GR-55 - Marc Benigni's GR-55 TouchOSC Navigator for iPad

Started by MCK, February 17, 2011, 03:05:24 AM

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mbenigni

Am I going crazy or did about 4 pages of this thread (including all of Fabien's recent comments relating to his TB Stuff conversions) disappear when it went "sticky"? 

bbob

#276
They were there a few hours ago...I think.

Missing now.   ???

Maybe moved to the other TB midi stuff thread.

MCK

I think the thread has been split to create a more appropriately named one for TBStuff. I think its here : https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=5798.0;topicseen

mbenigni

Ah, you are correct - I hadn't read back far enough in that thread.  There are still some TouchOSC posts interspersed in the TB thread, but it's still an improvement that they've been separated.

Elantric

#279
YEs - I split the TouchOSC thread into the new TB Stuff thread. Our forum admin tools are rather course - and do not allow a selective post by post restructuring , regrouping.

Sorry for the confusion! 
Please review the new TB Stuff thread, and Feel free to copy and repost any important  TouchOSC content that is remaining there, back to here
Mark Benigni's GR-55 TouchOSC Navigator for iPad
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=6501.msg42883#msg42883
TouchOSC thread.

Both threads are now stickies in the GR-55 Reference Library area 

mbenigni

#280
Marc's Efforts are strictly for remote wireless GR-55 Control Surface - not for  Audio and  - Not for playing IOS synths.


Marc Benigni's GR-55 TouchOSC Navigator for iPad is a custom template for an IOS app called "Hexler TouchOSC"
https://itunes.apple.com/za/app/touchosc/id288120394?mt=8


Touch OSC transmits data wirelessly over Wi-FI as "OSC" (Open Sound Control) data messages.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_Sound_Control

The Jabrudian Missing Link Wi-FI  OSC - MIDI converter translates "OSC" data messages into standard MIDI Sysex messages transmitted via its 5pin DIN MIDI OUT jack
http://wifimidi.com/


Marc mounted the Missing Link inside the GR-55 and connected the Missing Link MIDI Out to the GR-55's MIDI IN connection internally.
See Missing Link PCB  mounted inside GR-55 on the far right


Voila! - GR-55 patch Editing using an Ipad mid song at the gig - and no wires needed.














Featured Article here at Peter Kirn's CreateDigitalMusic.com site
http://createdigitalmusic.com/2011/09/rolands-gr-55-guitar-synth-powers-unlocked-with-touchosc-and-ipad/

More info here

GR-55 Navigator for iPhone / iPad
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=3205.msg30263#msg30263


===============
Hi all.  I just got a PM from a new user of this template (now there are *three* of us LOL) which prompts me to post the most recent versions.  Sorry I've been MIA on this for so long.  I REALLY want to get back to improving the template and making some new videos, but distractions abound.  Soon...

Meanwhile new touchosc files attached:

GR55 2011 - the "official" release, i.e. the one that's seen some mileage.  I recently noticed that the GK page doesn't work properly, so avoid for the time being.  On the Amp page, I recommend replacing "1 - 1", "1 - 2", etc. with your own patch names to make your life easier.  (You can use different labels and patch numbers for different projects, and just save these as different templates to call up as needed.)

GR55 2011 plus XY - same as above, but with 2 new pages: a full-screen XY pad assigned to CC1/2, for use with Assigns, and another with 4 XY pads assigned to CC1/2, CC3/4, CC5/6 and CC7/8 respectively.  On the full-screen XY page there are switches to turn Assigns 1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8 on/off as ganged pairs, so that the pads can be repurposed on the fly.  I haven't tested any of this yet, but I think the possibilities could be pretty wild.  Many thanks to the user who requested this!

GR55 2012 (pre-beta :) ) - Similar to GR55 2011, but I'm halfway through reworking the PCM UI.  You will be able to select PCM1 and 2 tones from the same page, and each will have a dedicated page for deep editing, with much bigger controls, and faders in place of rotaries.  (TouchOSC rotaries look the business, but when there are so many small controls on screen, they're pretty much impossible to use.)


Now maintaining a single, up-to-date attachment.  Also - new videos and screen caps on page 2.

Have fun!

daltron

#281
thanks so much!! i was so fed up with using the menus on my gr55 that it was stopping me from creating sounds!! ive used plenty of menu driven music gear but the gr55 is easily the worst!!
cant wait to check your new pcm pages.. from my limited experience with the first version the horizontal faders were a bit tricky to accurately select pcm tones. would love a button page like the amps, maybe i can get editing!!! thanks again!


