Best solution for online sales of music?

Started by thebrushwithin, April 10, 2013, 10:41:26 AM

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thebrushwithin

Everyone in this forum spends a large amount of time researching new equipment, practicing, and writing music. I am looking for the best solution for online sales of music, on my own website, utilizing Dreamweaver. I would love to know what shopping cart experiences anyone may have, when selling digital downloads for music. It is a bit depressing seeing the number of sales, for 99 cents, and receiving 1 penny for my product(Spotify, etc.). Same old game as record companies, we do the product, and all it entails, and they eat caviar while we have some peanut butter. Getting rich is not the point here, just maximizing profit from selling original music. Too bad this forum doesn't have a music store! I would use it in a heartbeat. So, what shopping cart solutions would my fellow forum members recommend?
Thanks in advance!
PS - I am hoping for a reply such as, "I use ______, and it is great for selling downloads of music."

cell7

#1
Caveat: I do not rely upon my music (I'm creative director for a digital agency) and I certainly don't make a lot of cash from my tunes...but this is what I use and it does ok :)

1. Tunecore.com as a service to deliver (and account for) my music to all digital stores - iTunes, amazon, spotify etc.

2. Bandcamp.com to set up my own digital store where I can specify costs and also use the radiohead model (where people can pay what they want above a certain price)

3. Finding a specialized genre-specific webstore (in my case fixtstore.com) has done very well for me. By targeting the audience that is into my kind of music, I've opened it up to an audience that otherwise wouldn't have found us. I give away a larger percentage (40%) than with iTunes, bandcamp etc but otherwise I don't believe we would have had these sales - and they have been really surprising in comparison to the other channels

Hope this helps!

Edit: just reread your post and I haven't really answered your question! Sorry.
Actually - bandcamp makes a great checkout shopping cart service that you can plug into your site. They take 15% I think...



thebrushwithin

#2
@cell7
Thanks a lot! I found what appeared to be a great deal, Tunecube, but I emailed them to see what they say about having 4 featured artists that sell their music via Tunecube, and NONE of them are currently using their player....red flag, but I'll wait for their reply. It is great because it is $5 a month, per year, and has unlimited tracks, etc., or a lifetime payment of $149!!!! I will post when I find a great deal, and will look closer at Bandcamp, which I did look at previously.
Thanks again!!!

aliensporebomb

#3
I'm using reverbnation for my itunes release but I would not recommend it now since they have switched to what I like to call a "profit off the musicians" based situation.   I pay a yearly fee to keep my music on the itunes store but I probably won't continue this as it seems the amount they want from me yearly has increased and I don't really accrue enough in sales to justify it.  Still, itunes is the big fish of the online music world so I'm reluctant to scuttle it.

Still, if I want to put a new album up I have to pay.  If I want to get more exposure I have to pay.  If I want to get more exposure from their ads I have to pay.
It's one big money gravy train.  One of my associates scuttled his account there altogether.  I have a different possibility.

I'm on iTunes and about two dozen other music stores including Spotify and have had a decent number of sales but I find bandcamp has a better situation:
You keep most of your profit, you find out more about your customers and you have more say in doing things like black friday sales or a sale on your birthday or a day when you feel like giving your customers a break and selling your material for less in the hopes more new listeners approach with wallets in hand.

Presently, I'm happier with bandcamp.  My bandcamp site is at http://www.aliensporebomb.com/ and I have 1 full length rock production, 2 full length ambient productions, a full length soundtrack for a documentary I did and a couple of short EPs.   To put that up to itunes via reverbnation it would cost me far more than I would ever accrue.  Thinking.
My music projects online at http://www.aliensporebomb.com/

GK Devices:  Roland VG-99, Boss GP-10, Boss SY-1000.


thebrushwithin

#5
@aliensporebomb
Thanks very much! Thatbmakes 2 Bandcamp recommendations. I'll check out your store.

thebrushwithin

#6
Thanks Elantric! Cd Baby is who I am using now, and though it is not their fault, I had recent sales of 54 songs, and made a little over $10 !!! They send out your songs to all of the big electronic players, and actually iTunes paid the most. Pirates ( i.e. music companies) complaining about piracy. Some things just never change. Thanks again, I'll read the link info.

