch and Roland US-20 A/B/Y Selector  / routers ALL rely on the GK-3 "GK-VOL" pot to be assigned to Patch Volume

If you deviate and get creative, and re-assign GK-VOL to control something other than PATCH VOLUME - that's when all the bugs you describe manifest.

I always put on suitable background music to sing along when creating Control Assignments  - like

The Clash "Know Your Rights"

but I change the lyrics to suit the operation I'm doing:

"You have the Right to Re-assign the GK-VOL pot,  - as long as you're not Dumb enough to actually try it."






So yes - there are numerous possibilities  for User Control Assignments, but know the GK-VOL pot has several "Gotchas" lurking that rear their ugly head.

Explains why I always use a EV-5 Expression pedal with my GP-10, and typically have the External EV-5 Expression pedal for Amp Drive, Tremolo Depth, etc. on a patch by patch basis.   

beatpete

Yes, what a STUPID LIMITATION ROLAND!!! This makes the GK Volume pretty well useless...
BTW: With the GP-10, I had to set the GKVol parameter to "modeling vol" rather than "patch volume" to get the guitar to work properly.
Elantric: Thanks for all your help!

Redvers

#23
Am I right in thinking if you do this your patches save whatever volume you leave the dial set at? I turn one patch down to zero, left it, came back and it was still zero. Is it meant to do that? Is it because I set it globally? Should it be a per patch basis?

Elantric

#24
Depends on "What dial" you are talking out?


The GK-VOL control on your guitar is assignable for either  either global control or patch by patch


The Output Level on the GP-10 is not assignable