JTV- Mag Pickup Swap Details

Started by Infi-del, January 08, 2016, 10:28:44 AM

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Elantric

#25
QuoteHi Elantric!

I noticed on a post from early 2016 that you installed Seymour triple shots on your JTV59.

I'm thinking of doing the same thing on mine but with P-Rail pickups. But I can't figure out how I'm supposed to solder the wires coming out of the triple shots (black, white, bare) to the W1, W2, W3 and W4 connection points on the JTV59.

I know that on the triple shots the white wire is hot and the black and bare wires are supposed to be connected to ground. I also know that the stock pups on the JTV59 go: green wires to W2 (bridge) and W4 (neck), black and bare wires together to W1 (bridge) and W3 (neck), red and white wires are soldered together. But can't seem to figure out how to extrapolate one to the other.

I guess my question is: on the JTV59 which wire is supposed to be the hot one? I'm guessing it is the green one, which means that the triple shot's white wires should be connected to W2 (bridge) and W4 (neck)... If that's so, then the triple shot's black and bare should go together to W1 (bridge) and W3 (neck)?

Sorry for rookie question but this is going to be my first pickup swap ever! If you can illuminate me, I would be eternally grateful!

Cheers!


Here is the Line6 JTV-59


Line-6 Neck PU Slug Coil (North polarity  / inner coil winding Start)  = Green (W4)
Line-6 Neck PU Slug Coil (North polarity  / inner coil winding Finish)  = White
Line-6 Neck PU Screw Coil (South polarity  / inner coil winding Finish)  = Red 
Line-6 Neck PU Screw Coil (South polarity  / inner coil winding Start)  = Black (W3)
Line-6 Neck PU Earth Ground  = Shield (W3)


Line-6 Bridge PU Slug Coil (North polarity  / inner coil winding Start)  = Green (W2)
Line-6 Bridge PU Slug Coil (North polarity  / inner coil winding Finish)  = White
Line-6 Bridge PU Screw Coil (South polarity  / inner coil winding Finish)  = Red
Line-6 Bridge PU Screw Coil (South polarity  / inner coil winding Start)  = Black (W1)
Line-6 Bridge PU Earth Ground  = Shield (W1)


When swapping above for  the Seymour Duncan P-Rails with TripleShot rings - i simply wired like this

Refer to the Tripleshot PCB board silkscreen 


Neck Duncan P-Rails with TripleShot rings

Neck Duncan P-Rails Neck PU Slug Coil (North polarity  / inner coil winding Start)  = Black  =  solder to Neck Tripleshot  PCB "B" pad
Neck Duncan P-Rails Neck PU Slug Coil (North polarity  / inner coil winding Finish)  = White   =  solder to Neck Tripleshot  PCB "W" pad
Neck Duncan P-Rails Neck PU Screw Coil (South polarity  / inner coil winding Finish)  = Red    =  solder to Neck Tripleshot  PCB "R" pad
Neck Duncan P-Rails Neck PU Screw Coil (South polarity  / inner coil winding Start)  = Green   =  solder to Neck Tripleshot  PCB "G" pad
Neck Duncan P-Rails Neck PU Earth Ground  = Shield   =  solder to Neck Tripleshot  PCB "GND" pad


Neck Duncan P-Rails Bridge PU Slug Coil (North polarity  / inner coil winding Start)  = Black  =  solder to Bridge Tripleshot  PCB "B" pad
Neck Duncan P-Rails Bridge PU Slug Coil (North polarity  / inner coil winding Finish)  = White   =  solder to Bridge Tripleshot  PCB "W" pad
Neck Duncan P-Rails Bridge PU Screw Coil (South polarity  / inner coil winding Finish)  = Red    =  solder to Bridge Tripleshot  PCB "R" pad
Neck Duncan P-Rails Bridge PU Screw Coil (South polarity  / inner coil winding Start)  = Green   =  solder to Bridge Tripleshot  PCB "G" pad
Neck Duncan P-Rails Bridge PU Earth Ground  = Shield   =  solder to Bridge Tripleshot  PCB "GND" pad


Now run a separate 2 conductor + shield wire from

Neck Tripleshot  PCB "+" pad  = solder to JTV59 "W4"
Neck Tripleshot  PCB "-" pad  = solder to JTV59 "W3"
Neck Tripleshot  PCB "Gnd" pad  = solder shield to JTV59 "W3"


Bridge Tripleshot  PCB "+" pad  = solder to JTV59 "W2"
Bridge Tripleshot  PCB "-" pad  = solder to JTV59 "W1"
Bridge Tripleshot  PCB "Gnd" pad  = solder shield to JTV59 "W1"


cags12

I am probably very late on this discussion but I believe this would be useful for others.

