GR-55 MIDI RX Patch Change MAP?

Started by gumtown, March 09, 2011, 10:57:23 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

mslinn


magister

Quote from:  gumtown on May 01, 2014, 05:30:10 AM
In program mode, you need to send bank-change/control-change/patch-change data.
As there are 64 banks to choose/program, each with 128 patch slots = 8000+ places to put your patch data from the 500+ GR-55 Preset and User patches.
The GR-55 needs more than just a number from 1~128 from a regular midi patch change controller to differentiate the various banks.

Hi everybody, hi gumtown!  ;D
I have follw'd the topic since I'm having the same issue as I posted some months ago now... :-\
[see: www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=6853.msg47560#msg47560 ]
It looks like I cannot have the PRG map working unless I find a way to send bank-change/control-change/patch-change data from any midi pedalboard I want to use into the GR55 (... I believe...  ???)
Right. Then the question is: I do I manage to send those midi messages from a 'normal' pedalboard such as Roland FC100 or FC50 (that I've always used with no problems together with many rack unit) which don't seem to have that kind of ability ??? ???

Thanks for helping... I'll HAVE to find a way to get it working! ;) ;)
Roland GR55, Boss GP-10, Boss RC300 Loop Station, Sanchez Classical gtr with RMC system onboard, G&L strato model w/GK3, DeArmond X155 w/GK3, Primova GX-2 and MIDX-10, Mesa/Boogie 50/50, Fender Hot Rod Deluxe, Rocktron Chameleon online, EHX 44 Magnum power amp, 2 x Epiphone Valve Junior 12 ext. Cab.

gumtown

To use a 'regular' midi patch change controller (1~128),
you can leave the GR-55 midi program table in "fixed" mode,
and use the GR-55 Librarian software to rearrange the GR-55 patches to match your foot control patch change layout.
Free "GR-55 FloorBoard" editor software from https://sourceforge.net/projects/grfloorboard/

magister

Ok then... So I see there is no way to get it working with those old pedalboard  :-[
It looks like it's time to upgrade to a more 'recent' foot controller... ;D
In this case I wonder what kind of pedalboard I should look for?
I mean, what feature should I absolutely look for to get it working as I want?
Is there a resource I can refer to on the internet to go deeper in this issue?

Thanks again and again, vguitar forum rulez!  8)
Roland GR55, Boss GP-10, Boss RC300 Loop Station, Sanchez Classical gtr with RMC system onboard, G&L strato model w/GK3, DeArmond X155 w/GK3, Primova GX-2 and MIDX-10, Mesa/Boogie 50/50, Fender Hot Rod Deluxe, Rocktron Chameleon online, EHX 44 Magnum power amp, 2 x Epiphone Valve Junior 12 ext. Cab.

Elantric

#54
Read  MIDI Foot Controller comparison table here.
www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=159.0

But most folks can get by with 128 presets.
Rearrange them to your liking as Gumtown described.

To use a 'regular' midi patch change controller (1~128),
you can leave the GR-55 midi program table in "fixed" mode,
and use the GR-55 Librarian software to rearrange the GR-55 patches to match your foot control patch change layout.

mmccain

#55
I have an old (Rocktron I think) midi switch pedalboard that sends midi Program changes (0 through 127 or 1 through 128) corresponding to which of five footswitch you press and which bank you are on.  I would like to use it to expand the number of "patches" that are available for quick access without changing banks on the GR-55.  Thus giving me quick access to eight patches without a bank change.  Can I do this?  Can I change the mapping somehow so that I can assign a different program numbers to whichever patches I want without having to actually put them next to each other?  Thanks in advance.

Mrchevy

try this video tutorial I did a while back. It will explain how to map the GR55. I use a GT100 to make the GR55 patch changes but I think your pedal should work.   
Gibson Les Paul Custom
Epi Les Paul Standard
Gibson SG 50's prototype
Squire classic vibe 60's
Epi LP Modern
Epi SG Custom
Martin acoustic

Princeton chorus 210

GT100
GR-55
Helix LT
Waza Air Headphones
Boomerang III

And, a lot of stuff I DON'T need

Brian349

Is there a table of the GR-55 Patches to Bank, CC and PC in the fixed mode? I have a G2 Gig Rig controller and I have found midi Channel 1 is GR-55 Bank 1 PC 1 onwards. For the life of me I cant find midi channel 2 and onwards in the hundreds of banks to choose from. I fond the midi channel 1 by seeing what patch was selected when in "fix" mode and easily found which PC channel as it is all sequential to both devices. But from where patch 99.3 ends in Bank 2 what happens???? Thx B

imerkat

Quote from: Brian349 on July 08, 2015, 07:00:35 AM
I have found midi Channel 1 is GR-55 Bank 1 PC 1 onwards. For the life of me I cant find midi channel 2 and onwards in the hundreds of banks to choose from.

