Zoom G3

Started by Elantric, August 13, 2011, 10:06:10 AM

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Elantric

#25
I view the Zoom G3/G3X as Swiss Army knife.
BTW 90% of the time I simply use them not for Amp modeling but instead as three virtual stomp boxes that can be configured from a palette of dozens of FX , rather like a line6 M5. While I use other gear for Amp sim (Kemper/Bias)
Also when you reach age 60 it's more important to use gear you can read legibly and have access to use all controls  on stage. And Zoom G3 is the best in that category for my needs.

Mrchevy

I agree, it is easy on the eyes, with the exception of the software editor were the amp and effects dials are hard to see even with reading glasses. I can see it working as an "addition to" or a minimalist approach. If my Mustang had a movable effects loop, it might have served my initial needs but it was not the case, thus ,using the G3X with it created a lot of redundancy. For me, the Mustang had more controllable options (inspite of a fixed loop if you want to call it that), midi, and in/out options. I guess its not so much the Modelling in the G3X as it was the functionality of it for me. With the amp models, it was apples and oranges as I don't use the higher gain models and the inability to get the effects where I want them in the effects chain of the mustang without some kind of sacrifice, made them somewhat incompatible, but the G3X is still returnable. No harm, no fowl, just a whim that didn't work out like I hoped.
Gibson Les Paul Custom
Epi Les Paul Standard
Gibson SG 50's prototype
Squire classic vibe 60's
Epi LP Modern
Epi SG Custom
Martin acoustic

Princeton chorus 210

GT100
GR-55
Helix LT
Waza Air Headphones
Boomerang III

And, a lot of stuff I DON'T need

Toby Krebs

Quote from: Mrchevy on November 23, 2013, 10:00:28 PM
I thought I would do a follow up on this G3X after 2 weeks of using it with my amp as I'm sure the world has been waiting with antici.............................pation, of my thoughts  ;) . This is just my opinion and apparently different than those of the masses. I think this thing is basically a teenie bopper toy. Using it has taken me back to the days of DOD pedals and cheap guitars and amps. It seems to lend itself to the beginner rock gods that play 3 chords over and over in garages at ear bleed levels for hours on end while smoking pot and drinking Pepsi, and then finally shutting it all down and thinking " DUDE!!!.......That was an awesome jam". Yes, that was me 30 some years ago ( WOW, where did the time go).

A few years ago, I got a GT10 and discovered the Boss gt forum. This is when I really started to learn about quality sound and tone. It is also where I " virtually" met Gumtown who turned me on to the GR55 and brought me here to VGuitar forums where my new learning experiences grew in leaps and bounds. I have seen reviews and demo of the G3X, some of which pitted it against the GT10 and GT100........."REALLY"?  I've messed with the G3X for a couple of weeks now and got what I thought were decent/ok  sounds out of it, mostly with the amp but did spend a " little" time with headphones and my studio setup. Yesterday, I decided to play around a little with my GR55/GT100 setup and then is when the opinion struck me as the G3X being toy like. There is no comparison period. "But it only cost $200 vs $1400 for the other two". True. Also true is you get what you pay for. Which directly coincides with function.

I have to say that I now know that I have been assimilated into the Roland/Boss Borg collective. While Boss/Roland do have some minor shortcomings in some of their amp models, if you want a Marshall'ish  or Vox'ish or Fender'ish sound, it's there. If you must have a real Marshall, Vox, or Fender sound etc, then buy a real one. Most modelers shine in some way or another but the question really is not "does it sound like X or Y" but more "does it sound good". That is in the beholders ears. To my ears the G3X is typical of a cheap MFX pedal. If you are one who has a distinct sound and you get it from this pedal, great. But if your like me who likes to explore the outer limits of music and boldly go where no guitarist has gone before, your not gonna get there in a shuttlecraft like the G3X, you need the Enterprise. I will be beaming the G3X back to earth tomorrow. Wait for it...........................wait for it.................................. ...Kirk out!

Amen the Borg!!!