There is a solution for the wrong Pot values needed for Active pickups. I do not own a Variax but assuming each gang of the dual ganged Pot in the JTV's are used independently, I mean, 1 for the Mag pickups and the other for the DSP control; you can modify the gang of the Mag pickups and decrease the resistance value by adding a resistor in parallel of value 26 or 27K. These values come from the formula 1/ReqK = 1/R1 + 1/R2. To be hyper precise it woulduld be 26.31578947368421K, however I doubt you could find something closer.

See video below for better explanation.


This is something I was planning for my Autotune installation. the problem in my case is that the Volume Pot is shared for Mags and the ATG and I am having troubles finding a dual ganged Pot with momentary switch as required for the ATG system to work properly.

admin

 Yes it's an old trick however the  resulting pot taper is  often non optimal but it'll  work in a pinch
Still can't go the other way - you can't make 50 K pot into a 500 K pot

vtgearhead

Not stated is whether that pot is used for volume or tone.  Also not stated is whether the guitar has traditional or modern Gibson wiring.  A shunt resistor will greatly affect the pot taper and anyone tempted to make this mod should be prepared to reverse it if you don't like the control behavior afterwards.

cags12

Thanks, That is something I did not know. Hopefully it would be better than like on/off switch.

cags12

Digging further online it seems the trick would be using 2 resistors instead of one.

Quoting: http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=29220.0

"Try out this calculator: http://www.diystompboxes.com/analogalchemy/emh/emh.html

basically yout use 2 resistors, 1 from lug 1 to 2, and the other from lugs 2 to 3.  The calculator will give you the 2 resistor values needed for the new pot value.

Erik"

The op reported success.

Does this make sense to any of you?

admin

your mileage may vary in actual use

mordecai

I am getting ready to throw in Pearly Gates Plus and two TexMex pickups into my JTV69. What I am wondering, if it's possible, is to do either coil tap (or alternatively parallel) and an add bridge pickup option. Since this is not your every day 5 way as far as the JTV69 is concerned what numbers would I need to concern myself with beyond what was diagrammed earlier?

To keep things simple the main thing I am concerned about is splitting the bridge pickups, or at the very least if I can do an auto split in position 2.  Find it odd they didn't do that stock, even when they had the 4 lead wiring on the humbucker.

I am not an expert but I am definitely not a novice as far as PCB soldering. If this isn't possible I may just splice in the new pickups for simplicity though.

admin


mordecai

Thanks I will look at that option. I think I may be out of luck with the add bridge option I want. I am reviewing this thread and think I can figure out how to do the auto split I am wanting to do by just looking at the JTV89F bridge pickup wiring that was outlined and going from there. See what I can figure out.

killing_time

Hi all,
Im having a trouble with my Dimarzio Tone zone and Air norton swap in my JTV 89F with the original ones ... As I can see The Green and black are switched ? is that the only difference ?
Thx !

admin

#36
Quote from: killing_time on February 08, 2019, 07:51:10 AM
Hi all,
Im having a trouble with my Dimarzio Tone zone and Air norton swap in my JTV 89F with the original ones ... As I can see The Green and black are switched ? is that the only difference ?
Thx !


DIMARZIO => LINE-6
-----------------------------
RED______ => GREEN
BLACK____ => WHITE
WHITE____ => RED
GREEN____ => BLACK
SHIELD____=> SHIELD

I rely on this chart





and REVIEW the Line6 Variax PU charts here
http://line6.com/support/page/kb/_/guitars/james-tyler-variax-guitars/jtv-pickup-wiring-diagrams-r64



JTV-89F PU DIAGRAM








the "stock" Line-6 pickups ( Asian "G&B"brand) have same wiring as Jackson PU's here


COMPARE TO DIMARZIO HERE

killing_time

 :-* thank you for you reactivity! and your help! I like this forum!

