Author Topic: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)  (Read 18848 times)

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Offline FishmanSQA

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #300 on: February 20, 2017, 10:48:36 AM »
Well-   my ' Force Firmware Update ' repeatedly fails.   Halts at 49%-  halts at 5%-   then gives Error Code 4500000

My details via FishTP;

Date/Time: 20 Feb 2017 2:50pm
Computer name: XXXXXXXX
Computer speed: 2285MHz
Computer cpu vendor: GenuineIntel
Computer num cpus: 8
Computer os: Windows 7
Computer memory: 16281MB
TriplePlay app version: 1.4.50
App number of bits: 32
Patch caches: 4
Controller version: 2.31
Receiver version: 1.85

Serial Number:  xxxxxxxxxxxx
Controller Radio Channel: -1
Receiver Radio Channel: 58

Hi Colan-

If you are using TP v 1.4.50, then you have the correct version firmware. ( 2.31/1.85). So there is no need to force an update.

Best,
Sara

Offline colan

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #301 on: February 20, 2017, 10:51:18 AM »
Thank you, Sara.  I'm being over-cautious, perhaps, before attempting to use the FC-1.   The ' Firmware Update Failed ' message is a tad unsettling .
Regards.
« Last Edit: February 20, 2017, 12:41:09 PM by colan »

Offline Eastwood

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #302 on: March 09, 2017, 11:56:52 AM »
Hi so sorry if this is off topic but anyways.. can someone tell me where I can find list of all midi CC# and PC's that the FC-1 uses. A midi map I guess.. thing is  I just got a FC-1 but I'm toying with the idea of using my regular midi guitar controller a Boss ES-8 to send CC# and PC to the FC-1 and thus sending the same from the FC-1 to a Roland Integra 7.. not even sure this is possible but I'd like to give it a go. Would kind of make life a little easier maybe in a live rig to just have to stomp on one pedal to change patches on both guitar effects and midi synth patches.. thanks in advance Eastwood

Offline colan

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #303 on: March 11, 2017, 09:56:33 AM »
I read in the FTP section that the GR20 could be used with the Fishman Tripleplay FC-1 foot controller -  but I can't get mine to function.

The FC-1 will move through the GR20s patches but I can't see how to play the FTP MIDI patches stored on the guitar wifi pickup.

Has anybody successfully paired this kit ?   Some set-up advice would be welcomed.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2017, 08:00:44 PM by admsustainiac »

Offline Elantric

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #304 on: March 11, 2017, 01:31:58 PM »
GR-33 works great  with FTP - ( FTP Triggers the GR-33 sounds)

GR-20 I have zero experience with - it was far too lean and striped of user controls and less useful than a GR-30/ GR-33 

but apparently its possible
http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=20348.0

Quote
I can't see how to play the FTP MIDI patches stored on the guitar wifi pickup.


You can't - instead, you play a Guitar with FTP, and use the FC-1 's USB Host to MIDi conversion technology to covert the FTP USB wireless receiver  dongle transmit MIDI Note on / off, Pitch bend  messages to the FC-1's 5 pin MIDI Output to trigger third party hardware synths - in your case the the GR-20 sounds -and use the FC-1 foot switches to toggle up and down thru through the Roland GR-20 patches

You will not get any different sounds

read

Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=13447.0
« Last Edit: March 11, 2017, 04:11:10 PM by Elantric »

Offline colan

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #305 on: March 11, 2017, 02:08:20 PM »
That's not what I want to do.  I can already do that with the Roland GK3 pickup.
I want to play the FTP patches without a computer.

If the Roland GR20 isn't a suitable MIDI inteface to do that then what is ?   Fishman gives no clues.

Offline Elantric

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #306 on: March 11, 2017, 02:27:25 PM »
Quote
That's not what I want to do.  I can already do that with the Roland GK3 pickup.

Not wirelessly



Quote
I want to play the FTP patches without a computer.

good luck

You need to describe and explain your concept of ""FTP MIDI patches"

again - Fishman has provided a  great Guitar to MIDI controller  - and a software bundle ( Native Instruments, IK Multimedia )   that requires a Mac or PC to make those  Native Instruments, IK Multimedia sounds   


But there are zero hardware sound engine provided even with a FC-1  - thus my confusion for what you mean by "FTP MIDI patches" ??

And shows a basic fundamental  confusion on what the Tripleplay  does and does not do

The basic functions of the FC-1 are:

* Provide a USB Host to 5 pin MIDI Interface for the Tripelplay wireless USB  dongle - so you can trigger your favorite third party 5 pin MIDI hardware synth with your guitar

* Provide some foot control,and expression pedal control for your computer running the FTP app and triggering soft synths


At NAMM , Fishman demonstrated triggering a Waldorf Blofeld with the  Tripleplay / FC-1

Again the resulting sounds were from the stock Blofeld presets - not ""FTP MIDI patches"

The Tripleplay + FC-1 makes no sounds on its own.