Elantric

#282
I belive the only "hurdle" for folks who wish to use marks (mbenigni) GR-55 OSC Template on the iPad is this system still requires using the Jabrudian "Missing Link" wireless OSC to MIDI convertor to feed the MIDI Input on the GR-55.

Look back a few pages here:
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=3205.msg30038#msg30038


mbenigni

#283
Quote from: daltron on June 13, 2012, 02:46:31 PM
cant wait to check your new pcm pages.. from my limited experience with the first version the horizontal faders were a bit tricky to accurately select pcm tones. would love a button page like the amps, maybe i can get editing!!! thanks again!

Still very much a work in progress, so you may be disappointed with them for the moment.  I'll have an update up within the next couple of days.

However, the new design still has those same horizontal scrollbars for tone selection.  I agree, they are inadequate, but they're the best I can do within this framework (i.e. GR55 f/w and TouchOSC.)  Ideally, you would be able to select from one of the categories (ac. piano, el. piano, etc.) and then increment up and down within them.  But the GR55 doesn't allow for incremental selection on this parameter (it should be an option on ALL parameters, or one of the Assign types along with toggle/momentary!)  It would also be helpful to have descriptive feedback as to which tone you've selected, but TouchOSC won't store/retrieve this information, and there is no communication FROM the GR55 TO the iPad.  My workaround - when needed - is to keep the GR55 on the Tone tab in Edit while I'm selecting tones, so that I can see the names on screen.

A bank of labeled push buttons would be much easier if there were a workable number of selections, but as it is there are hundreds and hundreds.  The only reasonable way to make this work is to sort out a hundred or so favorites, and program the buttons to correspond.  It is really easy to put a button on-screen, copy and paste the sysex from one of my faders, and replace the range e.g. "x(0...nn)" with the tone number.  I've done a few of these in different versions of the template, for instance, to have a specific drum kit on hand in a hurry.

QuoteI belive the only "hurdle" for folks who wish to use marks (mbenigni) GR-55 OSC Template on the iPad is this system still requires using the Jabrudian "Missing Link" wireless OSC to MIDI convertor to feed the MIDI Input on the GR-55.

It's the only solution I can personally vouch for, though there are probably some wired interfaces out there that support SysEx over OSC at this point.  IMO the Missing Link is a great value, but if you buy it just for this purpose, make sure you understand the limitations first: no Assign configuration, one-way communication from iPad to GR55 only.

I'd still like to jump ship to Fabien's TB MIDI Stuff at some point - he's much more active in adding new features and responding to requests.  (He's actually got bi-directional communication working to some extent, which is a HUGE improvement.)  But there are a few challenges for me:  the Missing Link does not yet support bi-directional SysEx, which defeats the purpose for me.  And even though I think TB MIDI Stuff's on-screen (iPad) template editor is superior to a separate PC editor in theory, I find that I struggle to work with these very complex templates without a mouse and mechanical keyboard.

mbenigni

#284
Update:  Replaced the "pre-beta" 2012 file above with a "beta" 2012 plus XY file.  This includes both of the new XY pad pages, improvements to the PCM 1 deep-editing page, a new PCM 2 deep-editing page, and proper tabs/labels for all of the above.

The PCM editing should be much easier with these new pages - much bigger controls and very few rotaries.  I've tried to arrange things so that they make better sense (to me anyway) in terms of workflow.  Let me know what you think!

mbenigni

#285
New attachment "GR55 2012 Overhaul.touchosc."  I'm rethinking the way much of the real estate is being used on the main "Amp" page, and elsewhere, moving things around to get controls that I use live front and center... and larger, of course. 

Lots of visual changes, some improvements in the way controls are combined, etc.  For instance, I have long hated the L/M/H Gain switch in combination with the Gain control, it's just not intuitive for me when I'm trying to get a feel for an amp model.  The new amp controls feature 3 gain faders, in a staggered layout, so that you can select the gain structure and gain amount in one touch.  Similar tricks to make boost and distortion/overdrive easier to deal with in a live situation.

On the "Patch" page:  BE CAREFUL WITH THE RED EDGES on the patch buttons!  These write current settings to the corresponding patch without prompt or warning!!!!  (I advise anyone using any of these templates for the first time to backup their GR55 first!)

* Patch navigation bug fixed 6/22 9:45P EST.
* Improvements to naming accuracy, patch saving safety (write key moved to left, away from naming controls), and MOD Block Parametric EQ 6/23 12:00PM EST.

ngoldpdx

#286
I got your templates working in TB midi stuff iPad, and want to thank you for you work. this is such a powerful tool.

I saw you updated the OSC template. Is this available for the TB app?

