Author Topic: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure  (Read 3782 times)

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Offline acousticglue

VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« on: December 13, 2009, 07:11:25 PM »
This still confuses me. I have COSM guitar A and B. I turn on A and I get sound, I turn on B and nothing. I turn on AMPs on both and still nothing on B. I go to Mixer and place both lights on A and B and still nothing from B. I mute A and look for where I can hear B only and nothing. Where is the setting that controls when I can hear both channels at once? I get lost. I thought once I had the mixer on both and both COSM are lit up that is it. The Assigns under Control Assign are set for guitar knob. Please help me understand the gain.
« Last Edit: March 02, 2015, 03:45:02 PM by Elantric »

Offline Brent Flash

Re: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« Reply #1 on: December 13, 2009, 07:25:32 PM »
First thing that comes to mind is I don't think you mentioned the A/B Balance parameter. It is in the mixer section. There is also a volume for both A and B in the mixer that needs to be up on both.

Offline A2theT

Re: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« Reply #2 on: December 13, 2009, 07:25:50 PM »
I see this problem with lots of patches and can't find the issue or controller assigned that could be causing it.  Its still unresolved for me.   Someday when I have 4 hours to waste I will try and figure it out because it drives me NUTSO!

When this occurs, I check the A/B balance.  I even put all the way to B.  I check that channel B is enabled.  I enable amps/guitars and crank all volumes including COSM guitar levels.  I think it must be something to do with the global output.  I have an idea.  Why don't you post the patch that you're having trouble with and then a few of us can load it up and try and solve the problem.  Might be a fun (or frustrating) challenge. 
« Last Edit: December 13, 2009, 07:28:57 PM by A to the T »
HEAVY on the METAL
Axe-Fx II, Roland VG-99 + FC-300, Roland GR-55, Digitech Jamman Stereo, Ibanez/ESP/Jackson Guitars

Offline Brent Flash

Re: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« Reply #3 on: December 13, 2009, 07:29:13 PM »
A useful tool that most don't know about is the meters in the Chain section. you can see how far the signal is getting and if you are overdriving the gain in any of the stages along the way. It would be nice to have this in the editor but for now it is only on the front of the VG when you hit the CHAIN button.

Offline Brent Flash

Re: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« Reply #4 on: December 13, 2009, 07:34:51 PM »
Another thing that can get you is the FV section in the FX section. In fact the FX section is full of places that stop the signal from getting past.

Offline bob e

Re: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« Reply #5 on: December 13, 2009, 07:40:50 PM »
Is this a problem on every single patch?  Here are my first thoughts:  Is this a problem on every single patch?---oops, covered that......Some patches don't have a second cosm guitar (channel) set up.  Some patches have some of the module lights on, yet still are not actually set up to play any sound out of one channel.  

Some patch down loads were designed to have something on both channels but the down load was corrupted/altered when the author saved their personal SYSTEM Settings with the patch and then those settings screw up Your System Settings.  Also, some are really ok but maybe you missed a controller set up the author used.  For example, Brent Flash (a super genius and author of lots of great stuff) seems to have his S1, S2, and GK volume set up different--or was it that some of his patches load with mixer volume at zero?  Any way, either way, you can do a thorough check or the signal chain and if you aren't missing anything than you are free to create your own second channel.  I don't use the editor much, so here is what I do with a patch I need to evaluate/change.  Again, this is from memory so please refer to the manual for precise instructions.

1. Start by turning GK volume knob and testing out every expression pedal you have connected.  Same for pressing Control 1 and Control 2 buttons on the VG and the FC300 if you use it.


« Last Edit: December 13, 2009, 07:57:00 PM by bob e »

Offline bob e

Re: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« Reply #6 on: December 13, 2009, 07:54:29 PM »
2.  Check Patch Volume knob on VG.

3.  Start with offending channel cosm guitar.  Press cosm guitar button.  Slowly examine every parameter and setting on every page of the menu.  Be sure it is actually turned "ON".  Guitar volume on, every single page, etc

3.  Do the same for amp, then mixer.  Something is turned off and it needs to be turned on.  May be buried in a sub-menu page of anything in the chain.  Guitar, effects, alt. tunings, amp, mixer, balance. 

4.  No luck?  Look for the copy feature in each module's menu.  Copy A to B or vice versa for everything the in the functioning channels signal path.  You should end up with two identical channel settings.

5.  Edit new channel to taste.

6.  Still no luck?  Starting from the offending guitar model, turn it ON.  Go thru every page of the menu and assign something, anything. 
Go to amp and turn it on.  ASlect an amp and turn up volumers all thru menu.  Go to mixer.  Turn it ON.  Turn up volum.  You can create your own signal chain in two minutes once you get the hang of it.


All I've got for now.

Bob E.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2009, 07:58:10 PM by bob e »

Offline acousticglue

Re: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« Reply #7 on: December 14, 2009, 06:15:47 AM »
It's the preset called Instabass (345). I turn on COSM guitar, turn on AMP, check Mixer settings for A and B then make sure panning and volume are up. Couldn't find it and must be a FX thing or something.

