GT-1 - Is the Boss GT-1 USB midi Class Compliant?

Started by micdim, May 31, 2017, 06:18:37 AM

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micdim

Hey Everyone,

I'm asking if the GT-1 USB midi is class compliant because I would like to use the Kenton MIDI USB Host http://www.kentonuk.com/products/items/utilities/usb-host.shtml to hook the GT-1's USB A type connector to it. The USB type b connector will be connected to the GT-1. (I hope I got this right)

What I'm trying to do: (Below works great with my GT-100 because it has 5 pin midi in/out connections)
- My audio 5 pin midi in/out interface is connected to my computer's usb port.
- I'm currently sending midi out from the audio interfaces 5 pin midi out port to my GT-100's 5 pin midi in port.
- I would like to do the same as above, so I would have to send the 5pin midi out to the Kenton Midi Host's 5pin midi in, and then hook up the GT-1's USB A midi to the Kenton's USB A port.
- The Kenton Midi USB Host ONLY works with USB Class compliant midi devices, so that's why I'm asking this question.

Thanks everyone in advance,

If this doesn't work, does anyone know if there is any other way to do this that works.

vtgearhead

I'll defer to Elantric for the definitive answer, but my impression is that NONE of the Roland/Boss products are class-compliant. They happen to be recognized by the Linux hotplug system (and newer Android releases), but this was by the kindness of free-software developers rather than by design.

Elantric

#2
Quote
NONE of the Roland/Boss Guitar products are USB class-compliant. They happen to be recognized by the Linux hotplug system (and newer Android releases), but this was by the kindness of free-software developers rather than by design.

it depends on the product

The older Boss GT-10 and Roland VG-99 both have a USB Class Compliant Audio mode  - but only 16 bit @ 44.1 audio is supported

Elantric

#3
Quote from: micdim on May 31, 2017, 06:18:37 AM
Hey Everyone,

I'm asking if the GT-1 USB midi is class compliant because I would like to use the Kenton MIDI USB Host http://www.kentonuk.com/products/items/utilities/usb-host.shtml to hook the GT-1's USB A type connector to it. The USB type b connector will be connected to the GT-1. (I hope I got this right)

What I'm trying to do: (Below works great with my GT-100 because it has 5 pin midi in/out connections)
- My audio 5 pin midi in/out interface is connected to my computer's usb port.
- I'm currently sending midi out from the audio interfaces 5 pin midi out port to my GT-100's 5 pin midi in port.
- I would like to do the same as above, so I would have to send the 5pin midi out to the Kenton Midi Host's 5pin midi in, and then hook up the GT-1's USB A midi to the Kenton's USB A port.
- The Kenton Midi USB Host ONLY works with USB Class compliant midi devices, so that's why I'm asking this question.

Thanks everyone in advance,

If this doesn't work, does anyone know if there is any other way to do this that works.

These USB Host to MIDI adapters do not work with Roland/ Boss gear ( VG/GR/GP/GT) USB ports that require Win/Mac drivers

Kenton USB Host to MIDI
iConnectMIDI products
DamageControl products
iPhone/iPad with Apple USB Camera adapter


These USB Host to MIDI adapters below DO work with Roland/ Boss gear ( VG/GR/GP/GT) USB ports that require Win/Mac drivers

PrimovaSound MIDX-10
PrimovaSound MIDX-20

Raspberry Pi SBC ( Single Board Computer running ALSA / Jack Audio) with USB to 5 pin DIN MIDI cable
Beaglebone SBC ( Single Board Computer running ALSA / Jack Audio) with USB to 5 pin DIN MIDI cable

Android 6.01 OS ( or newer) tablets / smartphones with USB OTG adapter 

more about USB Host to MIDI adapters
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=15763.msg112535#msg112535

micdim

Wow thanks Elantric and snhirsch!

Elantric, Wow this great news, and I will check the PrimovaSound MIDX-10 and 20.

So just to be clear the PrimovaSound MIDX-10 and 20 WILL WORK just by plug-in play. I won't have to do anything else, but use my set-up just as before, except that I would plug the GT-1 into the MIDX-10 or 20, and I can send Program/Control changes to the GT-1 from my computer DAW through my Audio interfaces 5 pin midi out, and vise versa.

Nobody has been able to clarify this, but I will check this out, and be purchasing the GT-1 now.

Thanks again

Elantric

#5
QuoteSo just to be clear the PrimovaSound MIDX-10 and 20 WILL WORK just by plug-in play. I won't have to do anything else, but use my set-up just as before, except that I would plug the GT-1 into the MIDX-10 or 20, and I can send Program/Control changes to the GT-1 from my computer DAW through my Audio interfaces 5 pin midi out, and vise versa.
Yes -but must read the MIDX-20 manual

https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=17561.0

http://www.primovasound.com/midx_20.html

MIDX-20 owners manual
http://www.primovasound.com/pdf/MIDX20_Manual.pdf

MIDX-20 PC Assistant Manual
http://www.primovasound.com/pdf/MIDX20_Assistant.pdf

MIDX-20 MIDI Implementation Manual (pdf)
http://www.primovasound.com/pdf/MIDX20_MIDI_Implementation.pdf

micdim

Oh boy? Ok I'll have to read and understand this.

Sorry about this. I just want to make sure.

So, I'll be able to record Program and/or Control messages from the GT-1 through the MIDX 10 or 20 which then goes through my Audio interfaces' 5pin midi in, which then records to my computers DAW. Then I can play the sequence, and send the Program and/or Control messages back to my GT-1 through the 5pin midi out port, to the 5pin midi in on the MIDX 10 or 20, which then finally sends the program and/or Control messages to my GT-1. Then of coarse the GT-1 receives any of those messages and changes it's Program number and/or Control message automatically.