Quote
If the Roland GR20 isn't a suitable MIDI inteface to do that then what is ? 
Technically in this discussion, the GR-20 will be your "MIDI Tone Module" or Hardware synth.
Read

Building a FTP rig
http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=13064.0


Triple Play with Hardware Synth Is AWESOME
http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=13675.msg100318#msg100318


Vade's Synth, MIDI Build Questions ( Vade's' BLOG
http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=10117.0
« Last Edit: March 11, 2017, 04:16:01 PM by Elantric »

Offline colan

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #307 on: March 11, 2017, 02:44:28 PM »
Not wirelessly, no.   I don't want to play the GR20 wirelessly .  I'm happy playing it with a different guitar using the GK3.

What I'm attempting to do is to use my FTP pickup guitar to play the FTP patches using the FC-1 controller instead of my laptop.   Fishman go to great lengths in announcing this breakthrough-  but give scant little information as to how it's done.

The pdfs lead me to believe that the patches are converted to ' hardware patches ' inside the FTP software-  which I've succeeded in doing and that the hardware patches are then uploaded to the guitar controller and can then be displayed on the FC-1 by means of the WiFi receiver link.  I've got that far-  but how to play them through my amp remains a mystery.
I thought that perhaps the FC-1 patches would somehow over-ride the GR20's internal output and enable me to use the GR20 as a MIDI interface between my guitar and amp.   AS you say-  that can't be done.   So how's it done ?   
« Last Edit: March 11, 2017, 02:46:23 PM by colan »

Offline Elantric

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #308 on: March 11, 2017, 02:49:11 PM »
Quote
I thought that perhaps the FC-1 patches would somehow over-ride the GR20's internal output and enable me to use the GR20 as a MIDI interface between my guitar and amp.   AS you say-  that can't be done.   So how's it done ?   

Apparently its not

You must accept and use the GR-20 sounds
« Last Edit: March 11, 2017, 04:17:14 PM by Elantric »

Offline colan

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #309 on: March 11, 2017, 02:52:26 PM »
You mean I've shelled out over three hundred bucks for a footswitch ?    I can't believe it.
What would be the point of loading the controller with FTP ' hardware patches ' at all ? 
« Last Edit: March 11, 2017, 02:54:57 PM by colan »

Offline Elantric

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #310 on: March 11, 2017, 02:54:47 PM »
do research first

http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=18605.0

The FC-1 does not store sounds.  It helps you play your FTP with a 5 pin MIDI Hardware synthesizer. 

If you want to go without a computer, you want to use the FC-1 to drive a third party hardware synth, like a Blofeld , Korg Microstation, SC-55 Sound canvas(or any one of a thousand other synths).  What synth do you plan on using besides your old GR-20?

Quote
You mean I've shelled out over three hundred bucks for a footswitch ?    I can't believe it.
$199 here
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/TripleplayFC1?adpos=1t1&creative=184490690778&device=c&matchtype=b&network=g&gclid=CI_zwpOrz9ICFYYDaQod_p4Kxg

Quote
Leave your computer off the stage with the Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller. With its USB host, multi-function footswitches, and MIDI I/O you can connect your sound modules and synths directly.


Triple Play with Hardware Synths
http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=13675.msg100318#msg100318
« Last Edit: March 11, 2017, 04:18:14 PM by Elantric »

Offline colan

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #311 on: March 11, 2017, 03:00:59 PM »
Yes, I'm aware that the FC-1 does not ' store sounds '.    The Fishman literature leads its readers to believe that the ' hardware patches ' ( one expects these to be patches playable by hardware )  are uploaded to the FTP guitar controller and can then be played onstage without a laptop.  Nowhere does it state that this is not possible and that the FC-1 only triggers MIDI in FTP-unrelated hardware.
What would the FTP hardware patch upload be for ?

Offline Elantric

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #312 on: March 11, 2017, 03:04:06 PM »
Quote
What would the FTP hardware patch upload be for ?

to store various string splits, transposed tuning setup info and map your desired settings into memory slots - a.k.a. "FTP MIDI patches"

I'm an advocate for diving into the history library  - if you want to be informed and understand and warp your brain on the concepts of  new piece of gear  - read the docs from the prior efforts of the same engineering  team. 

