GR-55 - Why I returned my GR55 and Went Retro

Started by Davis, December 04, 2012, 11:25:20 PM

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Fusion

#100
Been reading through the first post and I get a lot of the issues. The chap was quite erudite and insightful.

I dare say when one first gets the unit, the editing seems overwhelming and the on board sounds pretty useless for my level and wants of playing. I get that in spades. I was excited about the unit at first having had a GR33 which was rather fun, but the tracking left much to be desired. I am one of those reading and research chaps who likes to investigate and find information to develop my understanding of anything. I had been reading the manual and watching videos before I got the unit, preping myself for what I knew would be hours and hours of "headphone" editing.

I was not a fan or had much need to mess with the COSM section of the 55, which many love it and opt into the GP unit for more. Having a fully developed guitar pedalboard with hand selected tried and proven selections more of the "boutique" level I had no need for various guitar mimics and amp models of which I had grown tired of with various "modelers" like the POD. Once I tried a few things like the 12 string and alternate instant tunings I got rather fond of using that in some of my presets which were issues outside the capability of my std guitar rig.

That being said, three things come to mind regarding the complaints:
1.) The Graphic software editor (hail, "gumtown") makes the unit worth having for my view. Editing was a dirge through the unit and not that understandable. My keeping the unit was largely a result of the PC editor software and the insightful papers and documents I found on this site (internally grateful, chaps!)

2.) Roland indicates the focus of the 55 was more to the PCM synth side of things not the COSM. Acknowledging the popularity of such modeling is undeniable, from my use I had no need for all the amp things and whatnot. But, now I find the various BASS, 12 String and alternate tunings to be priceless, as well as using some of the COSM guitar sounds like sitar and synth to enhance and compliment the PCM voices. I think that may have been the intent of the design.

3.) Everyone knows the factory preset stuff is pretty useless for the more evolved player. As far as editing and creating, that is the whole point of the unit from my view. Spending the time and effort to develop tones for your own use it where it is at and that being said, indeed, many may not suffer the time and effort to develop them. This age of player seems to be of the "sounds like" mimic thing looking for easy plug in and play presets of an artist or a song, for me the exact opposite field of view I am looking.

The "sounds like" realm for me is developing a full on orchestrated multi string D modal rendering of Pagey's Kasmir. Or a beautiful 12 string steel fullness of a "Over the Hills and Far Away with subtle string pad ambient before switching to my std rig for the hard core gain section. Which you could do on the COSM side of things but much like our original poster I get the feel and touch of the traditional guitar pedalboard and effects, various amp gains and overdrive tones. Something different about the COSM thing. i had developed an array of weird picking, muting and playing techniques of feel and touch that I used to advantage on my various gains and drives, I found a lot of the COSM stuff to hate that, suffering false triggering, which really goes nuts on the PCM synth side of things. You just have to change the way you play various other instrument mimics which only makes sense. Stop trying to play like Ingwie on a slow string patch and bitching about the "tracking". Sometimes the latency argument gets a little out of hand, some instruments have an inherent minute lag integral to their natural envelope and sound. You have to feel that and compensate for the touch. Having a zero latency sax thing and other stuff seems to be the source of frustration trying to get a natural sounding instrument without having the natural elements of said instrument. My view anyway.

I am only happy using the COSM for Bass tones on my guitar, easy 12 string and alternate tuning things. Most others are novel but that all that important for me as I am not trying to use the unit as a core branch center.

So I recommend the unit for a few players who are looking for the next level of adventure in the guitar realm, willing to take the time and effort to expound on the current level of development in the hopes that they continue developing the guitar synth and the next possible rendering will be as advanced as the 55 is to the 33.
This is a fun unit and the PC/Mac editor essential you can do some very amazing things with this puppy but do not imagine it is a plug in and play unit not only will you be disappointed but the vast potential of the unit will never be realized.

So in closing I keep my "Retro" and I add the new GR-55 not to replace or create a core branch unit but to combine with and enhance my normal guitar rig as accompaniment.
"Long ago in days of old when magic filled the air..."