The controls are pretty intuitive, but many items need explanation. Any support docs?

Neil

mbenigni

#287
Hey, Neil - thank you for your interest!

I'm not actually involved with the conversion of the TouchOSC templates to TB MIDI Stuff.  To date, Fabien has been doing these conversions as his schedule permits.  I'd recommend asking him in his TB MIDI Stuff thread:  https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=5798.0  (TB MIDI Stuff is awesome - in many ways superior to TouchOSC - but I haven't had time to become sufficiently adept at building these complex templates by hand on the iPad screen.  I believe Fabien has an automated or semi-automated method for converting TouchOSC templates to TB MIDI.)

There is no documentation for these templates, and it's not likely there ever will be.  Apologies for that, but it would just be an incredibly time-consuming endeavor, and I've developed the templates themselves free of charge.  They're a labor of love - the only compensation is that I get to use them!  :)

Besides which, if I were to document this work, 90% of the information would be similar or identical to what you'll find in the GR55 manual, albeit in a different order.  So I guess my best advice is:

- Know the GR55 inside and out.  That goes without saying, of course, but I believe the better you understand the GR55's architecture, the more intuitive this editor will be.

- BACK UP your patches, and then experiment!  This is the easiest way to clarify the purpose of any controls that seem unclear.  But do backup - it's very easy to overwrite a patch with a single touch of the screen with this editor running.  No prompts, no warning shots.  :O

- While experimenting, it's often helpful to have the GR55 itself in edit mode and on the appropriate tab, so you can confirm that the paramater you think you are changing is in fact changing.  This is also useful for settings (e.g. PCM tones) that don't give you any specific feedback as to which value has been selected.

And most importantly:  while I don't intend to write formal documentation (sounds way too much like a job LOL), I am more than happy to answer specific questions.  Just post them here. 

(You can also see brief demonstrations on YouTube if you search for "GR55 TouchOSC", but I haven't gotten much further than a basic introduction so far.)

ngoldpdx

#288
Thanks for the reply.  I do have Touch OSC app, so I may check out this update..

My main Question was, is there facility in your template for having a exp pedal light on/off setting for each state?

And how do you assign the CTRL pedal?

Neil

mbenigni

#289
Hi Neil.  I'll take my best shot at each of these, though I'm not 100% clear on what you're asking:

QuoteMy main Question was, is there facility in your template for having a exp pedal light on/off setting for each state?

If you're asking whether a control on the iPad screen can light up to indicate the Exp pedal status, then no.  All communication in TouchOSC is from the iPad out to the GR55.  I generally don't even bother to connect the GR55 MIDI Out port to the Missing Link, so if you think in terms of signal flow, that should make the limitations pretty clear.

However, there are switches on the iPad screen that control the on/off state of the Expression pedal if you happen to want to control it remotely, or change its default before storing a patch.  The original one can be found on both the old and new versions of the template, on the "Exp" page, to the right of the label that says "Expression Pedal Switch" at the top of the page.  This should be pretty self-explanatory if you experiment with it.  The new version of the template has a copy of this switch on the Amp page - at the bottom edge and toward the left side of the screen.

If you're talking about setting up the function of the Exp Pedal when On vs Off, then read on...

QuoteAnd how do you assign the CTRL pedal?

OK... this is a loaded question.  I'm not sure how familiar you are with the GR55 so it's difficult without writing a book.  First of all, you can't program what Roland calls "Assigns" with this editor.  You'll need to do that by hand or with gumtown's Floorboard app.  Once they are programmed, you can turn them on or off with the switches (marked "Assigns") - on the FX page in the old template, and on XY1 in the new one.

However... you CAN use most of the CTL pedal targets that are configured on the CTL page in the GR55 (confusing, but these are two different things...)  Go to the CTL tab, and select the target function with the slider on the left.  For Hold and Tone Switch you can select related settings with the two color-coded blocks immediately to the right.  S1, S2, GK Volume behave similarly.  The Exp Pedal (for both on and off states) works the same way on the next tab to the right.

I hope that clears things up.  Again, this is very difficult without knowing how familiar you are with the GR55 itself, but I think if you spend some time crawling through the GR55 menus, and looking at my editor at the same time, the light bulb will eventually go off.  When in doubt, experiment and see what happens on the GR55 display.

ngoldpdx

#290
Thanks, this is exactly what I needed. Reading through the threads I see yr enthusiasm over working with the GR this way, and I share it, and gladly consume yr efforts.

Even using a small subset of the commands is very powerful, tweaking on the iPad is as fast as it gets. I've already created some cool patches I would have never done otherwise.

