Author Topic: VG-88 - Unlucky for V1 owners in the UK  (Read 619 times)

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Offline tonybaskett

VG-88 - Unlucky for V1 owners in the UK
« on: March 28, 2017, 10:30:58 AM »
Hi, I'm a recent VG-88 owner.
Having borrowed and recorded with a VG-88 some time ago I recently splashed out on one for myself. I've discovered that the one I used for recording was a V2 as I cannot find the same sound on the one I have (V1). I'm now working with the singer on that old recording, playing live about once a month and I miss that sound. I read on here that Roland were updating the V1's to V2's so I emailed them and got the following reply.

-----------------------------
Hi Tony,
 
Thank you for your email.
 
I am afraid that due to the age of the VG-88 the update is no longer available.
 
We did accept the VG-88’s back here to perform the update but this service is no longer available.
 
We unfortunately no longer have to Version 2 update file available to send either I am afraid.
 
I am sorry I could not be of any more help.
 
Kind regards
 
Mike 

--------------------------------------------------------

I am an electronics engineer and have built various midi stuff using arduinos. Confident I could perform the upgrade but cannot find the files online - can anyone help?

All the best

Tony
« Last Edit: March 29, 2017, 11:23:42 AM by Elantric »

Offline Elantric

Re: VG-88 - Unlucky for V1 owners in the UK
« Reply #1 on: March 28, 2017, 10:47:10 AM »
The VG-88 V2 upgrades are out there
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Roland-VG-88-V2-Upgrade-Editors-Patches-More-/161603886691?hash=item25a0579e63:m:modRnLo3EH9WjlsmkwaNHBg

30% of those attempting the V2 firmware upgrade "bricked" their VG-88  - even VG-88 owners with BSEE electronic degrees !

Even today, Same high percentage of VG-88 owners continue to "brick"  their VG-88 when attempting to perform the V2 update - (  it remains an extremely high risk procedure!  )

Should you pursue this, must build the special (JIG PLUG)

 use the Roland SMF "Player"
https://www.roland.com/us/support/by_product/gr-20/updates_drivers/d9e54197-dd1d-4100-b56d-21e4c759f691/

***  Its crucial you use a high quality MIDI interface (Roland UM-ONE MKII) and send each of the eight *.mid SMF files that comprise the V2 firmware upgrade to the VG-88 via Roland SMF "Player"'s MIDI output "One at a time" !


**  Do not use the default mode of  Roland SMF "Player" utility, as it defaults to the user pointing to the computer folder containing all *.mid SMF  (VG-88 V2 update) files, then  SMF "Player will rapidly auto increment and attempt to send all eight *.mid files sequentially via MIDI I/O connection to VG-88 being updated in one operation  - without the individual *.mid SMF file checksum verification process!
That default mode of SMF player "auto-corrupts the VG-88 . Must Manually intervene and transmit each *.mid file one at a time, waiting for the checksum reply in between each *.mid file  transmission   
« Last Edit: April 04, 2017, 02:11:57 PM by admsustainiac »

Offline billbax

Re: VG-88 - Unlucky for V1 owners in the UK
« Reply #2 on: March 28, 2017, 12:40:28 PM »
Hi Tony,

I did my V2 upgrade back in the day when yahoo groups were popular.  In fact, that's where I found the V2 upgrade.  Elantric is spot on about the scary upgrade - it could go wrong, and you end up with a dead unit.

I have the service notes if anyone wants them.  Better still call Roland UK, and they'll be happy to oblige.

Bill

www.separate-strings.co.uk
« Last Edit: March 29, 2017, 11:23:58 AM by Elantric »

Offline billbax

Re: VG-88 - Unlucky for V1 owners in the UK
« Reply #3 on: March 29, 2017, 04:10:34 AM »
Reading through this topic again, I can't believe someone is selling the V2 upgrade on ebay. Not only are they grabbing someone's money, they are also peddling misery with a failed update  :(
« Last Edit: March 29, 2017, 11:24:09 AM by Elantric »

Offline chrish

Re: Unlucky for V1 owners in the UK
« Reply #4 on: March 29, 2017, 11:20:22 AM »
Reading through this topic again, I can't believe someone is selling the V2 upgrade on ebay. Not only are they grabbing someone's money, they are also peddling misery with a failed update  :(
i read one ebay v2 upgrade seller that got two good reviews from successful upgrades. He also has a disclaimer not to do the upgrade if a person doesn't understand midi sysex.

As always though, the law supports the principle of 'buyer beware'.

I've been toying with the idea of buying a used vg88 so as to own all the vg series units. Reading vguitar forums is a valuable tool in order to become informed.