Phatstrat

#101
JK Picker and Fusion said it for the reason for keeping a GR55.  I find the responses from a live audience is amazing and encourages my continued use of the GR55, while other musicians will nick-pick and purest delude themselves that it is not real.  Nonetheless, digital modeling, PCM and COSM are here to stay and it's the only way to bring versatility to most boring 3-hr/4-hr gigs and one trick pony bands.  The GR55 will frustrate you and make you get a refund if you think its just plug and play.  If it was that easy, everyone would be using guitar synth.  So, it's not for the masses and here is why:

1) First of all, its all about your understanding, knowledge of the style and nuances of other instruments and switching playing them instantly.  If you are clueless to these concepts, do your home work and don't buy a GR55 because you will sound like a keyboard player performing guitar solos and worse. 
2) If you don't understand some music theory about how different instruments play, sound, intervals and inverted chords and harmonies don't buy one and think it's going to be automatic because you will sound like a guitar player playing base or a guitar player strumming a banjo (like ome famous female star).

3) For the GR55 PCM tones, you will need a flat reference amp (keyboard amp minimum with two channels minimum). Four channels works for the COSM tones also but lack the vintage warmth Go to lumberjack and snake your cables into power and signal for a 5-min set up time max.

4)  Get a tube amp for the COSM and real guitar tones for that. Jwarmth you get from tubes 12AX7, 6L6 and El34, etc.. 

5)  Half  the frustration starts.  Make sure your controller (Guitar or GC-1) is set up correctly.  Be ready to put in 6 months on and off listening and comparing tones.  Learn what functions the factory tones have that you can use, and come close to what you want, save them to USER. Forget about the rest.  Wish Rowland didn't waste so much space with factory junk. !!Never use head phones!! NEVER!!.  Always tweak your tone at stage level or at a nearby live jam on in your garage or at a  church or a a renta studio.  This is priceless.  Then record some backing tracks and test your tone against them.
If you skip any of the above, you won't be happy as stated in all the negative messages.

6)  Advance switching: After perfecting your 15 favorite tones, back them up to prevent you from starting over.   Use a Line 6 HD500 with the midi controller midi-out to GR55 midi-in for 13-patch CC# change. Use midi from line 6 midi-out Channel 1 and into the GR55 midi-in.  See which GR55 patch location is selected when a Line 6 HD500 push button is depressed.  Move your GR55 favorite patches to those locations that the Line 6 HD500 triggered.   Your line 6 HD 500 will make 13 foot switches and 13 GR 55 custom instrument patches available live. Don't use the Line 6 HD500 looper switch because it does not support midi control.  Read the Line 6 HD500 manual about assigning patch numbers that is compatible with GR55 midi control range numbers.   Use the GR 55 Ctl and Expression pedal during live performance for volume, Leslie speed, layering tone, etc.  while the Line 6 HD500 will select patches no its expression pedal will perform CC:7 and 11 Percentage of volume  and expression.  Use your GR55 four push buttons to add variance to your custome patches; on either side of B3 is rock organ, church organ and chorus organ.  This is great for different pianos or different acoustic guitars.  It's all about organization so it becomes muscle memory when on stage live. 

7)  Once you get the hang or you have gotten this far, you won't be getting a refund and it's time to  add an outboard sound card to layer with the GR55; any rack mounted midi driven sound module (keyboard brain) will suffice.   Try try this Sound card midi-out to midi merger midi-in-1 and GR55 midi-out to midi merger-in-2. Then, midi merger-out to sound module midi-in and sound module midi-thru to GR55 midi-in.  Everything controls every thing and you will never be out of position during a gig. 
Blend your awesome tones, record and fine tune.  That's all there is to it.  If you don't want to get this involved, don't purchase a GR55.  Once you switch, you will not go back. You will be a better musician - no more vertical playing because now you will learn breathing and warmth. 

8) Labels and (2) snakes will make you efficient and fast and it become a no brainier.  That's my experience - no lie.  I am so impressed with this setup, I purchased a backup GR55 (black and blue wallet) but no more worries - it's all about just playing and creating.  I have the X-Factor - the smaller the band, the better.  My keyboardist sounds like he has four hands... Plus some songs don't need guitar but when it does, there is nothing like a guitar. 

9) to keep this short,  I have skipped some small steps but gain is never achieved without some pain.  The GR55 will definitely separate the sheeps from the goats. Why worry about what it doesn't have, there is enough to keep you frustrated.  Who needs more frustrating features.  Enjoy!