You can only use one channel, which ever channel you want (1-16), to access all of the presets. Looking at you G2 Gig Rig controller manual has a "stompbox mode" which sends messages on channel 2. I'm not sure what are trying to do that require different channels, to be honest.

Quote from: Brian349 on July 08, 2015, 07:00:35 AM
But from where patch 99.3 ends in Bank 2 what happens???? Thx B

I believing those are all the presets that come mapped by the factory.

Elantric

#59
The remote MIDI pedal you use needs to be on the same MIDI channel as GR-55, and  send MIDI Bank Change commands to access all the GR-55 patches.
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=3348.msg44812;topicseen#msg44812


Read the GR-55 MIDI Implementation thread
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=3348.0

<Gumtown wrote>
Here is midi structure *.xml document with everything that has been manually mapped out to date (65% complete), the file is best viewed in 'grid view' from an xml document reader (like Altova XMLSpy).

http://grfloorboard.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/grfloorboard/midi.xml?view=log
all the editor code is there, as it is opensource too.
http://grfloorboard.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/grfloorboard/

The GR-55 program changes are just standard Bank number, Bank change, patch change commands with patch range from 0 to 127 before incrementing the bank change number.
The editor under construction will show you the bank, bank change and patch midi data on the botton status bar,  as well as any sysex parameter change data, if the editor is set to deBug mode from the preferences menu.
http://sourceforge.net/projects/grfloorboard/



Your sysx messages for parameter control need to start with F0 and end with F7. typical data structure is

F0 41 10 00 00 53 12 18 00 10 0A 00 4E F7      = switch Modeling Tone 'on'
F0 41 10 00 00 53 12 18 00 10 0A 01 4D F7      = switch modeling tone 'off'

F0 = sysx message header (message start)
41 = Roland device (manufacuter ID)
10 = Device midi Identity (fixed at device ID 16)
00 00 53 = Roland GR-55 identification
12 = sending parameter change data (11 = requesting data from the GR-55)
18 00 10 0A = address for modeling tone switch in Temporary memory address (10 = guitar modeling, 0A tone switch address)
00 = 'off, 01 = 'on'
4E or 4D = data checksum value
F7 = sysx message finished.

For a Patch/Bank change to U1:1
B0 00 00   = controller 0 bank change 00 is Bank 1
B0 20 00   = controller 32 bank change required to process bank change
C0 00       = patch change to patch 1

For Patch/BAnk change to U99:3
B0 00 02
B0 20 00
C0 28

Modify message
Report to moderator   Logged
Free "GR-55 FloorBoard" editor



Here is an alternative to do Patch/Bank change on the GR-55, this is quite unique to the GR-55, where instead of standard patch change data, system exclusive data is sent like this
F0 41 10 00 00 53 12 01 00 00 00 00 00 7F F7 = Patch U01:1
F0 41 10 00 00 53 12 01 00 00 00 00 7F 00 F7 = Patch U43:2
F0 41 10 00 00 53 12 01 00 00 00 01 00 7E F7 = Patch U43:3
F0 41 10 00 00 53 12 01 00 00 00 01 7F 7F F7 = Patch U86:1
F0 41 10 00 00 53 12 01 00 00 00 02 00 7D F7 = Patch U86:2
F0 41 10 00 00 53 12 01 00 00 00 02 28 55 F7 = Patch U99:3
the data is sent to the GR-55 system area.
The same data address, as a request, will also ask the GR-55 which patch it is currently on.

The problem you are going to have for each control is..
a) setting the control data range.
b) using the same data as meaningful GUI text (displaying the patch number).
c) getting the control to add header and footer data as a complete sysx message.

Brian349

Hi thank you for your fast replies. Very much appreciated. The latest G2 controller software allows you to set up different midi channels for each preset button. So this is what I have done and I can succesfully control one midi device on channel 1 and the GR-55 on midi channel 3 all on the same bank of the G2. All good so far.