Must read is the Axon AX-100 User manual  - Axon was Andras Szalays prior Guitar to MIDI effort

http://terratec.ultron.info/AXON/AXON_AX_100_MKII/Manuals/AXON_AX_100_MKII_Manual_EN_2.0.pdf

Also important read:  Important FTP documents our admin ShawnB created for Fishman Tripleplay

download them here
http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?action=downloads;cat=28

FTP Hardware MODE
http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=9625.msg69058#msg69058

FTP MIDI Implementation
http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=13653.0
« Last Edit: March 11, 2017, 04:23:23 PM by Elantric »

Offline colan

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #313 on: March 11, 2017, 03:09:40 PM »
So they're called ' hardware patches ' for why ?    For the pleasure of loading the controller with them and then downloading them back to the FTP software ? 

Offline Elantric

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #314 on: March 11, 2017, 03:18:03 PM »
Quote
So they're called ' hardware patches ' for why ?
to store various string splits, transposed tuning setup info and map your desired settings into memory slots - a.k.a. "FTP MIDI patches"
to control third party Synth hardware boxes  / Keyboards with 5 pin MID input





Read Shawnb"s FTP Hardware mode thread
http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=9625.msg69058#msg69058
« Last Edit: March 11, 2017, 04:23:35 PM by Elantric »

Offline colan

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #315 on: March 11, 2017, 03:28:15 PM »
The ' hardware patches ' control third party synths  ?  Didn't you just tell me that the FC-1 is just a footswitch and that the guitar controller is just used to store modified patches outside of the FTP software ?  This isn't making sense.

Shawnb"s FTP Hardware mode thread -  of course-  goes right over my head and doesn't instil me with any confidence whatsoever.   I'm a guitarist/ consumer -  and I feel that I've been mislead.   I'm clearly on the wrong forum for useful practical advice and I'll give Fishman a fair go before trying to get my money back.  I'll stop short of calling the FC-1 a ' scam ' simply because the FTP concept and software are so good-   but I'm far from happy.

Thanks for your help with other matters.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2017, 05:03:52 PM by colan »

Offline Elantric

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #316 on: March 11, 2017, 03:53:45 PM »
Thanks for summing up the typical  MIDI guitar experience.

Quote
  Didn't you just tell me that the FC-1 is just a footswitch
Its a small  computer
The basic functions of the FC-1 are:

* Provide a USB Host to 5 pin MIDI Interface for the Tripelplay wireless USB  dongle - so you can trigger your favorite third party 5 pin MIDI hardware synth with your guitar

* Provide some User LCD Display , foot controls, and expression pedal jack control for your computer running the FTP app and triggering soft synths

Learn about other  USB Host to 5 pin MIDI  I/O adapters
http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=15763.0


Its not "plug & play" , requires  discipline and passion for unique sonic expression  - but even the top artists I run into hire a tech to gather the "gear dujour" and accomplish their goals. 

Fishman has raised the bar with a significant breakthrough - but there are hurdles 


But know this thread will help others.

a year ago a similar situation occurred,

http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=13447.msg135393#msg135393

 
 
« Last Edit: March 13, 2017, 10:52:12 AM by admsustainiac »

Offline colan

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #317 on: March 11, 2017, 07:08:35 PM »
The FC-1 is, demonstrably, presented as a means of live performing the FTP patches without an onstage computer.  It isn't a matter of misunderstanding or stupidity on the part of working stiffs.  It's a misrepresentation -  and I find that quite shameful.   Honest musicians should avoid  shelling out for what is essentially a glorified footswitch.

Offline Elantric

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #318 on: March 11, 2017, 08:57:35 PM »
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/TripleplayFC1?adpos=1t1&creative=184490690778&device=c&matchtype=b&network=g&gclid=CI_zwpOrz9ICFYYDaQod_p4Kxg

I do agree the marketing verbiage at Sweetwater link to  FC-1 stating :


"Leave your computer off the stage with the Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller."

"All-in-one foot controller for your Fishman TriplePlay MIDI pickup"



Is a bit misleading ,  and a newbie might omit believing the FC-1 need for a separate hardware MIDI Synth or Laptop 

FC-1 owners manuals are here:

https://www.fishman.com/products/series/tripleplay/tripleplay-fc-1-controller/
https://www.fishman.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/TriplePlay_FC-1_User_Guide.pdf
Quote
When using FC-1 as a stand-alone MIDI controller (not connected via USB), MIDI information generated
by the TriplePlay Controller and the FC-1 is passed via these connectors.

Should read

"When using FC-1 as a stand-alone MIDI controller (not connected via USB), MIDI information generated
by the TriplePlay Controller and the FC-1 is passed ( to your MIDI hardware synth ) via these connectors."



And FC-1 owners manual is a bit vague on specific details , because there are 30 years worth of possible MIDI Synths  / Tone Modules out there and it would be impossible to cover how to program the FTP/FC-1 for everyone of those hardware synths.


