GR-55 - Using GR55 as a stand alone gigging unit.

Started by Toby Krebs, May 22, 2013, 06:17:37 AM

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Toby Krebs

After almost two weeks of writing patches and setting levels I am ready to attempt to do my regular cover band(trio) gigs with the GR55 and a Talk Box. Confidence is high and the ease of set up and tear down /getting home 30 min.earlier/no tube amps and multiple effects boxes to worry about has me excited and a bit nervous.My question to the forum members is this.If I indeed am successful and am able to do my gigs this way, what to do with all the processors I have been using to get around the preset dropout/lag issues of the GR? Using the one patch per song method(The Litesnsirens Method) eliminates that problem completely and I am amazed at what you can do within a patch. More than I was able to do sometimes using two boxes! I have an HD300/GT-10/VG8-EX/2-GR33s'/ME-25/Korg AX1000/POD2.0/Johnson J-Station/Line 6 M13 all purchased and used for cover gigs(not recording,I use tube amps/pedals for that). I would of course keep something as a backup. Any  or all opinions are welcome. Thanks!

IanRamos

Well , good luck Toby ! i'm sure when u get used to it , u gonna have barrels of fun using it live  ( i do ) .  ;)

i been playing live with the gr-55 for a while , and honestly , the only issues i had is with the bloody gk cable and how noisy it got with the time ( bought an spare one from Thomann , is on the way now )

when i use it in my studio for recording is a whole different history , but i found that i can cover all of the sounds i need live with only 3 presets , it's like so :

preset 1 - acoustic guitar and control assigned to boost for the solos

preset 2 - Fender Bassman with very light gain for clean rhythms and control assign to tubescreamer to boost in the solos ( exp. pedal assign to volume when is off , to wah wah when is on ) always use the real pickups , not the virtual ones .

preset 3 - Marshall with mid gain for rock rhythms and rat dist. assign to control for the solos ( exp. pedal assign to volume when is off , to wah wah when is on )  always use the real pickups , not the virtual ones .

now i'm only missing my HD500 when i wanna use the harmonizer ...  :-\

I hope that setup idea can be usefull for somebody   :D




IanRamos

oh , by the way , about your question , i would of course sell all those toys and get another gr-55 to have one home and one for gigs ...  8)

myksara

Ivanlozano:- can you please post your patches, ?
Guitars: Ibanez Prestige S5470, Ibanez Jem 7v, Ibanez JS2410, PRS SE Custom24, Cort  Ltd G16, Ibanez RG370Ahmz,
MultiFX: Roland GR55, Zoom 1on, BOSS GT00
Loopers: Digitech trio+, Line 6 JM4
MIDI:, MAudio Axiom24 keyboard, Alesis IO Dock with iPad air 2

Jim Williams

There are many threads on multiple assigns for the GR-55. I use sometimes all 8 assigns to make my patches as multi functional as possible. I have tried to work on timing my patch changes but with little success. So I highly recommend multiple assigns it is the best solution for live performance. There are some patch creation concepts on making successful patches, mainly use your EQ if you have some high cut it will take out some of the fizz and make the amp models sound more real. remember that the effects and amp models come from the GT-10 so at the default settings they will seem a little week without some EQ tweaking. There are 2 routing options for a good reason try them and use some of the MFX effects too.
Skype: (upon Request)

Everything from modeling to the real deal, my house looks like a music store.

IanRamos

sure , no problem , in a few days i'll post them , along with some demo videos i'm making right now to show the solo distortion patch i got with the gr-55 , wich it took me almost a year fiddling with the unit , but now i got a sound that rivals ( in my opinion ) my solo patch in my HD500 ...  :D


Cricket

Quote from: Jim Williams on May 23, 2013, 04:45:15 AMThere are 2 routing options for a good reason try them and use some of the MFX effects too.

Actually, just to be precise, there are two options for effect structure.   Don't forget that you can send each of the four tones to amp/mod, mfx, or bypass.  This will, of course, have different results based on whether you have selected structure 1 or 2.

But it's absolutely possible to, for example, send pcm 1 through amp/mod, send the model through mfx, and bypass both mod and mfx with pcm 2.   Or whatever.

