Midi controller IN the guitar. Has anyone done it?

Started by Zoppe, January 24, 2013, 11:19:05 PM

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Zoppe

Besides a guy using a kaoss pad on his guitar i didn't find anything, i tought it would be pratical to use(and carry around) with our lovely guitar synths... some knobs, faders and buttons! lotsa buttons... could you tell me if it has ben done/if it's possible?

thanks in advance

gumtown

I have thought about this quite a bit,
and come to the conclusion that the only two hands i have need to be playing on the strings.

Some 'thing' in the neck to detect up-down & left-right motion and use that for a midi continuous controller maybe handy,
either a Wii type wireless controller or a X-Box type motion camera.
but I try to keep my controllers at my feet.

:)
When you think about it, that's a lot of functions your body is trying to cope with at the same time.
eyes, ears, mouth & vocal cords, hands and arms, feet, legs to prop it all up, heart & lungs, and brain,
all working in harmony to sing and play.
Free "GR-55 FloorBoard" editor software from https://sourceforge.net/projects/grfloorboard/

musicman65

I use S1/S2 buttons on my Roland Ready Strats to control CC's. The button closest to the neck is just above the 5-way switch and is handy when mapped to the "Hold" function in the Guitar to Midi settings on the VG99. Its close enough to play while holding down and I use it to hold a note or chord when it would not sustain long enough from string sustain. Yes, it changes virtual COSM pickups too but I usually don't use COSM guitar and MIDI together. I use my mag pups a lot if needed.

A few extra buttons would be handy! Isn't there an unused line in the 13 pin cable? It could be tapped and connected to one of the VG99 digital inputs which could then be assigned to a CC. :) I like the idea of an extra maintained toggle switch.

bd

Elantric

#3
If someone was smart, they would redesign a GK3  that used Pin 9  and the pins used for S1 S2 as a smart bi-di 3 wire interface  to provide an additional  8 pots or 8 switches + small OLED display  on the guitar side but feed a smart breakout box which sends MIDI CC#,  Sysex RPN NRPN etc. Via a 5 pin midi out and still have a 13 pin out.

Collectively our forum could make this project happen .

Also we need a US-20 that remains functional after you remap the GK Volume to other tasks.

As things stand now, many 13 pin control functions are clobbered or way too restricted


musicman65

That would be very cool although I'm not sure I'd want another wart on my axe. 1 or 2 more inputs would be awesome though.

bd

aliensporebomb

John McLaughlin and Pat Metheny had a bolt-on controller for the Synclavier II attached to their Roland guitars but they looked very impractical and cumbersome.

I also remember a guitar company advertising a 22 band graphic equalizer that was part of the guitar instead of having a tone control - insane amount of sliders.

My music projects online at http://www.aliensporebomb.com/

GK Devices:  Roland VG-99, Boss GP-10, Boss SY-1000.

Elantric


Zoppe



I have already seen this guy... is there anyone else that uses midi controllers in the guitar? like 5 buttons that would always be assigned to pickup select... change patch parameters on the fly by adding some knobs... could have more uses


gumtown

Free "GR-55 FloorBoard" editor software from https://sourceforge.net/projects/grfloorboard/

Zoppe


PD FX

-Just buy a small arduino, or teensy or the like
-connect knobs to it and a midi out connector
-learn a bit of Arduino programming (it is easy!)
-the whole project costs about 50 dollars, but you can use old poti's and knobs to keep it cheep.
-Bonus: you can say you build it yourself and know how to program microcontrollers!

For a controller with built in small synth you can look at the Admiral Midi project, it is also Arduino based.

I also like to do Glued Controllers, here's my drum setup..




tekrytor

Quote from: Guitarpolson link=topic=7776.msg54862#msg54862 date=13593module73744
-Just buy a small arduino, or teensy or the like
-connect knobs to it and a midi out connector
-learn a bit of Arduino programming (it is easy!)
-the whole project costs about 50 dollars, but you can use old poti's and knobs to keep it cheep.
-Bonus: you can say you build it yourself and know how to program microcontrollers!
....
If you want to cut to the chase, you can use the HighlyLiquid CPU MIDI module, see
http://store.highlyliquid.com
It has a lot of MIDI IO options on board, is tiny, works with standard pots, switches and rotary encoders, is very configurable, has a user forum with active support from the devoted developer, and... it's dirt cheap. You really only need one lead to send midi from the guitar, so you could use a GK-2A and the unused lead on the 13-pin cable, and have dozens of MIDI controls on a guitar. Up to your imagination.

SY-300/BeatBuddy/VoiceLive 3/GR-55(v1.50)/33/1/50/700/VGA-7/V-Bass, Yam-G10, GPK-4, DIY X-Bee HighlyLiquidCPU "Cozy-Lil-Footie", FCB-1010, other MIDI stuff, Godin Freeway SA and various other GK equipped controllers, Sonar X1, Audacity, KXstudio, Misc devices

ploveday

This is something I'm working on as part B of my GR/VG Rack project; using S1+S2 as RS-485 to a Teensy 3 in the guitar, as well as some other mods (rotary encoders, display, etc etc).

I'd be happy enough to open source it and collaborate on this, though, if others are interested.