My issue is if I control the GR-55 on midi channel 1 I have identified where the user patches that are "changed" are in the GR-55 Banks they start in Bank 1 CC1 PC1. In PRG mode I can change the user patch to what I desire and all ok.

But when using midi channel 3 I can see the user patch change on the GR-55 (so its working) but I cannot identify which Bank CC or PC to programme to the GR-55 Patch I want.

How do I identify which Bank CC & PC I change when using midi channels other then 1??

I hope that makes sense.

Thanks for your help.

imerkat

Quote from: Brian349 on July 08, 2015, 11:14:22 AM
How do I identify which Bank CC & PC I change when using midi channels other then 1??

I hope that makes sense.

It really doesn't make sense. Changing the channel doesn't change the mapping (it's why their in different tabs under System MIDI/USB menu) I'm not sure what you mean by "see the user patch change"; Do you mean the GR-55 is responding to Bank/PC messages in channel 1 but when you change the channel (on the GR-55 & G2) to CH 3 it doesn't respond? I found PRG mode extremely unreliable so i don't know which mode you are using.

Simplest thing to do is set the GR-55 to Fix mode on CH 3 and save your patches to where ever the footswitches change the preset to. 

Brian349

Hi

Yes the GR-55 does respond when both G2 and GR-55 are both set to midi channel 3 and the user patch changes on the GR-55. BUT when I go into the Bank/PC settings and change the patch to the one I want (I have found the G2 aligns to GR-55 Bank 1 CC1 PC1 onwards) and try again the same the original patches are still there e.g. GR-55 has not changed to the patch that I have selected in the GR-55 Bank. BUT this works when using midi channel 1 on both devices. Weird eh!

I was assuming the patch mapping is the same for all midi channels when doing the above????? However, as patch did not change when using any midi channels other than 1 I then though maybe when you change midi channel the mapping is different so maybe I am changing the incorrect Bank & PC. So original question I suppose was does the mapping change when you change midi channel? If yes does anyone have/know the mapping for it so I can change the correct Bank/PC depending on what midi channel I am using?

Thank you again for help. This forum is great  ;D
Regards

B


Brian349

Hi All

OK I took the easy route. Set GR-55 & G2 on midi channel 3, set GR-55 mapping to "FIX" and then see which patch number GR-55 goes to when G2 preset selected and just save patch I want to there. Thank you to all for your help.
:)
Regards

B

dbcodd

OK, I'm new here. AND, I'm relatively new to MIDI in general. And seeing how old this thread is, I'm also late to the party.
All that being said...
I would simply like to send MSB, LSB and Program # to the GR-55 to move from one patch to another.
I want to use the app on my iPad that I use to do this with other devices. I am attempting to avoid yet another floor pedal.
Is this possible?
It must be- so How?


admin

QuoteI would simply like to send MSB, LSB and Program # to the GR-55 to move from one patch to another.
I want to use the app on my iPad that I use to do this with other devices. I am attempting to avoid yet another floor pedal.

Is the iPad app Setlistmaker

or
On-Song?


We have threads that walk you though step by step for controlling GR-55 with each of those apps on iPad

https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=9090.msg65501#msg65501

Specifically this post spells it out - with instructions courtesy of member "Litesnsirens"
Control GR-55 using Setlistmaker on iPad
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=9090.msg66757#msg66757

dbcodd

I'm using the iMidiPatchbay app with an iConnectMidi4+


gumtown

GR-55 patch U1:1 would be
B00000 B02000 C000

U99:3 would be
B00002 B02000 C028

OTHER 40:3 would be
B00012 B02000 C067

The first message (MSB) is the Bank number (0~12) the second (LSB) is a control change and is always the same 0x20 (decimal 32) the MSB and LSB are sent in separate packets
The last is the patch number C0 = midi channel 1 CF = midi channel 16,
and patch number 00~7F (1~128)
Free "GR-55 FloorBoard" editor software from https://sourceforge.net/projects/grfloorboard/

dbcodd

I want to thank y'all for your help, but I feel like we're talking in different dialects.
All of the gear I have, even going back as far as the Roland GI-20, where MSB=0 LSB=32 and then the actual patch is whatever that # is, have discrete MSB LSB and patc #s.
According to the GR-55 manual, as I understand it, on page 79, the MSB will be 0-63 (choosing the bank), the LSB is fixed at 0, and the actual patch is 1, 2, or 3.