Toby Krebs

These last couple of posts say it all and very well. My value in the marketplace has increased tenfold because of my diligence and use of the guitar synthesizer.Yes you need some chops/theoretical knowledge and some other stuff too. Being able to play a layered synth and lead guitar tone during my solos on funk tunes and then play funky horn ensemble stabs means I never ever get bored.However if I had not cut my teeth playing jazz charts and Chicago /Blood Sweat. and Tears Earth Wind and Fire tunes as a teenager in horn bands with horn players I would not have a grasp of how to do all that stuff with my synth. That is only one example .I could post 20 more.

mapperboy

#103
Thanks for all the previous posts!
We musicians often become attached and emotionally married to the cultures (both human and technological) surrounding a style of music and we are often very hesitant to break up the marriage.  Some musicians like to continually experiment and challenge themselves and are fairly culturally agnostic, and some like to stay in a familiar, comfortable groove all their lives.
I've always been awed by the guy who can pick up a old $10 Silvertone electric (opps those are now eBay collectable!) plug into a crappy amp and because of his soul, passion and flexibility in technique manage to make it totally work to produce his sound.  Recently doing to some back line setup work at a local jazz festival I watched Christian McBride pick up a locally supplied double bass which he hadn't adjusted or previously touched and after a quick pick-up level check with the monitor board guy, just start wailin' out his amazing bass lines and chops.  I don't think it wouldn't really matter what bass you threw at him, he could express himself through just about anything.  On the other hand I have friends who can't seem really play and feel comfortable unless they've got a '59 LP Goldtop plugged into a $5,000 vintage boutique tube amp.
I don't think I'll be trading my GR-55 and VG-99 anytime soon, I'm just beginning to understand them separately and in combination (Using the VG-99 as a 'Normal Guitar PU' processor by jacking the GR-55 Guitar-Out into the VG-99 Guitar-In and then mixing both the GR-55 L-R Outs with the VG-99 L-R Outs into a PA monitor-opens up an amazing array of new sound palettes)
There's a 10,000 hour practice theory about mastering any art technique, so yes, be prepared to spend the time to learn your tools...and stretch, stretch and experiment, it's good for you and your musical brain.  For some amazing thoughts on how humans came to produce and relate to sound and music, I highly recommend Daniel Levitin's "This Is Your Brain On Music" and "The World in Six Songs", well worth reading.  ...my 2-1/2 cents worth.       
"No such thing as spare time.
No such thing as free time.
No such thing as down time.
All you got is life time. Go!"
- Henry Rollins

Fusion

#104
I am a guitarist of centuries (40yrs, this year, ouch) I love the classical gear stuff but my sense of development has never dulled down and I am always looking to expand the horizon. I am not crazy w the vintage gear myself. I had a lot of that stuff back in the day and it seemed like crap then so getting it now does not ring the bell for me. Spending 5K on a guitar is out of the question. Sure I love great guitars but like spending $1500 for an old Klon, not this boy.
I build my own guitars as I got tired of Fenders and LPs were always too much for me. i can build a Strat style guitar with any combination of pickups and wiring for around $800-1000 that plays and sounds better than most assembly line stockers. Old tube amps are cool but gain a lot of money when there are many modern amps that are extremely good, less noise and more options.
Several years back I began experimenting with non traditional amp configs, trying to get away from the constant expensive tube sets and maintenance. Got inspired by John McLaughlin who has not used guitar amps in some time.
On my guitar rig I use rack units and stereo power amps and I use a Presonus real tube instru/mic preamp which adds that element of clean tube analog to my amp rig. My preamp is a Tech21 PSA 1.1.
Late last year when I got my GR55 the horizon just opened up and things just expanded well beyond what I had imagined. Had experience with my GR30 a decade ago and used to run it into stereo twins.
Guitar amps out side of maybe a JC120 or the like are not great for a synth and a distorting tube amp is the wrong animal.
Like still love my cabinets with my guitar 12s and I keep my std guitar rig separate from my synth rig, I can see more integration in the future using that rather cool US20 loop mod from Elantric. Would require some rethinking of my entire rig but something to look forward to for future growth and changes as just using the same gear and rig for a long time is not my thing. I find myself reinventing the wheel at least once a year, that is what keeps me playing and enjoying the instrument after all this time.
I reached a point a couple years ago where I was at a dead end. I had so much traditional gear, huge assortment of pedals, amazing guitars, and I thought I had gone as far as I was going to go. Then I dropped the dime on the new guitar synth, waiting about a year before deciding to try it. I prep'ed for the new unit by reading and searching out everything I could as I am not one of those factory preset chaps. The unit constantly and consistently surprises me with something new and interesting it can do. I thought it would be limited and bit of lark to add some weird tones to my guitar rig. Oh it does that and so much more, now I find I cannot be without it, and if there is a fire, I am grabbing that puppy and my USB stick on the way out.

The GR55 and guitar synth realm is not for everyone, but for a few it offers such an expansive horizon and creative engine that is just the way of the future. COSM, modeling and PCM ability just expands the guitar well beyond ones current paradigm of tone possibilities. If you're one of those cats who likes just to plug into a tube amp and blues out then it is not your drink of choice. But having that ability as well as the expansive range of the synth is laboratory of exploration that will never leave you bored again. I could never get so lost in my tone and enjoy playing so much. I kick on one of my Jazz Rain patches with a toned out ES335 or L4 and it is like playing in a Jazz coffee shop on a rainy day with a storm brewing outside. Just more fun than I ever imagined and my wife is always wondering how in the world I get all that coming out of a guitar. I am not live gigging any more and I do miss that but hopefully I'll run into some older cats who can dig more improv fusion and just have fun playing. I am too old to worry about being a rock star and I am already set in life so fun is the deal for me. And that is my GR55.
"Long ago in days of old when magic filled the air..."

pajsh

#105
Just wanting to add my thoughts to this informative thread about life with (or without) a GR-55.

I got into V-Guitar when I borrowed (and then bought) a GR-20 and used it slave to my GT-8. When the GR-55 came out, it seemed logical to upgrade and have it all in one box. I've had it for about 2½ years now and I use it live in a rock covers band. Initially I was disappointed with it, but after a lot of learning and tweaking I now love it. To fully understand it first you have to need it, then use it and then learn it, but 3 weeks is not enough, not by a long way.

To me the GR-55 means I can add to a basic 3 piece sound to enhance and broaden the range of the music we play. I'm not a brilliant guitarist so that gives me a special USP over more competent "shredders". From a Strat/5150 (U Really Got Me) through horn section (Knock on Wood) to acoustic 12 string (Go Your Own Way) and much more it opens things up considerably. My most complex number is Iris (Goo Goo Dolls) which has a BDDDDD acoustic tuning, layered backing strings and poly synth for the solo. All in one small box plugged into a PA and 15" cab.

Yes, I agree it's too easy to get great sounds (ironic this is perceived to be a problem) and I have to work harder when I'm playing my "real" guitar through my Marshall, but it's more than good enough for the music we play, the audience love the added sounds and it's repeatable every time I hit that switch.

No, it's possibly not as "organic" as analogue gear, but then it's "modelling" so probably never will be. If you are playing the same type of music, it's not worth spending the time and effort the GR-55 needs to be effective, but if you cover a range of styles it's got to be one of the best tools a guitarist can own. As I said, you have to need it to love it.

If you are essentially a guitarist then go play guitar, but if you have a wider musical vision (and I'm not saying one is better than the other) then it can take your sounds in a new direction and revise how you view playing the guitar.

My personal gripes are that the GR-55 doesn't seem to track as well as the GR-20 and the sounds are not a good out of the box, but then with a bit of work this can be sorted. It's partly a side effect of greater flexibility I think. That and the practically useless 3 banks of "pre-sets" that no-one will ever use. I guess they are good for ideas on what is possible but that's about it.

If you've not seen the demo of "GR-55 Plays Pop" then it's here below to show you what (albeit in experienced hands) this little box can do. Whenever I think of selling it I watch this clip  :).



Fusion

Been 10mos since my last confession.
Hail Roland full of grace...
A lot of things have developed since my last post on the issues of the GR-55, Roland has now passed the beloved synth hex over to Boss and their new release of std cable tracking synth tech. Don't have one so cannot comment on what it can or cannot do. I suspect do not expect the moon and a nice orbit will do.
I fear we have seen the last of the GR technology to this new std cable processing more dumbed down approach but in the grand scope of the bell curve I get that.
Not letting go of my GR I can tell you that. I may not live long enough for it to be a vintage treasure item but for me it is a sonic tool of vast ability.

I get the push to a more simple technology using std cable processing, saves a lot of inexperienced players the grief of setting up and getting the GK-3 right or having a synth equipped guitar. Hopefully someone who can actually play will make good use of it so that the rest of us do not cringe.

I still dig the 55 unit and have pushed my learning curve much further up the mountain. If you are an experienced inventive minded player looking for something beyond the normal. This is quite a tool for development. Live playing using it has it own share of issues and equipment setups each one will have to deal with and arrive at to their own needs and ability.
If you are lucky enough to have a studio then this is a welcome addition to the arsenal of being able to overdub cool parts. I am still using the unit to play ambient under tones and atmosphere for my std guitar of which I now have a much treasured Les Paul I just put a GK-3 on using that marvelous bridge mounting bracket which keeps everything unscathed for easy return to basic condition. I've been a modified Strat player for some time but I have to say, the Les Paul, now I get it. I love that guitar just makes me want to play.

I suspect in the grand scope of live play the new SY300 might have advantages to set up and use, but again have no idea what its range really is, as usual demos and what not leave more than a little to the imagination.
I am an cutely modest advanced heavy fusion player and what some term "pop" I just find branching into other forms and modes of playing. It is all the realm of what I call jazz fusion even blues has a core place in jazz and feel.
You can take something rather corny and "poppy" and turn it into something marvelous using the synth. I frequently work up some Sade or something my wife gets a kick out of hearing.
I also play a lot of the heaviest god hammer stuff anyone can muster using the synth to play under the guitar strings and outright noises to add to the fullness and spectrum of the tones. Think Judas Priest using a Pipe Organ and a Choir under the massive guitar tones.
Now all that becomes problematic with a band to be sure, as playing bass tones on the synth or huge sound-scapes can step on toes or get washed out, but if you can balance it out the sonic experience is going to leave listeners realizing your band is not a typical crap fest of yada.
So the synth more for the advanced player and a completely must have for the studio the newer Boss model might be the ticket for ease of use and set up to incorporate some synth tones. I dig my dual rig and it never ceases to expand the horizons of what my imagination sparks.
Also just note and a nod to the COSM realm I now use a lot of it and I have learned to make some rather amazing heavy amp models and various coolness. My only regret for the GR-55 os they did not do more to the resolve of a good loop patch and better guitar out lines. Which is why I use my unit with two cables and two independent rigs. But it is monster and something new to do in a world of bland guitar strumming and bad playing.
Just look what pajsh can do messing around with more air play tunes bet that cat can play some mean jazz fusion if he wanted.
I love the synth as it expands the guitar possibilities and opens up the inventive side of music which is where it is at, for me anyway.

"Long ago in days of old when magic filled the air..."

chrish

#107
Glad you like the les paul, they are beautiful guitars. I sold mine along with my fender twin reverb and a univox (i think) tape echo machine in the late 70's in order to buy 20 angus-hereford cross calves. Go figure. :-) I should add that roland must of taken the advice given by the op, cause the sy-300 rocks.

bobruzzo

Just to chime in my 2 cents worth. I purchased a GR55 last Spring (2015) and hooked it up to my Strat. I managed to get everything working pretty well. Alot of tweaking to fine tune. The only main complaint I have with this is the ABUNDANCE of REALLY USELESS presets!!! I would prefer a bank of mostly GUITAR presets, for example, some Les Paul ones with your choice of P90's, Humbuckers, etc.....some pre sets of a Stratocaster with the same pickup choices....regular single coil, P90's, humbuckers, etc.....and amp modeling with better control of the EQ. For example I prefer a more "Larry Carlton" kind of sound so the heavy metal presets are no good for me. There are too many heavy metal/rock presets and barely any CLEAN and jazzy sounding ones. I spent a good part of yesterday tweaking almost ALL of the USER presets. Most of them sucked. However I did make some very usable and fine sounding ones.
The horn presets and keyboard ones are too unwieldy to use sometimes. So I would have preferred more GUITAR presets with emulated tones of people like Garcia, Carlton, Beck, Townshend, Hendrix, Kaukonen, etc. and not have a plethora of totally useless noises for presets.

Elantric

#109
Skip the useless  factory GR-55  presets and get Gumtowns GR-55 editor and download the huge GR-55 user created patch collection we share only here and read the notes on how to use these patches to learn incite on building your own patches, and you will reconsider your GR-55 opinion

All covered here

GR-55 F.A.Q.
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=3137

jeremydunit

I'm a brand new synth and cosm user and  the 55  is very overwhelming, I use the floorboard app and without it I would have returned it as well. but when I get into it (on a nightly basis) I'm like a junkie in an opium field. the more I navigate through it the easier it becomes. I almost got the 30 but decide on the 55. this is truly the best purchase ive ever made.
schecter hellraiser with gk3 on the bridge, gr55 and more to come!

ucnick

FWIW, I own (and love) my GR-20, still keep it as a backup, but the GR-55, despite it's limitations, provides enough tonal quality and programmability to provide me with pretty much all I need for my cover bands. I found that the altered tuning stuff is really useful. It does lack some of the tones that the GR-20 has, but it has a wider, and pretty much fully customizable, palette, and the tracking is much better, not to mention I can use it for several different guitars, both piezo and GK-3 equipped. So, I reckon I'm a-gonna keep on with it... ;D


Knuckle47

I've been reading this thread with great interest and I too, AS AN OLD PLAYER WITH A 25 yr hiatus, my distilled question would be for those with the experience of both....

Is i worth upgrading my GR33 to a Gr55? I'm looking to engage a few other older guys for an occasional jam.  I'll play anything from jazz to blues, bluegrass to rock, zeppelin to show tunes.

It's not like the GR33 is a major part of any repertoire but retirement happens soon and I'll have more time and less brain to try and figure it all out...

admin

#113
VG-8EX & GR-09 vs. VG-8EX & GR-33 vs. GR-55
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=9113.msg65696#msg65696


GR-55 - Convince me: Why should I upgrade from a GR-33 to a GR-55?
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=9705.msg69643#msg69643

peedenmark7

I am technically a newb to guitar synthesizers as far as putting them to work for me, but I am old enough to remember the Gr300 and GR700 when they came out, tinkered with them back in the day while working in music stores , for me and the music I am/was doing , those synths would have been a blessing , as opposed to having a keyboard player standing around behind me most of the night doing nothing, but the glitches and non stop issues caused me to shy away.

I got out of the biz around 2003, and closed the door, but continued to write.  Fast fwd to 2016 and I find myself planning another studio project.
Rehearsal time is at a premium these days,  as all other members of the band are either playing full time,  or have made the switch to "civilian life", so practicing 8-10 hours a day , 4-5 days a week is a thing of the past.

I bought a GR55 and a Korg D3200 recorder to make my life easier with regard to making a demo for pre-production work that I could then dump on to cd or MP3 files to give the guys in the band,  so that they could work on the material as written or tweak it, and in turn WHEN we do practice , we are playing , not trying to work out full length songs, we are playing them, while making minor adjustments only.

I haven't even begun to tap into the 55, there are patches I like ,and some I detest. I was dead set against the COSM stuff at first as I have many real amps and guitars, but I have to say, for now, I am very happy, it's been a welcomed convenience.
I used a vintage Roland Cube Keyboard 60 for about 75% of the guitar stuff, and a Mesa F50 for solo work, and never even plugged in to a single vintage Marshall. CRAZY !                    It sure is nice not having to mic amps anymore !

I'm sure the honeymoon will end as I begin to tweak, write, and organize patches, because I am 100% plug and play, I'm simply not wired for negotiating million options and have zero patience for programming . So we shall see.

I was so excited about the 55 that I ended up picking up a new old stock GR33 this week for some different synth options, and had planned to run it side by side the 55 via a US20, as I genuinely like some of the synths and horns better than the 55.  I am able to tweak it VERY easily,  but the lack of user patches ,latency , along with general glitches  and an overall LOWER volume output has deemed that I likely won't be using it live.

I hope to stick this out, as I am more energized and excited the past few months messing with and being amazed by what I've come up with as I record, than I ever was back when it really counted back in the day.

The 55 is a great tool.


Metaphasic

Confession time...

I've just about given up on the GR-55. I just cannot seem to get it to work right. Notes will suddenly stop even though the string is still sustaining heavily, some note do not sound at all, and I have found that, above all, it just does not respond like my old GR-300.

With my old GR-300 I could still play it like I would a regular guitar and it would react accordingly. Even when playing harmonics, it was perfect. The GR-55 does not seem to like harmonics. It is alright at the 12th fret, starts glitching at the 7th and the 5th is unusable.

In addition, the "Analog GR" COSM model is just plain terrible. Crackle and glitches everywhere.

The guitar is a Les Paul and was professionally setup, including fret leveling and dressing, neck relief, action and intonation. It is pure gold. I have gone through all the setup documents here, including the one where each step in calibration is outlined and explained in a spreadsheet like format. Nothing works for me.

I have gone back to using just the Les Paul and the neck-thru Bich, the GT-100 and the Marshall.

I may give it another try if I can get my hands on a Godin, but until then, the GR-55 is just going to sit in the corner.

=/

Litesnsirens

It's disheartening to hear that, Metaphasic.  If you've tried everything, there's no advice left to give.  It could just be that the settings for your les Paul are going to different from those prescribed.  Overall, although many of us on here have managed to get good results, I don't think any of us would disagree that it shouldn't be so hard to do so.   It's almost like Roland isn't really sure how to achieve the best results.   I hope the next version is more plug and play.   Maybe where there's some analysis going on in the box to read the guitar and adjust settings automatically.   It's just silly to lose customers over this kind of issue.

mooncaine

On the VG-99, I learned that the GR sim responds better to different GK pickup sensitivity settings, way higher than you'd expect. Still not ideal, but I never had the real GR300 to compare.

You can save different settings, see page 69 of the manual, or search the PDF for "Setting the GK Pickups (GK SETTING)." That feature is really intended for letting you have preset setups for different guitars, but for synth use, it can be better to have higher sensitivity than for COSM sim-guitar use.

When forrest shared some of his super fat awesome VG-99 gr300 patches with us, I saw that he cranked sensititivy (I think?) and also used the built-in EQ to really boost the bass, more than I would have thought to try. He compensated by dialing down the individual string loudness settings in the patch. Sounds and feels great. I wonder if similar tricks would help the GR300 sim in the GR-55 sustain better, esp. the boosted sensitivity.

DF400

After years of use, I shelved my GR55 about a year ago. These day for the sampled sounds, I much prefer the TRP with either the GR33 or a computer/ipad. IMHO, the GR55's real benefit is that I was able to integrate the guitar modeling and PCM sounds with alternate tunings - this is hard to do with separate gear (although I have found it possible with the Variax and some creating midi programing).

The success I had with the GR55 boiled down to these six critical elements:

1 - I read nearly all the posts related to setting up the GK pick-up and took a lot of time to ensure it was done properly.
2 - I took a significant amount of time in programming my own sounds. Although there are great presets available for downloading, as the very least I had to tailor them to my particular taste and gear.
3 - I modified my guitar playing to ensure the unit was able to properly interpret my musical expression for a given sound (this also resulted in cleaning up my picking quite a bit).
4 - I focussed on simplicity - Having all the sounds available in one floor unit, and most time in one preset was very convenient. It was also important for me to be consistent - where in most song presets used the same switch or expression pedal for a given results (such as using the Control button for solos, expression pedal for blending, etc.).
5 - I used the PCM sounds sparingly and ensured the sounds were properly placed in the mix.
6 - Lastly, I learned to manage expectations. For me, the GR55 does not excel at any one thing. The modeling is OK and for my ears the PCM sounds to a step backwards when compared to the GR20, 30 and 33.

Although I agree there is much rood for improvement, it was a rewarding piece of kit for me.

randulo

ALl the above statement are so very, very true! It's a lot of work.
Hopeful GR-55 convert from GR-1
Twitter @randulo
Medium @randulo

alexmcginness

 A VG-99 and a GR55.
   With a rig like that....

VG-88V2, GR-50, GR-55, 4 X VG-99s,2 X FC-300,  2 X GP-10 AXON AX 100 MKII, FISHMAN TRIPLE PLAY,MIDX-10, MIDX-20, AVID 11 RACK, BEHRINGER FCB 1010, LIVID GUITAR WING, ROLAND US-20, 3 X GUYATONE TO-2. MARSHALL BLUESBREAKER, SERBIAN ELIMINATOR AMP. GR-33.

Davis

Hello Everyone

It is now a couple years later and I need to update this. I will truncate my journey to get to the point. I re-bought the GR55 and am really happy with it and here is how that came to be!

First, I went broke, completely about 4 years ago and had to busk on the streets to make ends meet. That opened up a new world. I took my old Ovation with me and played in parks until a Farmer's market manager met me and asked me to come perform for them. One thing lead to another and over the years, I got in to tons of markets as a performer. Eventually I got a minimum wage job again and saved for a Gibson guitar which I eventually got through credit and paid for. Then I realized that the only thing I could sing was country (high bass voice, what the heck can you do with that?....answer: sing Merle Haggard)....then crowds of kids would gather round me and dance and the parents loved it and I got better and better at country picking chops.

Fast forward....I dumped all extraneous gear and picked up a Gibson J45 and a shadowstomp pedal (to make a beat by tapping with the foot but amplified) and a decent vocal processor with PA. I play about 40-50 gigs a summer this way and make enough to pay rent. Slowly I dug my way out of severe poverty into reasonable poverty....:)

So why go into this? Well, I found my own voice in acoustic playing for people to get them toe tapping. And folks go on about my left hand technique, where I can bring the opening riff from Purple Haze into a Waylon Jennings song....yeh, I know,,,,,unusual, but they like the countrified classic rock alot.

Now that I have found my voice in the guitar, I have turned back to the GR55 to create unique sounds. I might never use it on stage or at a market...but that is not the point. The point is that when I posted last, a few years back.....I had not found my voice yet, fast country lead picking. So I went in search of it. The GR55 is now on my Strat...and I have new voices I can create. It is not for performing so far, just for inspiration and escape. I can loop layers on my cheap looper pedal and then build on it with sax, flute, cello....to take me to new spaces and think in new ways.

The moral of the story is that the GR 55 is one way a guitarist can open up new sonic worlds when they are tired of hearing guitar. I had to saturate this need by playing out a TON to create my own act. Once I did that< i was then free to enter new worlds, since I had a base to work from. Its not that i play country on the GR 55, its that I get a break from my own country playing to enter newer sound pallettes offered by jazz, a pseudo Metheny-esque world, where I can riff on the trumpet over a jazz progression.

I also found that using a small keyboard synth with about 41 keys max, maybe less helped break the patterns too, by seeing music in a different way.

I think what I am saying is that the GR 55 is a great thing to own once you have explored all the tonal possibilities of your instrument. The J45 in rosewood has rich tones, almost infinite. But the GR 55 takes it one step further. You can really think in new ways musically. The way the synth works is you have to think about each line. Its like playing a Tele vs a Strat. The Tele demands focus and technique and rewards accordingly, the Strat makes it all easier to sound okay. The GR 55 is the Telecaster of effects? Well, maybe.

Anyhow, I will not return this again. It has found a home. It has a place for any guitarist who is tired of sounding like a guitarist. But paradoxically, you can only explore the GR 55 if you already have a home base in your guitar style and have explored its tonal range. At least for me.

Cheers

Majiken

Great story, thanks for sharing and all the best from Germany!
Take what you need, put back a bit more, leave the place behind you better than it was before :-)

www.majiken.rocks

jamesigreat

I've owned a fishman and own both gr-55 & boss gp-10. For me the clarity of the fishman is better but always fighting with latency issues and the clunkyness of dragging your laptop everywhere for gigging and needing to manage all the vsts that come with hardware. I'm still new to midi/synth guitar and this site is the only place to find any info on any synth guitar anywhere. the boss gp-10 for me has better quality guitar modding but sucks balls on the limited synth options, so i got a gr-55 but guitar side sucks compared to gp-10 and when i run thru my boss katana even more issues. they like the blackstar better. so I thought i'd be smart and find a 13 pin a/b footswitch( best of both worlds, right). now us-20 is just another pedal to tap-dance on to an overly complicated system. I look back at my original reason i wanted to branch out and get into synth guitar....to be more than just the guitar player and to fill in and write parts for music i couldn't do otherwise....some days i miss the good old days of an amp with gain/master vol and 3 eq knobs. too late down the rabbit hole now. :-[

plexified

#124
 
Hey  James,
                    What kind of tones are you going after? Are you using the guitar out into the Katana? Tell us a bit more of what you would like to accomplish and issues your having so  maybe we can help you dial things in.
                      Cheers & Happy New Year