I now know to be aware and find one with the v2 upgrade and make sure it's a working unit.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2017, 11:27:46 AM by chrish »

Offline Elantric

Re: VG-88 - Unlucky for V1 owners in the UK
« Reply #5 on: March 29, 2017, 11:27:02 AM »
Quote
I did my V2 upgrade back in the day when yahoo groups were popular.  In fact, that's where I found the V2 upgrade.

FWIW - its still there at VG-8 Yahoo group (I'm sustainiac_93401)
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/vg-8/files/VG88%20Upgrade/


Quote
He also has a disclaimer not to do the upgrade if a person doesn't understand midi sysex.



use the Roland SMF "Player"
https://www.roland.com/us/support/by_product/gr-20/updates_drivers/d9e54197-dd1d-4100-b56d-21e4c759f691/

***  Its crucial you use a high quality MIDI interface (Roland UM-ONE MKII) and send each of the eight *.mid SMF files that comprise the V2 firmware upgrade to the VG-88 via Roland SMF "Player"'s MIDI output "One at a time" !


**  Do not use the default mode of  Roland SMF "Player" utility, as it defaults to the user pointing to the computer folder containing all *.mid SMF  (VG-88 V2 update) files , then  SMF "Player will rapidly auto increment and attempt to send all eight *.mid files sequentially via MIDI I/O connection to VG-88 being updated in one operation  - without the individual *.mid SMF file checksum verification process!
That default mode of SMF player "auto-corrupts the VG-88 . Must Manually intervene and transmit each *.mid file one at a time, waiting for the checksum reply in between each *.mid file transmission   

« Last Edit: April 04, 2017, 02:12:06 PM by admsustainiac »

Offline chrish

Re: VG-88 - Unlucky for V1 owners in the UK
« Reply #6 on: March 29, 2017, 11:40:21 AM »
FWIW - its still there at VG-8 Yahoo group
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/vg-8/files/VG88%20Upgrade/

The ebay v2 upgrade seller, that i referenced above, is also including a cd full of patches and an editor/librarian.

So it's most  likely all ripped from the yahoo site. 
« Last Edit: March 29, 2017, 11:43:33 AM by chrish »

Offline Elantric

Re: VG-88 - Unlucky for V1 owners in the UK
« Reply #7 on: March 29, 2017, 12:25:31 PM »
Quote
The ebay v2 upgrade seller is also including a cd full of patches and an editor.

So most it's likely all ripped from the yahoo site.

Same situation already occurs on Ebay  with our VG-99 patches
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Roland-VG-99-ULTIMATE-Patches-Guitar-Tone-Presets-Rock-Effects-Settings-Library-/282144320690?hash=item41b11cacb2:g:jKgAAOSwImRYbWbX

and GR-55 patches , GP-10 patches


Ebay seller "empyreanfx " downloaded these from VGuitarforums for free , burned them to a CD and now resells them - violating our terms 

http://www.ebay.com/usr/empyreanfx?_trksid=p2047675.l2559

http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=7972.0

VGuitarForums Patch Exchange Terms and conditions:
By uploading a patch, you grant VGuitarforums the right to offer this patch to all members of the VGuitarforums community. You also grant others the right to use your uploaded patches without restrictions. Others can pass your patches on but cannot sell them in any way. Unless clearly stated as a patch variation, you must be the original author of the patch , in other words, please do not upload other people's work. Even though we do not limit the amount of patches you can upload, please be considerate and only share strong and quality creations. We reserve the right to reject a patch and modify it in order to increase its usability for other users.


Of course - if you are the original creator of the patches - I have no issue with you selling your patch creations online.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2017, 06:06:46 PM by Elantric »

Offline tonybaskett

Re: VG-88 - Unlucky for V1 owners in the UK
« Reply #8 on: March 29, 2017, 05:02:58 PM »
Hi again - I've applied to become a member at the Yahoo group, so fingers crossed I am able to get hold of the files.

If I can find it I will post the solo I played and you'll understand why I want that sound again. There's some good info about how to sequence the upgrade files and making the jig plug.

Thanks for all the useful information, should I brick the VG then i'll have to buy a V2 ... I'm not willing to pay 70 quid for something Roland could (but wont) supply me for the sake of a link - I'd resent it every time I switched it on!