On the structure page, highlight the routing for each individual tone and use the wheel to do this.

Not sure how many routing options this makes for, but it's a lot.

Toby Krebs

I have written about 45 patches for stand alone use as I need sometimes as an example-Elec.Piano/Funk guitar/Horns and a lead guitar amp tone all in one patch. I used it as a stand alone in a jazz/pop duo for the first year I had it but that only required about 6 sounds/combos.The trio I work with these days plays Autumn Leaves/ Rappers Delight/Semi Charmed Life/Folsom Prison Blues/We're In This Love Together/Jesses Girl/Funky Music White Boy and Enter Sandman etc....sometimes all in the same set so I have to be prepared for anything at anytime.Challenging musically and has always required too much gear on the floor. The GR55 has changed all that and yes I will get another one as I sell off some other gear. Thanks for the opinions and observations and support Gents!!!

Toby Krebs

Update. Not only did the GR55 work well during my gigs Friday and Saturday in front of full houses ...IT KILLS!!! The guys in my band were laughing about my small footprint and having everything right in front of me or on board my guitars via the GK switches and volume control. On Saturday nite I was home relaxing in my chair a full 45 minutes earlier. None of this would be worth the time I have put in and being more organized in my thinking if it didn't sound good on it's own but it SOUNDS GREAT!!!MY basic setup for a patch is Exp.pedal controls PCM 1/2 volume and wah if the song calls for it..Guitar/Modelled tones are controlled by the mag pup volume and GK volume respectively. S1 and S2 are assigned to Amp controls-solo -gain etc...CTL.Pedal is used for MFX Rotary slow /fast when I am using the great B3 tones in the GR55 and of course for other assigns as well depending on what I am doing. I use it to hold string pads a lot. Today if time allows I will start learning how to share some of my better multi patches with those who are interested. It is rare for working pros to have times when life gets easier and a little more profitable but it has happened for me. Should have done this when I first got the thing but old ways of thinking stopped me for a while. Onward we go!

whippinpost91850

Tony. sounds great. I would love to checl out your patches. Paul. It would be great to take just the GR55 for some fill in gigs

Litesnsirens

Yes it just requires getting organized and spending some time to find out what works tonally for amp models with the rig your using.  For example I had to make slight adjustments when I switched from Bose to Line 6 as my main PA,  but it was very minor and really I could have left it and been fine.  Personally, I have gotten to where I put all solo boosts on the EXP pedal switch so as if I was activating the way, if it needs wah, it's included, if it needs to go to sax sound for the solo, that's what I do... EXP switch is where all the solos live.  Different sounds within a song are either on the control of various stages of the exp pedal with the switch off...it just depends how complicated the patch is...

Toby Krebs

Hoping to have time today to learn to upload some of my stand alone patches to the forum. As Litesnsirens pointed out though their are variables that will affect how they will work with your rig-guitar -sensitivities etc...and he is dead right about that. That is why I ended up writing all of my own user patches myself. Nice to be able to play everything from "Take Five" to "Enter Sandman" without switching guitars or playing the piano! Yesterday I had about an hour to just really play for fun with the GR55 configured in this new(to me) way. Loads of musical enjoyment!

myksara

Guitars: Ibanez Prestige S5470, Ibanez Jem 7v, Ibanez JS2410, PRS SE Custom24, Cort  Ltd G16, Ibanez RG370Ahmz,
MultiFX: Roland GR55, Zoom 1on, BOSS GT00
Loopers: Digitech trio+, Line 6 JM4
MIDI:, MAudio Axiom24 keyboard, Alesis IO Dock with iPad air 2

Toby Krebs

Toby is struggling with the patch upload thing and has put out a call for help LOL!!! Out of time for today. May try again in the morning.

Toby Krebs

#14
@Myksara- I have uploaded them to the "other " area in the patch download section of the forum. Hope they are helpful. Good Luck!

https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=8709.0

groovey1

#15
Some great ideas on how to use the GR55 controls for performance, thanks for the tips.
How are you guys changing banks/patches at a gig?

