VG-8 - Resetting the S-1 card for multiple upgrades - How do I do it?

Started by Moonpool, February 28, 2016, 07:36:20 AM

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Moonpool

I have two VG-8s, one was my original, and the 2nd is the EX.  I had originally expanded my first one via an S-1 card.  It's been years since I used that one, and now, for some reason I don't remember, I must have done a reset on it, and I've lost the upgrade.  I have the S-1 card, and I know there was a way to override the limited number of uses on the S-1so you could reuse it however many times you needed it.  I don't remember how to do the reset and I can't find any of the old paperwork I downloaded and stuck in my user's manual to tell me that.  Does anyone remember?  I think I only have one reset left on my S-1, and I'd obviously like to keep it as functional as possible as the years go by.

Thanks!

Moonpool

I found an old email instructing me to hold down Write and System with the S-1 card installed, then turn on the power.  Hit okay then proceed with the setup.  I did all this, the screen said completed and instructed me to power of and remove the card.  I did, and when I powered back up, I still don't have bank E and can't read a card that has my variations of Bank E patches on it.  It does read other cards, so I'm baffled.  Anyone have ideas? 

Elantric

All I know about S1 update is here

http://web.archive.org/web/20050414090420/http://vg-8.com/upgrade
Quote
A: In early 98 there was much talk of the VG-8 being discontinued. They sold their initial batch (slowly) and didn't know if it would be owrth to produce another. Rumor has it that Aure and the VG-8.com mailing lists letters to Roland Japan did make an impact on the decision not to abandon the VG-8 and to release the EX version which had additional Bank E with 32 new patches and had the S-1 upgrade built in. In early 2000, Roland announced the VG-88 so V-Guita
AFAIK- after the S1 update , you will not achieve  the VG-8EX additional Bank E. This because the VG-8 has less PHYSICAL memory compared to VG-8EX

I've owned both hardware versions and I'm happier with a genuine VG-8EX, because despite rumors of the contrary, there are unique hardware differences between 1995 VG-8 vs 1998 VG-8EX

That's why Roland Service centers have separate Service Notes for each model. 




And most VG-8 info is linked in

VG-8 FAQ
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=11090.0

Moonpool

Thanks for the info and the quick response! Somewhere in the back of my mind I probably knew that, but I've been using the VG-8 EX along with the 99 for so long, I couldn't actually remember.  I pulled out my spare VG-8, which was my initial purchase back in 96, to check it out and make sure it still works, didn't see the E bank and then tried the upgrade.  I guess at some point I should try to find a spare EX, just in case.

Now_And_Then

Quote from: Elantric on February 28, 2016, 08:40:24 AM
All I know about S1 update is here

http://web.archive.org/web/20050414090420/http://vg-8.com/upgradeAFAIK- after the S1 update , you will not achieve  the VG-8EX additional Bank E. This because the VG-8 has less PHYSICAL memory compared to VG-8EX

I've owned both hardware versions and I'm happier with a genuine VG-8EX, because despite rumors of the contrary, there are unique hardware differences between 1995 VG-8 vs 1998 VG-8EX

That's why Roland Service centers have separate Service Notes for each model. 

I am almost positive that both my VG-8EX's started life as VG-8's and were upgraded first with the S-1 upgrade card, and then with a midi file (if I correctly recall) that turned them into EX's. (In fact that is exactly what is stated on the internetarchive url in Elanctric's post.)

I would check but I can not get to either of my VG-8EX's at this particular moment.   

I'd be interested in some details about the hardware differences between the vanilla VG-8, the S1, and the EX, though, because I've never heard this before.


Elantric

Quote
I am almost positive that both my VG-8EX;s  started life as VG-8's and were upgraded first with the S-1 upgrade card,

Not to nitpick, but thats a bit like saying "both my Roland VS-880EX 's
http://www.rolandus.com/products/vs-880ex/

started life as VS-880,
http://www.rolandus.com/products/vs-880/ 

after the software update
http://www.rolandus.com/products/vs-880/downloads/


Compared to a VG-8,

VG-8 OM
http://www.roland.com/products/vg-8/

the VG-8EX has all the "S1 update installed + a different motherboard. lower noise floor, more RAM, with Bank E
http://www.roland.com/support/knowledge_base/201945449

VG-8EX OM
http://cdn.roland.com/assets/media/pdf/VG-8EX_OM.pdf

VG-8 EX service notes
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=11091.0

BBach

A bit off topic, but my VG-8EX has a high frequency whine that is especially prominent on higher gain patches. I took it to the local authorized Roland repair and he was unable to fix it. Seems I remember someone suggesting that this noise is caused bit leaky capacitors.

Tony Raven

Quote from: Elantric on February 28, 2016, 05:35:38 PM
the VG-8EX has all the "S1 update installed + a different motherboard. lower noise floor, more RAM, with Bank E"
Precisely!! ;D This didn't even occur to me until I was reading he EX manual.

The S-1, though an ingenious patch, is still just a software upgrade.

(And I do have some harsh thoughts about the marketing decision to make the S-1 a one-off device... >:()

Elantric

Quote
The S-1, though an ingenious patch, is still just a software upgrade.

(And I do have some harsh thoughts about the marketing decision to make the S-1 a one-off device... >:()

Those were the days when firmware upgrades typically arrived with a new Firmware ROM IC which was sold as a profit center.

Folks forget in 1996 the VG-8 had a MSRP of $2500,and early adopters after negotiating a deal paid $1950 street price.

Roland initially wanted the S1 upgrade at $199 to be a new source of profit, but internet connected members at the www.VG-8.com mail list determined the workaround to allow the S1 to be multi-use, and then distribute loaner S1's to members who requested to "borrow" the S1 upgrade adapter that went into the card slot to perform firmware upgrade to the internal FLASH EEPROM memory.
At least this was a reliable method to perform this task, unlike the 2001 MIDI SYSEX VG-88 "V2" upgrade which clobbered many many first edition VG-88's and contributed so much damage that Roland had to initiate a program of performing the V2 firmware upgrade for free if owners obtained an RMA number and  send their VG-88 to the Roland US headquarters