All the best

Tony

Offline Elantric

Re: VG-88 - Unlucky for V1 owners in the UK
« Reply #9 on: March 29, 2017, 05:46:23 PM »
Quote
Hi again - I've applied to become a member at the Yahoo group, so fingers crossed I am able to get hold of the files.

http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=20535.0;attach=15622

Offline tonybaskett

Re: VG-88 - Unlucky for V1 owners in the UK
« Reply #10 on: March 30, 2017, 12:16:55 PM »
Hi

Thank you so much, I've just bought a VG8 on eBay which will give me some effects should the 88 upgrade result in a brick, I know it's not the same beast but some of the sounds are impressive, no idea what version, just gives me some cover.

Thanks again

Tony

Offline Elantric

Re: VG-88 - Unlucky for V1 owners in the UK
« Reply #11 on: March 30, 2017, 12:34:25 PM »
I actually MUCH prefer my VG-8EX 1000% more than my VG-88 V2

Offline tonybaskett

Re: VG-88 - Unlucky for V1 owners in the UK
« Reply #12 on: April 04, 2017, 01:43:49 PM »
Successful upgrade this afternoon, took about 45 minutes to load up the 8 midi files, a very happy forum member now :)

My VG8 also arrived - it's the EX version and a real bargain at £75, some really good telecaster simulations.


There's a seller on eBay UK selling 13 pin leads for £16.95.

Tony

Offline admsustainiac

Re: VG-88 - Unlucky for V1 owners in the UK
« Reply #13 on: April 04, 2017, 01:47:38 PM »
Quote
Successful upgrade this afternoon, took about 45 minutes to load up the 8 midi files, a very happy forum member now :)
Congratulations!


Quote
There's a seller on eBay UK selling 13 pin leads for £16.95.

Just use a ohm meter and verify they are wired  1:1 for all 13 pins, no voids, no opens, no shorts

Also verify the large round chrome DIN plug "Shell" is connected to the cable shield and connected to the 13 pin DIN Male plug "Shell"  at each end of the cable - an no where else!

90% of the 13 pin cables sold on Ebay are old Kenwood / Clarion car stereo CD player cables  - you risk smoking  / damaging your Roland 13 pin gear with those

details
http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=1584.msg12986#msg12986


Quote
My VG8 also arrived - it's the EX version and a real bargain at £75, some really good telecaster simulations.

Venture into the VG-8EX's VIO Guitar models  - thats where most of the excitement is for most of our members
http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=12989.0

http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=2602.msg48760#msg48760

 
« Last Edit: April 04, 2017, 02:03:31 PM by admsustainiac »

Offline tonybaskett

Re: VG-88 - Unlucky for V1 owners in the UK
« Reply #14 on: April 04, 2017, 02:14:53 PM »
Hi, thanks for the heads-up ... those cables are advertised as for the VG instruments and manufactured specifically for Roland musical instruments, I've ordered one and will check out the pin - pin connectivity before plugging it in.

Barely scratched the surface of the VG8EX .. will try the VIO sounds next time.

Cheers

Tony

Offline admsustainiac

Re: VG-88 - Unlucky for V1 owners in the UK
« Reply #15 on: April 04, 2017, 02:17:47 PM »
Quote
those cables are advertised as for the VG instruments and manufactured specifically for Roland musical instruments,

Same "scam" occurs here in USA - I only trust my ohm meter

But beware if the 13 pin cable arrives in a bag marked "Kenwood"

Offline scrapman

Re: VG-88 - Unlucky for V1 owners in the UK
« Reply #16 on: August 19, 2017, 03:58:46 PM »
Hi everybody,
My first post here, and it seems my "bus has sailed" too
 ::).
I don't mean to hijack the thread, but I didn't think it worth starting a new one either when it's about the same subject.
I hope that's ok.
I've used my vg88 happily for the last 12 or so years as v1.02.
scaredified by the bricking possibility, I shyed off doing the upgrade, as the thing cost me a smallish fortune back then.
But a few months ago I decided to bite the bullet and get the upgrade done, I'd heard the same thing as the OP.
But, Oops, I got the same reply from Roland uk as the OP too.
I've seen the kits on ebay, but thought I might find the midi files on the web somewhere and also requested to join the vg8 yahoo group https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/vg-8/info no reply (as yet? or is it no longer active?).
as I read the files might be available there (I think I read that here, before joining up).
Ho hum.
If I ever do locate them, I can easily construct the jig plug, but I don't know what the resistor value should be.
I was also told that it's a safer bet to do the update via midi direct from another vg88 v2.
Any help on any of these issues would be a great boon, so thanks for having me here and I hope I can be of somewhat more constructive use to you folks in the future since I do have a fair bit of experiance with gk based units, going all the way back to my first GI10 in the early 1990s.
Ah, them's were the dayz  ;)
lots of great info and resources round here.
thanks and cheers fer now

scrapman
gi, gr, gt, vg, 10, 09, 20, 33, 50, 6, 88,
Lucky for Some, 13 pins.