Offline Paresh

Re: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« Reply #8 on: December 14, 2009, 08:47:50 AM »
This may be no help, but I don't use the foot controller & I thought that some patches were sometimes set up with various parameters for the foot controller & they don't work without it. I wish there was an easy way to adapt those patches for those of us who don't use the foot controller.
paresh

Offline A2theT

Re: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« Reply #9 on: December 14, 2009, 11:09:04 AM »
A useful tool that most don't know about is the meters in the Chain section. you can see how far the signal is getting and if you are overdriving the gain in any of the stages along the way. It would be nice to have this in the editor but for now it is only on the front of the VG when you hit the CHAIN button.

K Thanks to Brent I found the problem with Instabass and all the other patches I have where one channel "appears" to be dead.
We almost need to sticky this one now!

The key to solving this for me was the chain button.  Damn, the meters needs to be implemented into the Editor ASAP!

So basically I disabled everything in the patch except Channel B Cosm Guitar and Channel B Cosm Amp.  I put the mixer 100% and balance all the way to B.
Then I opened up the CHAIN and moved the COSM guitar all the way along the chain until low and behold the sound came on and blew me away just after FX B (FV).

I check the FX B Section and noticed the Foot Volume controller is at ZERO !

Its one of the only FX that does not have an enabled/disabled option but now that I've solved this problem I will know where to look in the editor to fix it every time.
And to think that I was starting to wonder if it was just a bug in the patches.....  LoL
« Last Edit: March 02, 2015, 03:44:23 PM by Elantric »
HEAVY on the METAL
Axe-Fx II, Roland VG-99 + FC-300, Roland GR-55, Digitech Jamman Stereo, Ibanez/ESP/Jackson Guitars

Offline dysamoria

Re: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« Reply #10 on: October 08, 2016, 09:28:11 PM »
K Thanks to Brent I found the problem with Instabass and all the other patches I have where one channel "appears" to be dead.
We almost need to sticky this one now!

The key to solving this for me was the chain button.  Damn, the meters needs to be implemented into the Editor ASAP!

So basically I disabled everything in the patch except Channel B Cosm Guitar and Channel B Cosm Amp.  I put the mixer 100% and balance all the way to B.
Then I opened up the CHAIN and moved the COSM guitar all the way along the chain until low and behold the sound came on and blew me away just after FX B (FV).

I check the FX B Section and noticed the Foot Volume controller is at ZERO !

Its one of the only FX that does not have an enabled/disabled option but now that I've solved this problem I will know where to look in the editor to fix it every time.
And to think that I was starting to wonder if it was just a bug in the patches.....  LoL

Thank you, thank you, thank you, THANK YOU!!

i just spent about a half hour with this same problem and the explanation was that Foot Volume controller. i don't have a pedal attached, so i didn't think to test for that (silly me).

Offline dysamoria

Re: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« Reply #11 on: October 09, 2016, 08:26:26 PM »
...and on other patches, the interruption of the signal flow is any number of OTHER causes. All the patches i downloaded from the user collections have volume zero, pedal zero, output set to sub, COSM at zero, etc etc etc etc... i can see why this thing wasn't a hit on the market with anyone but hardcore effects geeks and synth people. There's nothing obvious or simple about using the VG-99. i love this thing, but there are seriously too many ways to make it do nothing at all, and not be able to easily figure out WHY.

Offline aliensporebomb

Re: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« Reply #12 on: October 10, 2016, 06:32:16 AM »
My question would be how many VG-99 owners experiencing this own an FC-300 or other type of MIDI capable volume pedal/controller?
"this is aliensporebomb" - my instrumental debut with the vg99 now on itunes: http://itunes.apple.com/us/album/this-is-aliensporebomb/id391880218
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Offline Brent Flash

Re: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« Reply #13 on: October 10, 2016, 07:50:20 AM »
...and on other patches, the interruption of the signal flow is any number of OTHER causes. All the patches i downloaded from the user collections have volume zero, pedal zero, output set to sub, COSM at zero, etc etc etc etc... i can see why this thing wasn't a hit on the market with anyone but hardcore effects geeks and synth people. There's nothing obvious or simple about using the VG-99. i love this thing, but there are seriously too many ways to make it do nothing at all, and not be able to easily figure out WHY.
A guitar playing, audio engineer's dream come true with all the tools you could ever want to create guitar sounds. Yes, not for the guitar player that has a guitar and amp in his bedroom.

I love this box also and had many years of enjoyment. Even though I have retired from all things gear related, (so I don't have to keep up with the latest/greatest) if they came out with a new version (VG100 what ever) I would probably buy it.

Online Elantric

Re: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« Reply #14 on: October 10, 2016, 10:56:59 AM »
Quote
My question would be how many VG-99 owners experiencing this own an FC-300 pedal/controller?

Zero

My data shows 80% of VG-99 owners also own the FC-300

and while I know many just use the VG-99 alone , IMHO the FC-300 opens up many necessary live performance control options that make buying one worthwhile because its tough to accomplish using any other means without a lot of MIDI programming.

FC-300 is plug & play with RRC2 cable into VG-99  (or  VB-99) and use VG-99 Editor to setup your FC-300 control assignments for VG-99

 
« Last Edit: October 10, 2016, 11:03:39 AM by Elantric »

Offline dysamoria

Re: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« Reply #15 on: October 14, 2016, 09:50:37 PM »
oh yeah, I've considered that there might be mapped switches to that controller, but i don't have it and i'm done spending money.

Offline dysamoria

Re: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« Reply #16 on: January 22, 2017, 07:36:06 AM »
i can't believe i'm still finding patches with different and undiscovered causes for no sound output. Does anyone know what stops the signal flow in the preset "Metallica - Fight Fire rev4.(A to the T).mid"?

Online Elantric

Re: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« Reply #17 on: January 22, 2017, 07:51:55 AM »
Review the Control assignment.

Many VG-99 owners also use the FC-300 footcontroller with a few EV-5 pedals

Typically if you experience no sound from a VG-99 patch it's because you don't have the physical external volume pedal connected

Review the VG-99's Control Assignments and change to suit your hardware

Offline dysamoria

Re: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« Reply #18 on: January 22, 2017, 08:50:25 AM »
i checked all the control assignments and find them all off or unrelated to signal flow (FX on/off are the only controls set).

Online Elantric

Re: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« Reply #19 on: January 22, 2017, 08:52:39 AM »
Post a link to the problem patch so others can assist

Online chrish

Re: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« Reply #20 on: January 22, 2017, 09:54:52 AM »
I considered buying the fc-300 controller, however, if you know how to  map midi cc# assignments, the boss rc-300 loop pedal is very capable of handling many of the fc-300 functions, especially since i already own two control switches and 3 exp pedal out puts.

the rc-300 looper also adds midi mapping to several of it's pedal control switches, such as the fx switch, and the built in exp pedal.

The rc-300 looper also adds many features that the fc-300 doesn't do. It's a stereo looper, has fx, simple rhythm tracks, and functions as the master clock.

the vg99 has a midi merge feature so the rc-300 can be input into the vg99 midi in.

from there the rc-300 master clock and midi mapped assigns can be merged with the vg99 pitch to midi and it's hold switch and other midi assigns and sent to control other synths.

 I've found it to be very educational to do my own mapping. Many of the shared user patches were created with a fc-300 attached so going through the patches helps with understanding how the creator, created those patches and why something isn't working in your own set up.
« Last Edit: January 22, 2017, 10:36:52 AM by chrish »

Offline Brent Flash

Re: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« Reply #21 on: January 22, 2017, 10:06:01 AM »
i can't believe i'm still finding patches with different and undiscovered causes for no sound output. Does anyone know what stops the signal flow in the preset "Metallica - Fight Fire rev4.(A to the T).mid"?
I was going to take a look at it for you but I am having trouble finding Rev 4. I can find Rev 2 is that the one you are having trouble with?

Offline pasha811

Re: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« Reply #22 on: January 22, 2017, 10:31:05 AM »
I considered buying the fc-300 controller, however, if you know how to  map midi cc# assignments, the boss rc-300 loop pedal is very capable of handling many of the fc-300 functions, especially since i already own two control switches and 3 exp pedal out puts.

the rc-300 looper also adds midi mapping to several of it's pedal control switches, such as the fx switch, and the built in exp pedal.

The rc-300 looper also adds many features that the fc-300 doesn't do. It's a stereo looper, has fx, simple rhythm tracks, and functions as the master clock.

the vg99 has a midi merge feature so the rc-300 can be input into the vg99 midi in.

from there the rc-300 master clock and midi mapped assigns can be merged with the vg99 pitch to midi and it's hold switch and other midi assigns and sent to control other synths.

Very interesting insight, Thank you :-)
Does this mean that RC-300 retains its looper functions and you can still control VG99 (mainly some CTL parameters and program changes)?
Listen to my music at :  http://alonetone.com/pasha/

Online chrish

Re: VG-99 - Volume Gain Structure
« Reply #23 on: January 22, 2017, 11:32:29 AM »
Very interesting insight, Thank you :-)
Does this mean that RC-300 retains its looper functions and you can still control VG99 (mainly some CTL parameters and program changes)?
The rc-300 will allow you to target assign midi cc#'s 1-31 and 64-95 to any source switch  or exp on the unit itself. 

In addition the rc-300 has inputs for external switches. You can plug in  4 control switches, or 2 other exp pedals- Or 2 control switches and 1 other exp.

Each phase memory can have it's own assign scheme.

While you can make a target assign to a source assign pedal, like turning  on loop 1, you may not want to or it could add some creative control.

The rc-300 fx switch allows for both turning on the rc fx and sending a target assign or  one or the other.

I generally prefer to be overwhelmed with creative choices. I freeze up when confusion doesn't rule. ;-)

sorry if i drifted this thread.
« Last Edit: January 22, 2017, 11:48:20 AM by chrish »

 

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