P.S.
I'm using a 30' mid cable. No issues with 5pin midi. I'm assuming I'll have no issues with this setup.

Thanks Elantric, very much appreciate your help.

Elantric

#7
QuoteSo, I'll be able to record Program and/or Control messages from the GT-1 through the MIDX 10 or 20 which then goes through my Audio interfaces' 5pin midi in, which then records to my computers DAW. Then I can play the sequence, and send the Program and/or Control messages back to my GT-1 through the 5pin midi out port, to the 5pin midi in on the MIDX 10 or 20, which then finally sends the program and/or Control messages to my GT-1. Then of coarse the GT-1 receives any of those messages and changes it's Program number and/or Control message automatically.

If your goal is using your DAW to transmit MIDI Patch change commands to the Boss GT-1, then a basic USB 2.0 printer cable will perform those tasks already  - use the official Roland/Boss GT-1 USB Audio/MIDI Driver for your operating systems ( Windows/ Mac) 
https://www.boss.info/global/support/by_product/gt-1/updates_drivers/

PLEASE READ THE "README.html" file that is included with the USB driver download
( 90% of ALL problems with Roland/Boss computer connectivity via USB occurs from folks who disregard following the supplied "README instructions contained inside the zip / rar/ tgz files .


then you will be able to record Program and/or Control messages from the GT-1 ( via MIDI over USB) using a USB 2.0 printer cable which then (thanks to the Roland/ Boss GT-1 USB Audio/MIDI Driver) records to your computers DAW. Then I can play the sequence, and send the Program and/or Control messages back to my GT-1 through USB cable  which (thanks to the Roland/ Boss GT-1 USB Audio/MIDI Driver)  finally sends the program and/or Control messages to my GT-1 using a USB connection.

The GT-1 has a limited set of MIDI CC commands support

I believe only MIDI CC#7 for patch volume is supported


And read the Boss GT-1 manual
https://www.boss.info/global/support/by_product/gt-1/owners_manuals/

You only need a MIDX-20 if you wish to use third party MIDI controllers to control the GT-1


micdim

Hey Elantric,

All my USB ports are being used for other things like Audio Interface (with 5pin midi in/out), Foot Controller (Start/Stop sequencer), and Wireless external USB Start/Stop Controller. I also need at least a 25-30 foot cable for the stages that I perform on. I don't think USB midi cables of that length are a good idea. Another problem is that there are 2 guitar players using 5pin midi already, so the easiest solution is if I can get the GT-1 to accept 5pin midi through a converter like the MIDX.

Your thoughts?





Elantric

#9
Get an active USB  Hub for your non audio gear

And the GT-1 is a decent 24 bit audio interface

I work solo on laptops and my audio interface is variable to the unit on hand and task being performed

Since most modern guitar DSP modelers also work as a USB audio interfaces , I have over a dozen USB audio interfaces and use the one that's built into my current guitar processor.

micdim

Thanks for your patience Elantric,

However if the GT-1 only has CC#7 and no other CC's then I'm afraid I'm out of luck. I wont' be able to use it, and I will have to stay with my GT-100. Too bad as I would have loved to cut down on space, and weight.

P.S.
I can't find the Midi implementation chart for the GT-1. I don't see one in Roland's website, and I can't find it in either the Owners Manual or the Parameter guide?


Elantric

You won't find a MIDI Implementation  chart for GT-1 because the GT-1 has such a limited MIDI  support


micdim

Thanks for all your help Elantric,

Cheers!

micdim

#13
Just spoke with Roland Canada, and they confirmed with me that the GT-1 and the GT-001 does not transfer any midi data, so they cannot receive automation data such as Program Change, or Control Change by a computer through midi.

I thought that may be the case with GT-1, but never thought the GT-001 had the same limitations, so I looked up the midi implementation, and it seems to suggest that you can indeed send Program and Control changes to the GT-001
https://static.roland.com/assets/media/pdf/GT-100_GT-001_MIDI_Imple_e01_W.pdf

Once again thank you all for your time and help!

Elantric

#14
QuoteJust spoke with Roland Canada, and they confirmed with me that the GT-1 and the GT-001 does not transfer any midi data, so they cannot receive automation data such as Program Change, or Control Change by a computer through midi.

Despite what Roland Canada states, the GT-001 DOES transmit / receive MIDI over USB

and a few folks purchased the PrimovaSound MIDX-20 to control the GT-001 via 5 pin DIN MIDI (confirmed that works)


Search on "MIDI" on the GT-001 Parameter Guide
https://static.roland.com/assets/media/pdf/GT-001_r_e01W.pdf


or review the GT-001 MIDI Implementation doc
https://static.roland.com/assets/media/pdf/GT-100_GT-001_MIDI_Imple_e01_W.pdf





MIDX-20 is the missing link says Gundy Keller.
"I really needed it to control my GT-001, great work!!!"



   

micdim

#15
I just revised my last statement above, after checking out the midi implementation chart.

Yes your right, and thank you for stating that!

That's why I checked it out. I figure the rep at Roland Canada wasn't aware of that.

Sorry for posting it before I checked the midi chart.

Once again Cheers and thank you for your resilience in giving the correct information.


admin


Discussion of Android Audio / MIDI using USB OTG adapters to USB Audio interfaces with    
Audio Evolution Mobile Studio
http://www.extreamsd.com/index.php/technology/usb-audio-driver

Works with Boss GT-1   Requires disabling USB MIDI in the Audio Evolution Mobile settings

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.extreamsd.aemobile&hl=en

Will require a suitable USB to OTG Host Port adapter


https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01GGKYYT0/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&psc=1