Big list is here:

External multi-voice hardware Tone Generators for MIDI Guitarists
http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=915.msg46894#msg46894

Myself I typically just connect the FTP wireless dongle to an iPad + CCK and trigger an occasional organ or synth string pad for backing
« Last Edit: March 12, 2017, 02:07:15 AM by Elantric »

Offline HCarlH

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #319 on: March 15, 2017, 10:59:02 AM »
I honestly don't see the confusion. It's sold as a controller.....not a tone generator.
There is absolutely nothing about it containing its own sounds. It says in the description you need sound modules and synths.

"Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller. With its USB host, multi-function footswitches, and MIDI I/O you can connect your sound modules and synths directly. The three footswitches let you step through TriplePlay patches and change presets on your MIDI devices."
GR-55 + Kemper Profiling Rack / FCB1010 MIDI controller  -->>  QSC K10 -->> FOH
Fishman Tripleplay
Fender Squier Stratocaster Bullet (w/GK3), Ibanez AM93 (w/GK2) Gibson Les Paul, PV Wolfgang, Stratocasters, Telecaster, Charvel SoCal ProMod.

Offline colan

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #320 on: March 16, 2017, 03:29:55 PM »
I honestly don't see the confusion. It's sold as a controller.....not a tone generator.


You've  misunderstood the complaint.  The impression given by the product description is that it permits a guitarist to play the FTP patches from his guitar controller through his amplifier via the FC-1-  without using a laptop onstage.  i.e;
"The three footswitches let you step through TriplePlay patches "
It SHOULD state " on your computer ".   It doesn't.  If it did then the phrase " without using your laptop onstage "  would be less deceptive.
It's the FTP patches which are of interest-  not controlling existing third-party hardware patches by means of a three-hundred buck foot pedal.
If you weren't misled by the sales pitch then good for you.  I wish I could say the same.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2017, 03:37:19 PM by colan »

Offline colan

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #321 on: April 01, 2017, 05:46:18 AM »
I can't praise the TriplePlay enough, mind.  Using it with the Omnisphere 2 software is a dreamy experience.
I'm looking forward to the FTP software upgrade though- so that I can use it without having to wear my glasses !    Is it due soon ?

Offline musicamex

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #322 on: April 05, 2017, 09:01:17 PM »
COLAN, I too was confused by the initial hype about the FC 1.  I interpreted it to mean i could play FTP patches without my computer making Mexican club gigs potentially less prone to damage and complexity.  I haven't  used my FC 1 or ftp once live and so far just for its admittedly great sounds in my studio.  The gear i was hoping to improve on with the triple play experience, mainly Roland vg 88 &99, really are more user friendly for gigs, despite a 13 pin cable, which really isnt that much of a hassle if you keep contacta clean and strain off the cable ends.  I play more than background organ.  Lots of slide in 5 different tunings.  With the Roland gear and nice thick user manuals, everything but a firmware update went smoothly.  In the studio, playing with the ftp has been fun.  The fc1 is gathering dust.  Actually after my last ftp update attempt nothing works.  I gave up and build my tube amps or guitars, since the grin to groan ratio is much better.  I hope fishman gets the ftp and fc1 easier to use and understand for musicians with limited technical desire or time to burn getting something to work, or like Elantric noted, pay some 3rd party to set it all up.  Hell, at 70 yo i still pack my own gear.  So hiring someone to program my gear is like buying a car only a tech savy guy can drive for me. Isn't that why we pay engineers by buying the products they develop?
If you go back to early posts on the ftp and fc1 you'll see you weren't the only one confused.  I was and bought both, consequently a much more powerful dedicated  windows computer and spend more time reading about it online than i actually use it.  It is clear to me this gear could be the future of midi guitar BUT IVE SEEN ALLOT OF MIDI GUITAR GEAR LIVE VERY SHORT PRODUCTION AND SUPPORT LIFETIMES.  At 70 yo I can't  buy back hours i waste so i will likely wait until this gear becomes more user friendly and use my OUT OF DATE roland and axon gear in the mean time.
RIFFIN


Offline musicamex

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #323 on: April 06, 2017, 08:26:47 PM »
I honestly don't see the confusion. It's sold as a controller.....not a tone generator
.

It is called Fishman Tripleplay Fc1 floor controller.   Why not Fishman midi floor controller?
« Last Edit: April 07, 2017, 07:53:58 AM by admsustainiac »

Offline musicamex

Re: Fishman TriplePlay FC-1 Floor Controller (User Experience)
« Reply #324 on: April 06, 2017, 09:22:46 PM »
Statements like the following posted here by Zoltan, the guy who should know, led me to buy the FC1. 

The concept is that the FC-1 would be primarily used in a live stage environment, where one does not want to edit the patches, just select them and play them. Therefore the FC-1 does not support patch editing. You need the TriplePlay application to create the patches that can be downloaded to the Controller, and later -- without the computer -- they can be recalled using the FC-1 switches.