When I see :
GR-55 patch U1:1 would be
B00000 B02000 C000

I have no idea what this means.

or,
as you state Gumtown:
(LSB) is a control change and is always the same 0x20 (decimal 32)
???
The manual states that LSB for the GR-55 is jfixed at 0.

I'm lost. Maybe I'm in the wrong Forum. (?)

The iMidiPatchbay will allow me to send MSB and LSB and Patch # in the formats I described- like the GI-20.

So, I know I'm a knuckledragging bassist. If this is the wrong group, then maybe y'all know where I can get my answer in terms I can understand.
Or, maybe you can lead me to a info source that will help me translate what you mean.

HELP!
Thanks


rwbmusic

Greetings, this is my first post. I bought a used blue GR-55 and a Godin LGXT. I have installed the driver and librarian program. I am primarily a keyboardist with a rather elaborate performance rig that uses two MacBook Pros connected via Vienna Ensemble Pro. I tend to place virtual instruments on one laptop and use the second laptop to run Digital Performer. I have recorded backing tracks in my home studio which are loaded into the DAW laptop. I have set up additional tracks for program changes to be sent to my keyboards and virtual instruments. What I am attempting to accomplish at the moment is consistent program changes sent to the GR-55 from DP but I have run into some issues that I see others writing about here. Neither the manual and what I have read have not yet shown me the solution.

I am able to send fixed program changes to the GR-55, but the results are unexpected. I would like to call up any of the patches via DAW automation including LEAD, RHYTHM, OTHER and USER patches. I suspect that the MIDI Program Mapping with the Map Select set to Program offers the most flexibility in this regard. However the only time patch changes have been triggered is when I have the GR-55 set to "fixed."  I do see that patch changes are received in 1-128. The LEAD, RHYTHM, OTHER and USER are organized in banks of 99 patches in the manual ending with patch 30-3. But on the pedalboard the patches go to 40-3 making for a total of 120 patches per category!  Was this due to a firmware update?

Next issue then is how can I change categories via MIDI. I do see that if I send a patch change that is >120, the pedalboard rolls over to the next category. But this is less than ideal.  Can this be controlled via a MIDI bank change with the RX PC MAP set to Program? At this point I have not been able to get the pedalboard to respond to any program changes with the RX PC MAP set to "Program." I am also unsure how the Bank Select of MSB 0-63 corresponds to LEAD, RHYTHM, OTHER and USER categories. Can someone clarify this issue for me?

Thanks in advance for any assistance!

rwbmusic

I think I have solved the larger issue of using the MIDI mapper. I am now able to select patches with the RX PC MAP set to "Program" as well as assign bank to address the LEAD, RHYTHM, OTHER & USER banks.

I still wonder about the discrepancy between the number of patches in the manual and what can be found in the pedalboard. I am also wondering how I might use the librarian app to publish patch names in DP.

gumtown

#73
Quote from: rwbmusic on September 03, 2018, 11:46:51 AM
I think I have solved the larger issue of using the MIDI mapper. I am now able to select patches with the RX PC MAP set to "Program" as well as assign bank to address the LEAD, RHYTHM, OTHER & USER banks.

I still wonder about the discrepancy between the number of patches in the manual and what can be found in the pedalboard. I am also wondering how I might use the librarian app to publish patch names in DP.

Yes the GR-55 did early on have a firmware update which extended the number of Preset Patches, but the used manual was never updated.
https://static.roland.com/assets/media/pdf/GR-55_Additional_PatchList.pdf

Free "GR-55 FloorBoard" editor software from https://sourceforge.net/projects/grfloorboard/

landrews

Did anyone solve this lots of broken links and suggestions but no answers that I can find.  I'm trying to chef get patches using an MC6 controller the thread implies I should send CC0 value 0 ( to 12 for selecting a bank )  followed by CC32 value 0 then PC patch number 0 to 127.

I tried lots of combinations of this and sometimes it changes to a random patch number ( always the same one as long as my commanders are not changed ) so CC0 0,CC32 0, PC 0 always goes to user 1-1 , PC2 to user 1-2 seems to work up to 127 which is user 43-2.  CC0 01, CC32 0 , pc 0 is 43-3 so all looks good but when I get to CC0 03, CC32 0 , PC 0 it stops working completely.  Also not that I want to access them, I can't get it to switch to lead, rhythm or Other.