Elantric


Kevin M

#8
Good info guys!  I'm working on my first full-length album (nearly done with the writing process) and will definitely make use of this. Could this be 'stickied' somewhere?

thebrushwithin

Hey Folks,
    When I first looked at Tunecube, and could not see a player on any of their featured artists' pages, I was using an iPad. However, when I went to a desktop, the player showed up on each webpage. An interesting observation, as I went to each artist's website - they had the full length of each song in their Tunecube player, and because I use multiple sound cards, I could steal every song, if I wished. So, I told the staff at Tunecube.com about this, and queried about using excerpts for the player, and they replied within 5 minutes, that a preview can be set at 30 seconds or 1 minute. I did read that this particular player has a history of crashes, but this could easily be disinformation from a competitor. So, I think I am going to bite on this one, and anyone else who writes music should check it out. It is VERY inexpensive to subscribe to, and you receive 100% of sales, no matter how many sites you put the player/store on., and this can be placed on all social media sites as well. When you check a song and hit "Buy", it goes directly to Paypal, and you can also return back to your website.
I will still be open to any other suggestions from anyone, but this looks very promising. I hope this is a practical thread for everyone here.

cell7

Just to be clear - my recommendation isnt to use just one of the distribution channels, but ALL of them. Choose between cdbaby or tunecore to get the tracks in all the stores, get yourself a bandcamp [completely free] and do your own website.
If you want to use another service to sell via your own website then fine, but I like the option of bandcamp handling all my own sales outside of the big stores. Also, i can use it as the player and engine to sell through facebook, plus i get a number of sales through people simply browsing around the bandcamp site. Plus... it doesnt use flash so it works on mobiles/tablets unlike tunecube :) Ok i sound like a cracked record, but i like bandcamp so much that i redirected our main URL [www.cell7.com] straight to the bandcamp page because it is so simple and effective.

cell7

Quote from: thebrushwithin on April 10, 2013, 04:17:54 PM
An interesting observation, as I went to each artist's website - they had the full length of each song in their Tunecube player, and because I use multiple sound cards, I could steal every song, if I wished. So, I told the staff at Tunecube.com about this, and queried about using excerpts for the player, and they replied within 5 minutes, that a preview can be set at 30 seconds or 1 minute.

I would also advise to not worry about whether a song can be stolen or not. There are a million ways to steal any audio from any site or player, or download it via torrent or whatever. If someone wants to steal it, they can.
I think the days of previews and excepts of tracks are finished - they tend to just annoy people now. Let people listen to your songs, and if they like it enough they can pay to download them.
*my 2 cents*

montyrivers

Quote from: cell7 on April 11, 2013, 03:26:35 AM
I would also advise to not worry about whether a song can be stolen or not. There are a million ways to steal any audio from any site or player, or download it via torrent or whatever. If someone wants to steal it, they can.
I think the days of previews and excepts of tracks are finished - they tend to just annoy people now. Let people listen to your songs, and if they like it enough they can pay to download them.
*my 2 cents*

If you want money play shows and (if you develop a following) sell t shirts, ladies' underwear is also a hit.

In all seriousness original music doesn't create any tangible income.  It's all about getting paid to play, merchandising and (if you're lucky) endorsements.

Even then if you look at the gross profit across the entire music industry it hasn't seen any growth whatsoever since theb1960's.  It's the same amount of money except it's strewn about.

aliensporebomb

I've found some of my favorite artists ever by just hearing some piece of music during a podcast and sometimes they don't announce who or what it is.

The application "Shazam" for smartphones as well as the application "Soundhound" can sometimes let you know what a piece is like that but sometimes I just stumble into an amazing independent group.  That's where I usually try to buy whatever it is they are selling.  A good example was http://www.mohodisco.com/ which was
just a great little project Bruce White put together. 

I realize that my stuff will be stolen.  Heck, the day after my first original solo CD was out it was up on the original napster the same day and people were downloading it.  I'm just hoping that exposure lead to someone liking my stuff enough to buy it.  If not, well, at least it was heard.
My music projects online at http://www.aliensporebomb.com/

GK Devices:  Roland VG-99, Boss GP-10, Boss SY-1000.

Elantric

#14
QuoteThe application "Shazam" for smartphones as well as the application "Soundhound" can sometimes let you know what a piece is like that but sometimes I just stumble into an amazing independent group.  That's where I usually try to buy whatever it is they are selling.

Using iPhone and SoundHound, I buy a lot of stuff with its links to iTunes.

In the Android world, Shazam and Amazon Music functions the same


QuoteI'm just hoping that exposure lead to someone liking my stuff enough to buy it.  If not, well, at least it was heard.