Toby Krebs

@ groovey1-Since I am using S1/S2 on my GK for solo boosts etc...I am now changing banks from the footswitches of the GR55. Press 1 & 2 at the same time to enter bank up/down mode. when you get to the bank you want press footswitch 3(VERY IMPORTANT) and then choose the patch you want.If you press footswitch 1 or 2 again after scrolling to the bank you want it will take you back to where you started the operation. Took some getting used to but I scroll up and down as fast as I did before.

IanRamos

ok as a promised , now that i finished recording some demos , i uploaded my live patches ...

https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=8735.0

https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=8736.0

https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=8737.0

i just used them like : acoustic in preset 1
                                     clean in preset 2
                               distortion in preset 3

i don't use any midi sounds live , probably is fun , but i been playing live every weekend for some 13 years and my whole set is based on that configuration , and just normal guitar sounds ...

one correction to my last post in that topic :  as i made those patches a few months ago didn't remember that actually in the clean and distortion presets i don't boost with tubescreamer or rat pedals for the solo , as i needed to have the mod assign to wah ...

got confused cause in the last solo patch i made , the one that use currently in studio for recording , i use a dist. pedal to boost the gain ... wich make it sound way better , but for live performance i really need wah in most solos , so i had to sacrifice a bit of sound for versatility   :-\

by the way , i also uploaded that patch , is here :

https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=8739.0

Machh_2

Quote from: Toby Krebs on May 22, 2013, 06:17:37 AM
Using the one patch per song method(The Litesnsirens Method) eliminates that problem completely and I am amazed at what you can do within a patch.

How is this method? have some post about it?

tnx
[]´s

Machh

Elantric

#19
QuoteHow is this method? have some post about it?


The concepts are listed in the GR-55 FAQ: Top Things to Know thread.)

* GR-55 Ultimate Multi Control patches (solves the GR-55 long Patch change delay (with mute) issue)

Jim Williams Multi Control...
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=5647.msg38806#msg38806

Guitarplayer_10's Ultimate MultiControl Patch
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=7267.msg50612#msg50612



Toby posted dozens of GR-55 patches he uses at his gig, all include Multiple Assignments using the Expression pedal and CTL pedal, GK-3's S1,S2 switches, provides several tone variations within one patch. This solves the dreaded long mute dead air that could occur if you change GR-55 patches mid song. Just use one GR-55 patch per song.

Get Toby Krebs' patches here:
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=8709.0

Toby Krebs

Had the night off last night and man did I enjoy it. Made a nice dinner for my wife. Fiddled around with my VG8-EX and worked with my Boss RC3 looper that I hope to incorporate into my live rig soon. Besides eliminating the preset lag/dropout/patch change mute problem using each patch as a stand alone and staying in it during an entire song has eliminated the giant footprint I had of the GR55/GT-10 and Talk Box all on  the floor in front of me. Trying to switch all that and play the changes to the tunes and sing a lot of the tunes was becoming more and more difficult.I even resorted to using a headset for awhile so I could switch and control all my boxes and stay on the mic to sing my parts. All this added up to having almost no fun at my gigs. I am going to be 52 years old in September. I have played professionally since I was 12 . To stay in the gigging game it has to be fun. So for me it was figure out a way to have all my sounds as I am known as the guy who plays guitar synth in my area in an easier way that is fun, or hang it up. I considered going back to a simple tube amp -a few pedals rig but over the last 20 years these GR -VG type units have very much become a part of what I do and I quickly get bored when I don't have all the keyboard-acoustic- modeled amps and guitars to use live. So after reading  all the material related to assigns and experimenting with other forum members multi-assign and ctl. patches I decided to see if I could do it and it is going very well. My last 4 gigs have been more fun-more relaxing and just better all the way around re:ease of set up and tear down-smaller footprint-getting home earlier from the gig and still having a huge variety of tones to play covers. Singing which I consider to be a "chore" is especially easier. So if you play "out" and play covers I encourage you to try this method with the GR55. I can actually do more with it configured this way than I can with multiple floor units. Without the "forward" thinkers on this forum I would never have even tried to do it this way.I would add that "Trial and Error" are your friends when trying to figure this stuff out. Thanks to all of you once again!