Elantric



How to use an iPhone/iPad as a MIDI interface for the Zoom G3 effect pedal.

Ringleader

Yeah that cat made the vid based on a discussion we had over at TGP.
http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showpost.php?p=17035853&postcount=47

BTW it does work with fw 2.0 also. Just patch changes though, nothing else responds that I could find.

Elantric

#30
Lots of Zoom Pedal mods for G3, G3X, B3, G5,  MS-70CDR here:

http://www.ashbass.com/AshBassGuitar/Zoom/index.html






A VG-99 inspired Stand places all controls within Arms Reach


Elantric


BackDAWman

Something I have noticed about the Zoom G3 that will be a plus for some and a problem for others(me!).

I use the class compliant USB midi with my iPad running OnSong to change patches on the Zoom. I also run backing tracks from OnSong. The first time I used this set up I had just finished the first verse when the backing track 'stopped'. I was stumped for a while until I realized the iPad had 'found' the audio interface in the Zoom and decided to pass audio to that rather than the headphone jack.

For my first gig I worked around this by not using midi and having just a single patch on the Zoom. It would be nice to be able to turn the USB audio function off. Does anyone know if this is possible?

Elantric

#33
Quote. It would be nice to be able to turn the USB audio function off. Does anyone know if this is possible?

Read the Zoom G3 manual  - page 24

There is a USB Audio Monitor control ,  adjust it fully counterclockwise to the "0"" Direct" setting to avoid hearing ipad sound 




QuoteI was stumped for a while until I realized the iPad had 'found' the audio interface in the Zoom and decided to pass audio to that rather than the headphone jack.

Many folks use the Zoom G3 as their Ipad Audio interface ( member Myksara comes to mind) just know the Zoom G3 is just restricted to 16 bits over the USB interface.

To learn how to use the Zoom G3 with Ipad as an audio interface  - Read all Mysara's posts here:
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?action=profile;area=showposts;u=3043


Also this iPad MIDI control of Zoom G3 video might be of interest:



BackDAWman

I use the Zoom in the effects loop I put in the GR-55 so I don't want my backing track audio to go through the Zoom.

What I actually need is a way to tell the iPad not to use the USB audio of the Zoom at all so that it leaves my backing track audio to come from the headphones jack or, in the example below, via the USB audio I/F in the mixing desk.

I have a Mackie Mixing desk with class compliant USB audio and I've tried that for my backing tracks. So the ideal set up for me would be:

iPad> CCK > USB hub > Mackie Desk (Backing tracks)
                                   > USB MIDI > Zoom G3 (MIDI PC)
                                   > USB MIDI cable >GR-55 (MIDI PC)
                                                               >TC Helicon Voicelive Play GTX (MIDI PC)

Elantric

#35

AFIAK - the Ipad will always use the 1st connected USB Class Compliant Audio Interface, and there is no way to not use it for IOS audio I/O

So power this first
iPad> CCK > USB hub > Mackie Desk (Backing tracks)


then connect the

> USB MIDI > Zoom G3 (MIDI PC)
                                   > USB MIDI cable >GR-55 (MIDI PC)
                                                               >TC Helicon Voicelive Play GTX (MIDI PC)


admin


Elantric

#38

Elantric

http://www.thegearpage.net/board/index.php?threads/midi-control-of-zoom-g3-video.1033719/page-3#post-16928570
Ringleader wrote>
Any iOS device running iOS7 can act as a midi host for the G3 when combined with:
- Genuine Apple USB adapter (30 pin Camera Connection Kit/Lightning to USB adapter)
- MidiBridge App
- Powered USB hub (provides power to G3 and allows you to add another midi/midi over USB pedal for controlling the G3)

For MIDI, all that works is program change message (No CCs, Tap Tempo, etc.) control received by the G3. The G3 does not transmit any midi messages.

This will also allow a digital fx loop in the G3 post the effects chain to add iOS apps into the signal. So, you could add the best looper ever Loopy HD or JamUp or Bias, or both via AudioBus, and still use the G3 FX/amp sims in front of it all. The final processed signal will be outputted at the G3 outputs just like normal.

Connect:
Gtr > G3 Input > (G3 Effects) > (G3 USB port) > (Powered USB hub) > (Apple USB Adaptor) > (iPad apps) > G3 Outputs > Headphones/PA/Gtr amp

See here for more info: https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=8418.0



http://www.thegearpage.net/board/index.php?threads/midi-control-of-zoom-g3-video.1033719/page-3#post-19617949

jnonis wrote>
Hi, i want to share my little research about how to control G3/G3X using MIDI over USB. This post was useful when I was started to research about it

Past weekend I had a couple of hours to use a UsbSniffer and take a look on how Edit&Share does to send parameters to my G3X and this is what I found.

Edit&Share sends parameters using SysEx MIDI messages:


Pedals:
F0 52 00 59 50 F7   
F0 52 00 59 31 01 00 01 00 F7
-------------- -- -- --
-- Effect (00-05) -- Value ON/OFF (00-01)

Where "Effect" is one of the 6 slots of G3X.

The 2 SysEx message above turn on the second effect of the patch.

Knobs:
F0 52 00 59 50 F7   
F0 52 00 59 31 01 02 54 00 F7
-------------- -- -- --
-- Effect (00-05) -- Value (Depends of effect)
----------------- Parameter (Depends of effect)

The 2 SysEx message above puts the fisrt know of the second effect in 84.

Change effect:
F0 52 00 59 50 F7   
F0 52 00 59 31 01 01 54 00 F7
-------------- -- -- --
-- Effect (00-05) -- Value (Effect number)
----------------- Parameter (This parameter change the selected effect)

Tempo:
F0 52 00 59 50 F7
F0 52 00 59 31 06 08 02 01 F7
-------------- ----- -----
---- Tempo parameter Value (28 00-7A 01) (40-250)


Another interesting thing is that G3X start to send back this kind of SysEx messages after it receives the first one. So we are able to receive the change from pedals, parameters and tempo, but not the expression pedal.

I think this will be useful for anyone building an Arduino based MIDI controller for the G3/G3X.

Elantric

http://www.thegearpage.net/board/index.php?threads/midi-control-of-zoom-g3-video.1033719/page-3#post-20211615
Craven wrote>
Great work on figuring out the midi messages. Over the last few weeks I've been working on a footcontroller with Android app to control my B3 over bluetooth using an Arduino with USB host shield. I though I'd share it with you guys, in case you're interested.
I'm only working with patch changes, since I didn't know you could do more than that, so I might start integrating more functions using those midi codes.

Here's a video I put together:


DIY Zoom B3/G3 footcontroller & Android app
You can check it out at: https://github.com/Craven112/ZoomControl
And check the wiki for more information: https://github.com/Craven112/ZoomControl/wiki
Read the wiki for more info: https://github.com/Craven112/ZoomControl/wiki

Build a Zoom B3/G3 controller, controlled with an Android device.

There have been methods to gain more control by physically modifying the B3 or G3 (http://ashbass.com/AshBassGuitar/Zoom/index.html), my goal was to create a footcontroller that can simply be plugged in the USB port, with no further modifications.
The footswitch controls the Zoom through the USB port and control port and can be used to change patches, simulate the expression pedal (not working atm), and go into the tuner/mute.

There are currently two versions:

Full version: https://github.com/Craven112/ZoomControl/wiki/Full-Version
Standalone version https://github.com/Craven112/ZoomControl/wiki/Standalone-Version
More info

Differences between the two versions: https://github.com/Craven112/ZoomControl/wiki/Standalone-vs-Full
More info on the Android app: https://github.com/Craven112/ZoomControl/wiki/Android-app
General info: https://github.com/Craven112/ZoomControl/wiki
Video demonstrations: https://github.com/Craven112/ZoomControl/wiki/Videos

Contact me: cdeenen "@" outlook.com

sixeight

My son has a G3.  Have been thinking of making the VController G3 compatible,  but it is a lot of work without a proper midi sysex guide...