I wrote to the TB Midi guy and he said he's busy working on an update and has no time to port your update. I would like to try it with Touch OSC. I perused this thread, but am not clear, can I use this with Osculator, or any other OSC to midi translator, or do I have to get the box?


mbenigni

#291
Quotecan I use this with Osculator, or any other OSC to midi translator, or do I have to get the box?

That's the million dollar question.  I have never tested Osculator myself (to me, the need to have a Mac or PC running additional software alongside the iPad would defeat the purpose) but I suspect it would work if properly configured.

As for other OSC to MIDI adaptors, it depends on whether they will support SysEx via OSC.  The question has come up again and again on this forum, but no one has been able to confirm that any of the available wired adaptors function in this regard.  I tested the Camera Connection Kit, but it was only able to transmit straight MIDI CC messages, not SysEx.  The Missing Link setup is the only configuration that's worked for me. 

I seem to remember TouchOSC being very reasonably priced - somewhere around $5, so the risk in testing is fairly minimal.  Just bear in mind that if you're already used to TB MIDI Stuff with Osculator, you may actually lose some functionality if you switch over to TouchOSC - most notably, the ability to pull settings from the GR55 into TB MIDI Stuff.  If TB MIDI is working for you now, there's no harm in just continuing with it - differences between the new template and the old one are primarily cosmetic.

x0091935

#292
Please can anyone...help me... i use tb midi...to link with a usb to midi cable the gr to a ipad...now i'm trying the touchosc...but can't link it...can you  help me? is there any version that is able to link it?
Amps - Fender 212 DSP, Peavey Rage 158 and Kuston Defender 112
Pedals - Boss GT10, DD20, RC-30, Volume, Tc electronic NovaDrive, polytunner, Crybaby wha wha 535q, Digitech RP 80 and Roland GR-55
Guitars-Epiphone Swingster, explorer, Yamaha APX50, Gibson Les Paul, Fender Tele e Stratocaster

Elantric

#293
You MUST use the Jabrudian "Missing Link" OSC/MIDI Translator to make Touch OSC "talk" to the GR-55 using the control templates that mbenigni has created and provided here.
http://wifimidi.com/


Go back and re-read all prior posts in this thread where this is all explained.

teleholic

#294
a cheaper alternative would be to get a usb to midi cable that transmits sysex..you should be able to get the template on tb midi to work..i can confirm the emu xmidi 1x1 tab works and Galvonot here has the older version (non tab) working with midi touch..

mbenigni

#295
Quoteusb to midi cable that transmits sysex..you should be able to get the template on tb midi to work

All true, but the folks above are asking specifically about TouchOSC, because these templates are somewhat more inclusive.  The SysEx limitation is a real drag.  I don't know why it's so hard to find an interface that can handle this.  So far the Missing Link is the one.

Meanwhile, I'm (not actually very) patiently waiting on Jabrudian to release a firmware update that allows the Missing Link to receive SysEx, so that I can try to get the on-screen controls to reflect GR55 settings automatically, be it in TouchOSC or TB MIDI Stuff.

Elantric

#296
Quotea cheaper alternative would be to get a usb to midi cable that transmits sysex..you should be able to get the template on tb midi to work.

Yes - There is separate area to discuss Fabians' TB MIDi Stuff here
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=5798.0

Elantric

#297
Another thought as a possible replacement for the Missing Link OSC to MIDI translator hardware is an app called   

OSCULator
http://www.osculator.net/

About OSCulator

OSCulator is the missing link between your controllers and your music or video software. For example, you can use your Nintendo Wiimote or Apple iPhone with Ableton Live or any MIDI compatible application, with ease.

OSCulator supports the OSC protocol which makes it able to be used with a wide variety of software and devices like Processing, Max/MSP or the Lemur multitouch controller, even the TUIO protocol.

Key features

    Supports nearly all Wiimote extensions: Motion Plus, Guitar Hero World Tour Guitar and Drums, Nunchuk, Classic Controller and even the Balance Board.
    Bi-directional MIDI with TouchOSC
    Wacom Tablet
    Symbolic Sound's Kyma workstation
    TUIO / reacTIVision
    Space Navigator
    Mouse / keyboard control
    Advanced OSC routing





mbenigni

#298
New screen caps to bring this up to date. 

First page is now dedicated to patch navigation - you can switch between patches, rename, normalize patch volume and write (without prompt - BE CAREFUL) from one page.

Amp page has a facelift with bigger controls for mixing various voices, easier selection between gain channels and more.  Similar organizational improvements on all pages.

Deep editing for PCM is totally overhauled for ease of use.


mbenigni

#299
...and control/ "meta-control" stuff: