Hidden Talent Of GR-55

Started by vablows, September 17, 2014, 09:49:45 AM

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vablows

I just wanted to share something that I realized this weekend with everyone.

It dawned on me to try something that worked:

I use my guitar's output going direct into my Kemper, and use the 13 pin for the GR-55.

I decided to try and see if I can get the magnetic pickup output from the GK through the GR-55 at the same time as the regular output jack and I can.

So now, I can not only have the Kemper's tones, but then have a COSM guitar, and yet another signal from my mag pickups through the GR-55 as well as the 2 synth tones.

This is mind-blowing to me and I am probably over thinking things too much but am starting to really explore the possibilities of being able to have 3 guitars at once.

Mainly I will use it for stereo type of stuff like panning, but for me as the only guitarist in my band it sure does have potential.

I was on the fence about getting a GP-10 ( I assume you can also do this with GP though), then figured this out and think I will stay with the GR-55 for now.

Elantric

#1
QuoteI decided to try and see if I can get the magnetic pickup output from the GK through the GR-55 at the same time as the regular output jack and I can.
Curious what type of Guitar and what type GK-3 13 pin pickup?


Actually any Electric Steel String Guitar with a properly installed  GK-3 type 13 pin interface allows the normal pickups to be sent down the 13 pin cable, and allow the connected 13 pin Processor to have access to your normal pickup's signal for further processing.
The VG-88, VG-99, GR-55, and GP-10 can work as a DSP Amp/Cab/ FX processor for your normal pickups.
Read
GR-55 FAQ: TOP THINGS TO KNOW
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=4006.0

* How to enable "Normal Guitar Pickups" and make the GK-3 Guitar/Mix/Synth three-way switch work with the GR-55:
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=3402.0
QuoteI use my guitar's output going direct into my Kemper, and use the 13 pin for the GR-55.
A guitar with the GK-Kit-GT3 internal kit wired per the official Roland Instructions will allow the Normal pickups signal to be accessible via 1/4" Guitar output and the 13 pin GK Output on the Guitar at the same time.

The caveat/exception would be the Fender Roland Ready Strats and the Fender Roland GC-1 Strat - these employ 1/4" Switching output jacks that anytime a 1/4" cable is connected to the Guitar, the switching circuit in the 1/4" output jack on the guitar completely removes the  normal pickup's signal from the 13 pin cable feed - which makes your setup of feeding two target amp processors (GR-55 & Kemper)- one must rely on one 13 pin cable, and then use the "Guitar Output"  jack on the 13 pin processor (VG-88, VG-99, GR-55, GP-10) to feed the Kemper.

vablows

I am using my custom built guitar that has an internal GK-3 installed.

I am not confident with the GR-55 as a stand alone "amp", that's why I was thinking of going with the GP-10.

But I love my Kemper too much, and don't think any of these will be able to satisfy me guitar-tone wise yet so for now I am just using these to fatten up and complement my Kemper tones.

My recent goal was to get a Godin LGXT, put an FTP on it, and use the GP-10 for the modelled stuff and acoustics and maybe SampleTank 3 for the synth stuff.

But the sticking point for me is that I am not sure if I want to invest the time it will take to start from scratch- I already have all of my synth tones dialed in on the Roland for about 20 different tunes.

Can your LGX-SA use the 13 pin for mag pickup as well as the 1/4" out at the same time Elantric?

Elantric

#3
Quote
Can your LGX-SA use the 13 pin for mag pickup as well as the 1/4" out at the same time Elantric?

I'll test tonight.

But know that the Boss GP-10's Guitar Output jack can feed normal pickup signal to the Kemper, and just use one 13 cable from the guitar. 

vablows

Any degradation of tone though, on the GP guitar out?

It is unusable on the GR-55, colors the tone too much for my liking.

If I use the guitar output on the GP, though, wouldn't I lose that 2nd independent mag signal that I want?

Elantric

#5
QuoteIt is unusable on the GR-55, colors the tone too much for my liking.

True! by contrast,  the Boss GP-10's Guitar Out jack is much cleaner  / lower noise and less of a "frequency response killer" compared to older Roland VG/GR gear, and MUCH Improved compared to the noisy/hissy GR-55 Guitar Out jack.  Also since buying the Boss GP-10, I seldom power up my Kemper. The Boss GP-10 delivers great tones I can use - even with just the normal pickups.

vablows

I'm on the verge of a nervous breakdown lol!

I am seriously considering getting a GP and then if it satisfies me, selling the Kemper and CLR and getting another GP and a bunch of toys.

I rely on stereo 100%, so the ability to have 2 separate signals is very appealing to me.

I am doing some hard thinking tonight and may just end up giving it a try.

Elantric


Elantric

#8
QuoteI am seriously considering getting a GP and then if it satisfies me, selling the Kemper and CLR and getting another GP and a bunch of toys.

That is my plan too - but you might keep the CLR

https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=11717.0



QuoteI rely on stereo 100%, so the ability to have 2 separate signals is very appealing to me.

I really dig my pair of Alesis Alpha 112A (Alto TS112A clones) -for $179 /ea during SDOTD at MusiciansFriend
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=3207.msg86715#msg86715

shawnb

Quote from: vablows on September 17, 2014, 09:49:45 AM
It dawned on me to try something that worked:

I use my guitar's output going direct into my Kemper, and use the 13 pin for the GR-55.

I decided to try and see if I can get the magnetic pickup output from the GK through the GR-55 at the same time as the regular output jack and I can.

I'm curious how your mag pu signal gets to the 13-pin.   This would not work with an external GK.   Your mag pu Jack needs the short cable to the GK wart.

Will this work for internal GK installs?   Is the mag pu signal sent to both?
Address the process rather than the outcome.  Then, the outcome becomes more likely.   - Fripp

vablows

I can't say how it usually is installed: I had my good friend who works at Seymour Duncan do a completely customized wiring job for me.

So I believe he wired the GK to the volume pot directly for the mag lead that goes to the GK.

I asked him to bypass the tone pots on my bridge pickup for me after it was already wired the normal way, and I didn't have the schematic for the GK so he wired it how he knew it would work using technical theory, and it did.

So this could be an anamoly that I just happened to get lucky with.

We will find out from Elantric when he gets a chance to test his Godin if it works the same way.

Elantric

#11
Quote
2  Roland GR-55 / Roland GR-55 Discussion / Re: Hidden Talent Of GR-55
on: Today at 09:16:30 AM
Started by vablows - Last post by vablows
I can't say how it usually is installed: I had my good friend who works at Seymour Duncan do a completely customized wiring job for me.

So I believe he wired the GK to the volume pot directly for the mag lead that goes to the GK.

I asked him to bypass the tone pots on my bridge pickup for me after it was already wired the normal way, and I didn't have the schematic for the GK so he wired it how he knew it would work using technical theory, and it did.

So this could be an anamoly that I just happened to get lucky with.


FWIW - The Schematics are here:
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=73.0

the "normal" GK-Kit GT-3 internal install simply has the normal pickup signal entering the Gk Preamp from the Guitar Vol pot Wiper - so normal Guitar signal signal is automatically fed to two destinations all the time.

Compare with the different arrangement employed on the Roland Ready Strat and Fender/Roland GC-1 below  -these employ a Switching Jack that isolates and removes the  normal pickup signal from the  the Gk Preamp anytime a regular 1/4" guitar cable is inserted into the 1/4"  guitar output jack


thebrushwithin

QuoteMy recent goal was to get a Godin LGXT, put an FTP on it, and use the GP-10 for the modelled stuff and acoustics and maybe SampleTank 3 for the synth stuff.

The arched top of the LGXT will not allow the install of the FTP. I really wish it did, cause I already own 2 LGXTs.

Elantric

#13
QuoteThe arched top of the LGXT will not allow the install of the FTP. I really wish it did, cause I already own 2 LGXTs.

I suspect this is an error

My similar Godin LGX-SA sunburst  has a completely "flat top" within the lighter colored areas where of the pickups and bridge are mounted. (it even uses Flat Bottom pickup mounting rings)   The top on Godin LGXT/LGX-SA  is only "beveled" when it  tapers down to the dark colored areas within 2 inches of the border edge of the "flat" top.
as seen here:




The result is the FTP should fit just fine and Godin LGX-SA and LGXT

Just as FTP fits  on my Godin xtSA


thebrushwithin

Maybe everything is setup too low on my LGXTs, but I just tried it again, and the strings sit right on top of the FTP pickup. Maybe the neck would need shims, and the bridge raised accordingly, so it would fit, but I don't want to change the action. If so, maybe I could have a tech do this, cause I love these Godins. Really great craftsmanship!