Elantric

#42
Quotebut it is a lot of work without a proper midi sysex guide...

Agreed - I'll add any additional  Zoom G3  / G3X MIDI Sysex commands as I stumble upon more than I have found below:

https://github.com/vegos/ZoomG3_ArduinoMIDI
===


http://www.thegearpage.net/board/index.php?threads/midi-control-of-zoom-g3-video.1033719/page-3#post-19617949

jnonis wrote>
Hi, i want to share my little research about how to control G3/G3X using MIDI over USB. This post was useful when I was started to research about it

Past weekend I had a couple of hours to use a UsbSniffer and take a look on how Edit&Share does to send parameters to my G3X and this is what I found.

Edit&Share sends parameters using SysEx MIDI messages:


Pedals:
F0 52 00 59 50 F7   
F0 52 00 59 31 01 00 01 00 F7
-------------- -- -- --
-- Effect (00-05) -- Value ON/OFF (00-01)

Where "Effect" is one of the 6 slots of G3X.

The 2 SysEx message above turn on the second effect of the patch.

Knobs:
F0 52 00 59 50 F7   
F0 52 00 59 31 01 02 54 00 F7
-------------- -- -- --
-- Effect (00-05) -- Value (Depends of effect)
----------------- Parameter (Depends of effect)

The 2 SysEx message above puts the fisrt know of the second effect in 84.

Change effect:
F0 52 00 59 50 F7   
F0 52 00 59 31 01 01 54 00 F7
-------------- -- -- --
-- Effect (00-05) -- Value (Effect number)
----------------- Parameter (This parameter change the selected effect)

Tempo:
F0 52 00 59 50 F7
F0 52 00 59 31 06 08 02 01 F7
-------------- ----- -----
---- Tempo parameter Value (28 00-7A 01) (40-250)


Another interesting thing is that G3X start to send back this kind of SysEx messages after it receives the first one. So we are able to receive the change from pedals, parameters and tempo, but not the expression pedal.


sixeight

Here is another DIY solution for patch change on the ZOOM G3:
https://github.com/Craven112/ZoomControl/wiki/Full-Version

sixeight

#44
Zoom G3 v2 MIDI specification.
by C. Feddema aka sixeight (www.vguitarforums.com)
(not complete, but it goes a long way there...)

There are quite a few DIY MIDI projects for the Zoom B3/G3 or G3X out there on the internet. Also there are some parts of the MIDI specification. But I needed some more information in order to get the G3 working with my project: the VController.

I wanted to be able to read patchnames, switch effects on and off and also be able to read the effects type and state. And i have managed to "crack" the code of the Zoom G3. This guide should also work for other devices compatible with Zoom Edit&Share, though some numbers may be different

More information about the VController can be found here:
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=15154.msg130947#msg130947

To understand this guide you must have a good understanding of MIDI, binary and hexadecimal numbers

So I connected the G3 to my Mac and started snooping with MIDI monitor. Opening the Zoom Edit&Share editor revealed the following info.

Program change:
the G3 responds to Program change messages.

Control change:
AFAIK v2 no longer responds to CC messages

System exclusive:

MIDI consists of command bytes and data bytes. All command bytes have a value >=128. This means the 8th bit is 1. All data bytes have a value <=127. This means the 8th byte is 0. A sysex command consists of two command bytes (F0 and F7) and all the other bytes are data bits.

ZOOM G3 sysex messages have the following structure (all numbers are hexadecimal for sysex messages in this document):

F0 52 00 5A 33 F7

F0: start of sysex message
52: Zoom manufacturing ID
00: Device ID
5A: Model number of the G3
33: A command
F7: End of sysex message

1) The editor starts with sending  MIDI identity request message:
F0 7E 00 06 01 F7. This is a message that all MIDI devices should respond to.
The Zoom responds with F0 7E 00 06 02 52 5A 00  00 00 32 2E 31 30 F7.

i have highlighted:
00 The device ID
52 The manufacturing ID
5A The model number

2) The editor keeps sending F0 52 00 5A 50 F7. The G3 does not respond with a message. But it does put the G3 into "editor mode". This means that the G3 will send sysex messages when changing effects and parameters.