killing_time

Quote from: admin on February 08, 2019, 09:33:36 AM

DIMARZIO => LINE-6
-----------------------------
RED______ => GREEN
BLACK____ => WHITE
WHITE____ => RED
GREEN____ => BLACK
SHIELD____=> SHIELD

I rely on this chart





and REVIEW the Line6 Variax PU charts here
http://line6.com/support/page/kb/_/guitars/james-tyler-variax-guitars/jtv-pickup-wiring-diagrams-r64



JTV-89F PU DIAGRAM








the "stock" Line-6 pickups ( Asian "G&B"brand) have same wiring as Jackson PU's here


COMPARE TO DIMARZIO HERE

Hi All , Im getting hum noise with the Dimarzio Humbuckers that i didn't have with the original JTV Humbuckers ... using this :
RED______ => GREEN
BLACK____ => WHITE
WHITE____ => RED
GREEN____ => BLACK
SHIELD____=> SHIELD
did I miss something ?
Thx !


admin

Post an actual photo of your soldering

mordecai

I am back to swapping pickups on the jtv69. I am looking at doing a Thornbucker bridge 8.9ohm, Gold foil middle (Victory Lowrider) 5ohms, and stock single coil.

I know this is the blanket statement from the guru PK over at L6
"The bulk resistances of the pick-ups should be between 6k-8k Ohms.
Outside of that and there may be problems."

So am I ok with doing a slightly hotter humbucker and a slightly cooler middle?

The main pickup I am interested in is the gold foil as it's not in the Variax and I like the sound of them a lot. Going to route the pick guard out a bit and tea stain it while I am at it to get the ultra white some contrast.

I just am not sure what the term bulk resistance really means I guess if I am honest here. Clarifying that would help a lot.

admin

#41
Quote from: mordecai on May 09, 2019, 07:34:14 PM
I am back to swapping pickups on the jtv69. I am looking at doing a Thornbucker bridge 8.9ohm, Gold foil middle (Victory Lowrider) 5ohms, and stock single coil.

I know this is the blanket statement from the guru PK over at L6
"The bulk resistances of the pick-ups should be between 6k-8k Ohms.
Outside of that and there may be problems."

So am I ok with doing a slightly hotter humbucker and a slightly cooler middle?

The main pickup I am interested in is the gold foil as it's not in the Variax and I like the sound of them a lot. Going to route the pick guard out a bit and tea stain it while I am at it to get the ultra white some contrast.

I just am not sure what the term bulk resistance really means I guess if I am honest here. Clarifying that would help a lot.

Bulk resistance is typically a term employed when talking about P-N Junctions  or Diodes
http://www.learningaboutelectronics.com/Articles/What-is-the-bulk-resistance-RB-of-a-diode






In regards to guitar pickups it would be the typical "total DC resistance" for each pickup




for example a typical P.A.F. Gibson Humbucker is comprised of 2 separate coil bobbins

wired in Series - with a total DC resistance range of 7.5k Ohm to 8.5k Ohm




RNorth coil   + RSouth coil  = RTotal

If each coil bobbin is  3.85k ohm then the humbucker PU total DC resistance is 7.7k ohm


https://www.fralinpickups.com/2017/09/20/dc-resistance-guitar-pickups/
QuoteFor instance, our Stock Pure P.A.F. set reads 7.8K in the Neck, and 8.2K in the Bridge.
https://www.premierguitar.com/articles/21912-tone-tips-decoding-the-paf-humbucker

mordecai

Thanks for clearing that up for me. I am glad I was just over thinking it by making the "bulk" load be something more complicated than just the single pickup ohm reading. Sounds like I may need to find a bit hotter gold foil like the Lollar and just stick with what I got in the bridge. I use models about 90% of the time or more. Just want that missing pickup type. P90s model does fine for me currently.

rockmancentralbob

I have a JTV-59P and a JTV-59.
I want to put a DiMarzio DP209 Super Distortion in the 59P bridge and a DP100 Super Distortion in the 59.
Of course, the tech at Line 6 is saying can't do it because the DCR is around 13.5 or so on each of those and Variax only wants between 6k and 8k.
Says it will sound "dark".
I've read others have put DiMarzio's in theirs and had no issues.

Problem is finding another P90 in that spec range and the tonal characteristics I like.
Any suggestions?