- Peter

tekrytor

#14
Here's my post about my HighlyLiquid CPU based "Cozy-Lil-Footie" DIY MIDI controller:
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=5831.msg41060#msg41060

I've been too busy/broke/lazy/etc to get back to the xBee part, it's been on hold since then. But I think the 13-pin cable option would work well too. :-)
I'm using it via standard MIDI cable now with my GR-55 though. Lots more control options with it than the 55 alone.:-)  :-)
SY-300/BeatBuddy/VoiceLive 3/GR-55(v1.50)/33/1/50/700/VGA-7/V-Bass, Yam-G10, GPK-4, DIY X-Bee HighlyLiquidCPU "Cozy-Lil-Footie", FCB-1010, other MIDI stuff, Godin Freeway SA and various other GK equipped controllers, Sonar X1, Audacity, KXstudio, Misc devices

tekrytor

SY-300/BeatBuddy/VoiceLive 3/GR-55(v1.50)/33/1/50/700/VGA-7/V-Bass, Yam-G10, GPK-4, DIY X-Bee HighlyLiquidCPU "Cozy-Lil-Footie", FCB-1010, other MIDI stuff, Godin Freeway SA and various other GK equipped controllers, Sonar X1, Audacity, KXstudio, Misc devices

ploveday

I'm not entirely sure what the HighlyLiquid offers over any other microcontroller?  I mean, anything with digital and analogue IO lines can do Pots, Encoders, Buttons etc.

Also, I don't think it has any capacitive touch sensing inputs, and is it capable of driving an I2C/SPI display? Both of which are something I would want.

I dunno, it looks ok for some things, but it's also a little bigger than I'd like in a guitar.

- Peter

vanceg

#17
You could install something like a Livid Instruments Builder Jr board into a guitar.

http://lividinstruments.com/hardware_builder.php

This would allow you to attach buttons, faders, knobs, touch strips, pressure sensing pads...all sorts of input devices to your guitar...

I've done this on a few instruments.  Then I decided that just attaching an iPhone and running something like Lemur or Touch OSC  is a LOT simpler. 

(Just saw this is mentioned a couple of posts up - Sorry. Keeping my post here, though, since it has some additional info on the cost of the Roboguitar)


Electronic musician Moldover showed his latest controller at the NAMM show this year.  This is now a production model ($2700) and includes a....."fairly extensive" array of controllers built into the guitar.

http://www.controllerism.com/moldover-and-visionary-instruments-team-up-for-the-robocaster

PD FX

A pioneer of this is Adrian Freed, (he also designed OSC!!)
look at his lab work, and you'll understand, why I call him a pioneer.
http://cnmat.berkeley.edu/user/adrian_freed/blog/2009/05/09/AugmentedGuitar

vanceg

Quote from: Guitarpolson on January 31, 2013, 01:56:48 AM
A pioneer of this is Adrian Freed, (he also designed OSC!!)
look at his lab work, and you'll understand, why I call him a pioneer.
http://cnmat.berkeley.edu/user/adrian_freed/blog/2009/05/09/AugmentedGuitar

He is, indeed.  The article you point at is only a few years old. I know he and I were putting controllers on guitars at CNMAT in the 90s.... at least a decade before this particular article. 
You might also check out Miller Puckette's work. Miller is now at UCSD and has done a great deal on hexaphonic signal processing.

PD FX

Quote from: vanceg on January 31, 2013, 07:28:39 PM
He is, indeed.  The article you point at is only a few years old. I know he and I were putting controllers on guitars at CNMAT in the 90s.... at least a decade before this particular article. 
You might also check out Miller Puckette's work. Miller is now at UCSD and has done a great deal on hexaphonic signal processing.
Miller Puckette.. I'll check him out, thanks Vanceg

shawnb

#21
I'm still thinking about this a tad...

Is there a much easier, practical setup???   I bet a patch with GK Vol assigned to a filter or two would be fun! 

Also for example, I think it would  *very* fun to play with the top strings, a-d-g-b-e, driving a synth, yet have e (and maybe the a string) xlate strictly to a midi controller, eg, to control a filter cutoff frequency....

Easily done, I think, with an event processor.   Scale the notes to controller values.

I can't think of a way to do this natively in the vg-99 or gr-55, though.   

Might be fun to try....
Address the process rather than the outcome.  Then, the outcome becomes more likely.   - Fripp

PD FX

Quote from: shawnb on February 06, 2013, 07:28:42 PM
I'm still thinking about this a tad...

Is there a much easier, practical setup???   I bet a patch with GK Vol assigned to a filter or two would be fun! 

Also for example, I think it would  *very* fun to play with the top strings, a-d-g-b-e, driving a synth, yet have e (and maybe the a string) xlate strictly to a midi controller, eg, to control a filter cutoff frequency....

Easily done, I think, with an event processor.   Scale the notes to controller values.

I can't think of a way to do this natively in the vg-99 or gr-55, though.   

Might be fun to try....

You can do all that stuff using an simple arduino connected to your normal midi in/out of your GR55.

I've did it in my "sync audio to midi" test, went like this.
My board got the midi out of my gr55, and whenever it received a noteOn on channel 1, it transmitted CC 1 back to GR55, channel 2 converted to CC2 and so on..  Now in GR55 I assigned these CC's to the stringvolumes of the COSM guitar. Very funny effect: synth sounds first, no audible latency. Dirty cheat, but fun.

So you can actually also make a monosynth/guitar that way, just program your processor to just make the last note active.
The best thing to do, is to use a Midi shield on an Arduino, that way it connects easily.

If anybody needs help, just say so, I've the code laying around ( most in AVR gcc, but it's very easy to convert to Arduino style)
But I'll only help with Arduino and a midishield (to keep my overhead low :)








Machh_2

i love the DEVO replic...
where i can buy one like that ?

[]´s

Machh

Elantric