3) At the end the editor sends F0 52 00 5A 51 F7 and communication seems to stop. So this will switch "editor mode" off.

4) If the editor sends F0 52 00 5A 33 F7, the G3 responds with the current Bank number (CC00 and CC32) and the current Program number (PC)

5) If the editor sends F0 52 00 5A 29 F7, the G3 responds with the current patch in 110 bytes with command number 28:

00. F0 52 00 5A 28 00 08 00  00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00  | R Z(           |
10  00 00 00 08 00 00 00 00  00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00  |                |
20  00 08 00 00 00 00 00 00  00 00 00 00 00 20 00 08  |                |
30  1C 00 00 20 03 01 00 00  00 00 00 00 08 00 00 00  |                |
40  00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00  00 00 08 00 00 00 00 00  |                |
50  00 00 00 00 64 09 64 00  64 04 14 00 08 20 01 40  |    d d d      @|
60  58 4D 53 20 43 00 52 55  4E 43 48 20 00 F7            |XMS C RUNCH   |

And certain positions there are extra bytes. I will call these "overflow" bytes. These bytes are underlined above. It took me a long time to figure out what these were for. But sysex data bytes can only have value 0-127. This gives 7 bits. But the Zoom wants to send bytes of eight bits. So it will put all the 8th bits of the following 7 bytes into one new data byte.

For example: say the Zoom wants to send the following 7 bytes:
10 00 00 80 00 00 A0
Sending 80 and A0 is not allowed by sysex MIDI convention.
The Zoom will  put the "extra" bits in a new byte:
Byte 4 and 7 are too large. This makes B00001001 = HEX 09. So the G5 will send:
09 10 00 00 00 00 00 20

80 HEX with the 8th bit 0 becomes 00
A0 HEX with the 8th bit 0 becomes 20

Patchname:
Byte 0x61 - 0x6B contain the patch name. with an overflow byte at position 0x65 The bytes for the patch name are underlined and bold.

Effect type and state:
The are 6 more bytes highlighted above. These bytes together with the overflow bytes contain the effect type number and whether the effect is on or off. The first 7 bits of this byte are the effect type. The last bit is the effect state: on or off.

So 08 HEX = B00001000 -> The last bit is zero so the effect is off
The effect number is B0000100 = 4 HEX. This is the PHASE DELAY effect (see effect type table below)

Because there are 108 effects including amp models in the G3, the overflow bytes will be used by the G3 and need to be read. In Arduino I wrote the following code for this (where sxdata is an array containing the sysex data):

      ZG3_FX[0] = ((sxdata[5] & B01000000) << 1) + sxdata[6];
      ZG3_FX[1] = ((sxdata[13] & B00000010) << 6) + sxdata[19];
      ZG3_FX[2] = ((sxdata[29] & B00001000) << 4) + sxdata[33];
      ZG3_FX[3] = ((sxdata[45] & B00100000) << 2) + sxdata[47];
      ZG3_FX[4] = ((sxdata[53] & B00000001) << 7) + sxdata[60];
      ZG3_FX[5] = ((sxdata[69] & B00000100) << 5) + sxdata[74];


6) The editor then reads all individual patches by sending:
F0 52 00 5A 09 00 00 00 F7.
The last 00 in this command is the patch number with goes from 00 to 63 (0 - 100 decimal)
The G3 responds with 120 bytes with command number 08.