Offline Gurbz

Re: VG-88 - Unlucky for V1 owners in the UK
« Reply #17 on: August 22, 2017, 07:50:14 AM »
I bought the kit on eBay recently, updated my virgin vg-88 to v2 without a problem.
Let me know when you are updating, the second fase needs understanding how to upload the midi files to the vg-88.
I used a 2007 iMac, a roland um-one mk2 usb-midi and the kit from ebay.

Offline Elantric

Re: VG-88 - Unlucky for V1 owners in the UK
« Reply #18 on: August 22, 2017, 09:14:44 AM »
Just a reminder but -Roland still honors to perform the Vg 88 V2 upgrade for free just contact your local -Roland distributor in your country

Performing the upgrade yourself is a very risky proposition and it's true that most people fail and brick their VG 88 and that' could easily be avoided.
« Last Edit: August 22, 2017, 09:16:31 AM by Elantric »

Offline scrapman

Re: VG-88 - Unlucky for V1 owners in the UK
« Reply #19 on: September 02, 2017, 02:52:05 PM »
Thankyou for those replies guys.
Sorry for the delay in my response, it's been a busy week or so.
I managed to get the answer to my question regarding the jig plug (and constructed one already) by finding a pdf of the vg88 service manual or "service notes" as roland call it.
But also, as you can see from the attached pic,
(I'm sorry, I couldn't work out how to get it to display inline)
the steps are laid out much more specifically in the service notes than stated in the 2 page pdf instructions that seem to be more readily available on line.
Having read both, I'm not surprised so many folks bricked their units.
It's very clear that waiting for the unit to do the checksum calc between each sysex loading is crucial along with a solid midi interface.
I was planning on using my roland/edirol um2 on win7 which has never let me down regarding sysex transmission (yet :-\).
I can let anyone who can't find the service manual elsewhere have my full pdf, just message me.

I bought the kit on eBay recently, updated my virgin vg-88 to v2 without a problem.
Let me know when you are updating, the second fase needs understanding how to upload the midi files to the vg-88.
I used a 2007 iMac, a roland um-one mk2 usb-midi and the kit from ebay.

Thanks for that man,  :-* that's very kind and I may very well take you up on that if I can find the files.
Was the ebay kit you used from this chap?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Roland-VG-88-V2-Upgrade-Editors-Patches-More-/161603886691
I'm afraid I just don't have the price he's asking for at the moment, along with the postage to the uk it comes to nigh on £60 uk.
And, if I'm honest, I kinda resent someone making cash off of something that was available for free anyway.
But if that's all that's available, that's the way I'll be going too.
But I haven't quite given up my hunt for the midi files just yet.

Just a reminder but -Roland still honors to perform the Vg 88 V2 upgrade for free just contact your local -Roland distributor in your country
Performing the upgrade yourself is a very risky proposition and it's true that most people fail and brick their VG 88 and that' could easily be avoided.
Thanks elantric, but unfortunately, I already contacted Roland UK earlier in the year and, like the OP, was told they're not doing the upgrades any more. :(
So it would seem that, at least for brits, it's the risky way or the highway  :).

Also, I'm still waiting on a reply from the vg8 yahoo group here:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/vg-8/
about membership, as you said in an earlier post that the files are available there, but I still haven't heard anything from the group.
I'm not too hopeful, as there has been no recent activity; april 2017 according to the message history on the front page.
FWIW - its still there at VG-8 Yahoo group (I'm sustainiac_93401)
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/vg-8/files/VG88%20Upgrade/
Is the group still active at all, and is there anything you, with your sustainiac_93401 hat on, :) would be able to do to facilitate my membership if it is?
I tried the link, but of course:
"Oops! You need to be a member to perform this action"
 :'( :-\

Wow, this little post turned into a looong one :)
Once again, sorry if it seems I'm hogging the thread and thanks for any advice forthcoming.
cheers

scrapman

EDIT:
Ok, so I've just discovered that I am an imbecile...
I've only just seen the link to the midi files already posted by elantric for tonybasket further up the thread:
http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=20535.0;attach=15622

So now I have the files, the jig plug, proper instructions and a kind offer of help during the process.
I'll get on with biting the bullet and doing the "risky bricksy".
sunday is a good day to fry...
:)

EDIT 2:
All done (pix below), back to twangalating

cheers
« Last Edit: September 08, 2017, 07:19:24 PM by scrapman »
gi, gr, gt, vg, 10, 09, 20, 33, 50, 6, 88,
Lucky for Some, 13 pins.

 

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