GR-55 -Nylon String Bubbling Noise (GR-55 N.S. Anomalies)

Started by jerrycali, April 08, 2013, 10:31:10 AM

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jerrycali

I am getting a bubbling sound in the background when i use a Nylon string guitar sound -I have tuned off everything except the modeling tone but it is still there - any thoughts on this problem ? thanks JC

Elantric

QuoteI am getting a bubbling sound in the background when i use a Nylon string guitar sound -I have tuned off everything except the modeling tone but it is still there - any thoughts on this problem ? thanks JC

What PU Type? (Piezo RMC, Ghost, Roland Magnetic GK-3 ?


What Processor type? (VG-99 / GR55?

Based upon reading your prior posts
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?action=profile;area=showposts;u=7095

I will assume this is with the Roland GC-1 and GR-55

You should try enabling  "GK N.S." Noise Suppressor on the GR-55.

shawnb

ABSOLUTELY...   Yes, this is an issue with the GR-55.   I use primarily a GK3.

It's easily reproducible if you have the BODY and volume high.   Crank them to max & you'll hear it - any downstream processing makes it MUCH worse. 

Edit...  Better solution below...   To avoid, you really have to dial back on your BODY setting.  Over 50 is unusable, unless you do something to quiet it down like NS or EQ or a filter...    It's gotta be very low, <20 or so, to be clean.

This is not unique to the Nylon string sound, I've also encountered this identical pattern of noise on the Analog-GR as well (though I forget which parameters caused the sound). 

I haven't tried to reproduce on the VG-99, so I don't know if this is unique to the GR-55.   

Address the process rather than the outcome.  Then, the outcome becomes more likely.   - Fripp

Elantric

Also should state that any Hiss & Noise present in your on guitar mounted hex preamp will also manifest as Hiss & Noise present in your COSM Modelling Tone.

In this regard the Graphtech Ghost "MIDI Expander" preamp exhibits more Hiss & Noise, (compared to  RMC Piezos or Roland GK-3 noise), and this is tougher to tame.   

Probably the worst performing "Roland GK-13 compatible" hex pickup preamp (with too much self generated hiss and noise)  is the Gibson Dark Fire / Dusk Tiger+ RIP box+13 pin adapter cable.

shawnb

Quote from: Elantric on April 08, 2013, 10:32:26 AM
You should try enabling  "GK N.S." Noise Suppressor on the GR-55.

The Nylon model is one of two that doesn't have a NS option in its model configs (along with Sitar). 

HOLY SMOKES I THINK I JUST FOUND IT....   MAJOR STUPIDITY IN THE "EXPLAIN THIS" CATEGORY...

I have found a couple of things that seem to remedy it.
  One is turning the AMP on (??? what the heck #1...). 

The other is turning OFF the NS under MOD (What the heck #2...).    Get this - Turning the NS OFF under MOD cleans it up even if MOD is not selected....   (What the heck #3!!!)

Address the process rather than the outcome.  Then, the outcome becomes more likely.   - Fripp

Elantric

Shawn,
Good job  tracking this down. Yes - there are a few non documented GR-55 "bug"s - I think you just stumbled on one.

shawnb

The two voices impacted are 12 Nylon and 13 Sitar - the two 'accoustic' voices without NS options in their model parameters. 

The different NS settings (MOD tab) produce different results, from bubbling to crackling. It's at its worst with threshold ~30 and release very low ~10.  It takes about 10-20 seconds for the noise to appear, and it will only appear after you have played some notes.   But once it starts, it stays. 

As noted above, turning NS OFF (mod tab) or turning AMP ON seems to address the issue. 

I have had the SAME noise and symptoms using the model 18 Analog GR - but I cannot seem to reproduce this at the moment.   Odd, I couldn't avoid it earlier and had abandoned this model; there must be some other setting that gave me grief there...   
Address the process rather than the outcome.  Then, the outcome becomes more likely.   - Fripp

aliensporebomb

Makes me ponder about another bug on the 99 relating to the nylon string model.  Stay tuned.
My music projects online at http://www.aliensporebomb.com/

GK Devices:  Roland VG-99, Boss GP-10, Boss SY-1000.

jerrycali

Thank you all so much for your quick and thorough response - what a great forum and testament to helping one another - the gc 1 and gr 55 seems to be working without gurgling ! again many thanks Jerry Cali

Machh_2

hi !!!

i found the same problem on 12 string steel guitar... if i switch to 6 string, the problem disappear...
But I realized that the problem happens when played chords in the strings 1,2,3 (E, B, G), with repeated notes the problem does not happen. (eg E note on B string fifth fret and played with high E string)
I will try decrease BODY adjust...i really use high values on this adjust...

[]´s

Machh

Spider

Are we talking about something like in this mp3?

Quote from: Spider on October 25, 2011, 04:28:03 PM
It;s sound terrible. Only COSM accoustic with some reverb without any amp. First via USB (-7 semitone down), then via USB standard tuning, and -7 recorded on looper without USB cable connected to computer. Please don't listen my crappy playing -- listen to GR5T crappy sound. When I cut high tones and/or goes trough GR55's FR amp it sound slightly better but not good  enough.
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=4728.msg32160#msg32160
and
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=5267.msg36696#msg36696

Toby Krebs

I have found sometimes the acoustic or nylon modelled tones will sound strange depending on how they are routed through all the MFX/EQs' etc...go to the structure tab in the patch and make sure nothing is going on there. My nylon and acoustics sound great even played with a slide. Good Luck!