00  F0 52 00 5A 08 00 00 00  5B 00 40 13 00 00 0A 00  | R Z    [ @     |
10  03 00 02 00 00 00 00 00  45 6E 50 00 08 08 03 34  |        EnP    4|
20  2D 33 00 2B 0E 00 37 06  00 00 00 20 03 00 00 00  |-3 +  7         |
30  00 00 2A 00 03 0A 00 04  30 00 00 02 64 00 00 00  |  *     0   d   |
40  00 6B 20 5E 04 07 00 01  03 01 00 64 00 00 00 79  | k ^       d   y|
50  08 40 20 01 38 00 30 64  00 00 09 00 00 64 44 15  | @  8 0d     dD |
60  00 30 00 04 00 22 4D 53  20 43 00 52 55 4E 43 48  | 0   "MS C RUNCH|
70  20 00 5C 58 16 00 07 F7                           |  \X    |

The structure is similar to the data of the current patch. The first highlighted 00 is the patch name. Overflow bytes have been underlined again. Patchname and effect type/state bytes have been highlighted.

7) The the editor sends F0 52 00 5A 2B F7, with the answer: F0 52 00 5A 2A 00 63 40 1F 56 00 00 60 00 04 00 64 F7. It is unclear to me what this is for
   
It does looks like sending odd command numbers are requests for data, and the answer has an even command number of one less

8) Switch effect on/off:
   Switch on effect 1: F0 52 00 5A 31 00 00 01 (on) 00 F7,
   Switch off effect 1: F0 52 00 5A 31 00 00 00 (off) 00 F7

   Switch on effect 2: F0 52 00 5A 31 01 00 01 (on) 00 F7
   Switch off effect 2: F0 52 00 5A 31 01 00 00 (off) 00 F7. etc.

   The sixth byte changes consistent for the effect, so 00 - 05 selects effect 1 -6.

9) Set effect type:
   
Selecting effect from the editor:
selecting Comp in slot 6 sends F0 52 00 5A 31 05 01 17 00 F7,
selecting MComp in slot 6 sends F0 52 00 5A 31 05 01 19 00 F7,
selecting ZNR: F0 52 00 5A 31 05 01 1B 00 F7
selecting Pedal pitch: F0 52 00 5A 31 00 01 45  00 F7

So the 8th byte is the effect type.
This is consistent with the effect type list below: 17hex = 23 dec

10) Set tempo.
set bpm=40 in editor sends: F0 52 00 5A 31 06 08 28 00 F7 => 0x28 = 40, bpm=240: F0 52 00 5A 31 06 08 7A 01 F7 => 0x7A = 122, 122+128 = 240,
so the last two bytes in this message are the tempo.

Table: effect types - numbers are decimal:
000, M-FILTER
001, THE VIBE
002, Z-ORGAN
003, PEDAL VX
004, PHASE DELAY
005, FILTER DELAY
006, PITCH DELAY
007, STEREO DELAY
008, BIT CRUSH
009, BOMBER
010, DUO-PHASE
... Rest of the table it in the attached file...

Elantric


Elantric

#46
https://www.zoom.co.jp/ja/G3n_G3Xn_News
https://www.zoom.co.jp/sites/default/files/press-release-pdfs/G3n_G3Xn_leaflet.pdf
New Zoom G3n / Zoom G3Xn
https://www.zoom.co.jp/sites/default/files/G3n_news2.jpg


- 70 effects, 5 amp models, 5 cabinet models
- Up to 7 effects can be used simultaneously*, chained together in any order
*Amp model uses 2 slots and Cab model uses 1 slot.
- Looper allows up to 80 seconds of phrase recording
- 68 rhythm patterns
- Built-in tuner
- Free ZOOM Guitar Lab Mac/Windows software allows downloading of additional effects, amp models and patches

MSRP:  G3n = 22,000JPY ($215)

G3Xn = 24,000JPY ($234.65)
Release date: Late September
News Release (Japanese)

pasha811

It looks like GT-1 will have fierce competition. 8)
Listen to my music at :  http://alonetone.com/pasha/

admin

#48
Too bad Zoom removed External Footswitch jack and  the dedicated Headsphone Jack on G3n  = its combined with Left Output jack on G3N


and Its only $30 cheaper than Zoom G5N - which adds USB Audio (only 16 bit)
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=&sku=1217984&gclid=COX7n6Kom88CFdgNgQodT9cItg&is=REG&ap=y&m=Y&c3api=1876%2C92051677682%2C&Q=&A=details


Elantric