Litesnsirens

Toby, so glad to hear that things are all working out for you.  We come from the same era, I will be 52 in July.  I started playing in bands at 14 but it's always been kind of a semi-pro thing for me.  I'm the lead singer in 2 of the bands that I play in and carry a fair chunk of vocal duties in the 3rd so I really don't have the option of a complicated guitar rig. 

A few years back I was still using tube amps, and I had a bunch of single stomp box pedals.  Not only is that somewhat limiting but I was at a gig and one of the little 1' cables that ran between the individual stomps cacked out on me in the middle of a set... try diagnosing which one it is in the middle of a set...that was the end of the individual stomp era and ultimately the beginning of the evolution that has brought me to my current set up...

Quote from: groovey1 on May 29, 2013, 08:53:11 AM
Some great ideas on how to use the GR55 controls for performance, thanks for the tips.
How are you guys changing banks/patches at a gig?

I was just using S1 and S2 navigate from patch to patch since I was only ever doing that between songs, but now I have everything hooked up to my ipad which I use for lyrics and song notes.  The app I use is OnSong and it has midi so when I swipe to the next song in the set, it send program changes to my GR-55 and to my VoiceLive 2 to pull up the patches I want for that song.

This makes it a lot easier for me to re-organize sets now because I can just re-order the songs on the ipad and the midi messages that are embedded in the OnSong app follow the song...

Toby Krebs

Now that is very cool! I need to get on the I-Pad thing next and I will use your suggestions for that as well. My drummer uses on song for lyrics and keys to tunes. Tonite I am leading my own trio and that means I am "P.A. boy" . But because of the changes I have made in simplifying the guitar rig side of things that gets easier too! I also have had time to get up to my favorite trout fishing lake here and spend some time at 7,000 feet with no one around. When I was younger I took several trips to Canada and have stayed at the Chilko Lake Wilderness Ranch in B.C. where I caught the mighty Dolly Varden char(it's not a trout) and of course incredible rainbow trout too. After that in my early 20s' I did two 6 month tours of B.C. and went as far as Fort McMurray. Canada is one of my favorite places in the world and before I leave this life I will get back up there and experience the beauty and majesty she has to offer again. Anything I can help you with please let me know.

Peace,

T.K.

whippinpost91850

Tony Krebs
I am going to be 52 years old in September. I have played professionally since I was 12 . To stay in the gigging game it has to be fun. So for me it was figure out a way to have all my sounds as I am known as the guy who plays guitar synth in my area in an easier way that is fun, or hang it up. I considered going back to a simple tube amp -a few pedals rig but over the last 20 years these GR -VG type units have very much become a part of what I do and I quickly get bored when I don't have all the keyboard-acoustic- modeled amps and guitars to use live

Tony, I'm gonna be 63 in September and can't agree with you more. I still enjoy gigging ( I too have been playing gigs since I was 14) But it's gotta be fun. I'm finally down to just my Kemper,Gr55, and the Fcb1010 on the floor, But have been giving a deep thought to doing as you and a few others here are doing and trying to do it all on the GR55. Paul

Toby Krebs

@ whippinpost91850. I was able to pull it off again last night in a small packed club with just the GR55 and the Talk Box and a Roland KC300 amp. This time as the leader on the gig. The temptation to bring along and set up another multi pedal is still in the back of my insecure mind but after I am set up and rolling and folks are dancing, I forget about that stuff. The gig was over at midnight and even though I had to setup and run the PA I was still home and relaxing in my chair at 1pm and that is after driving almost all the way across town. In my car and leaving before the drummer and bass player did. For a cover gig you got to love it. Yes their was one guy who asked where my "amps" were and did not understand where the Hammond B3 tones -Horn sounds and Telecaster were coming from.I explained all that and showed him how I did it. Yes you can do it all from the GR55 if you want to. I am even re-examining my VG8-EX for gigs where I just need straight guitar tones. I am going back into the studio in 2 weeks for another 6 to 8 hour session with the band "Follys Pool" and that is when I will bring out my Egnater Tweaker/JCM800/M13 pedalboard and maybe a Blues Deluxe Reissue too.Getting my "tube amp fix" LOL! I still haven't learned where all the patches are at since I changed all the stuff on the GR55 but after I get that down I can see the "fun" factor increasing even more! And more time for fishing/living etc!