Maybe a Film Director will hear one of your tracks, feel its perfect to set the mood for his film.

One of my old drummers in LA is  Cliff Matrtinez - who was first on his block with a Prophet 2000 sampler in 1986
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sequential_Circuits_Prophet_2000

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sampler_%28musical_instrument%29


Thru friends, director Steven Soderbergh met Cliff, and handed him a pile of Tangerine Dream LP's he wanted to use as examples of the type of sound he was looking for - and 2 weeks later, Cliff was Hired.
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001752/

The rest is history.
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0553498/?ref_=fn_al_nm_1


There are several middle aged guitarists making a decent living from Film Music.

aliensporebomb

I'm thinking of a guy like David Torn as he's doing a lot of film soundtracks these days in addition to his solo works.

David hangs out at The Gear Page and talks about some of the soundtracks he's done and some you wouldn't expect "Lars and the Real Girl".

Heck, it happened to me doing that documentary.  Now I just need to have more people hear that so they can hire me to do more of it!
My music projects online at http://www.aliensporebomb.com/

GK Devices:  Roland VG-99, Boss GP-10, Boss SY-1000.

Elantric

Just need to find a way to be included in the "discover new music" in the Songza Andoid App.


http://drippler.com/samsung/galaxy_note_ii/?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Weekly-2013-04-11T09:00:01+00:00#758625


==

Songza: Your Personal Music Concierge
By Hagop Kavafian


With the rise of the Internet, most people have turned to online music solutions, causing many radio stations to lose a significant amount of their audience. In addition to downloading songs on iTunes, on-demand streaming services, such as Spotify, Deezer and Grooveshark, have grown very popular by letting you listen to virtually any track on your mobile phone, provided you pay a monthly subscription.

While these services are very convenient, radios are essentially different in the sense that they play a specific genre without allowing you to make your own playlist. Pandora has tried to recapture this analogue radio concept of letting you pick the genre but not the songs, as it automatically generates playlists based on an artist, genre or composer you select. Songza takes the concept even further: instead of asking you to pick a genre or an artist first, it analyzes context and suggests playlists accordingly.

Like the article? You should subscribe and follow us on twitter.
Concierge: Context-Aware Playlists

The first time you launch Songza, you'll be asked if you're a socialite and want to connect the app to your Facebook account or create a standalone one instead. Once this formality is completed, you can immediately start using the app. Based on the day and time, Songza suggests activities you could be doing. For instance, a smart guess for Saturday afternoons is doing housework or spending time with your family – or in the case below, saving the world.
Songza suggests activities depending on the context – Yes, saving the world is one of my daily activities!

Songza suggests activities depending on the context – Yes, saving the world is one of my daily activities!

After you select an activity, Songza will present you with a list of various genres that are likely to correspond to what you're doing. Once you pick the one you're in the mood for, your selection is narrowed down to three playlists, which usually correspond to six genres: tap one and put your headphones on!
Picking a genre based on an activity

Picking a genre based on an activity

While listening to a playlist, you can pause or skip a track and give the song a thumbs up or thumbs down, which will help Songza learn your music preferences and provide you with customized playlists and tracks in the future. It's worth mentioning the application integrates perfectly with Android, as it lets you perform these actions right from the notification bar. It also has the option to share the playlist with your friends or buy the song on Google's Play Store, if you'd like to listen to it on demand.
Songza displays the album cover both in the app and the notification bar

Songza displays the album cover both in the app and the notification bar
Manual Selection of Playlists

If you would rather select a playlist manually, Songza has you covered: you can either browse Popular playlists – Trending, Featured and All Time – or look for personalized recommendations using the Explore option. The latter breaks down playlists by Genre, Activities, Moods, Decades, Culture and Record-Store Clerk, and if for some reason these options weren't enough, you can tap the Search icon and find playlists featuring your favorite artists.
Exploring playlists

Exploring playlists
Make It Yours

In addition to remembering your ratings, Songza lets you favorite playlists you like. It also keeps track of your recent playlists and activities, which allows the app to present you with personalized suggestions next time you use it. Because it syncs with the cloud, your preferences are stored across platforms – I'm always delighted to find my favorite and recent playlists on my iPad after listening to them on my Android phone!
Popular and Personal Playlists

Popular and Personal Playlists

If you connect Songza with Facebook, you'll also have the option to view the playlists your friends listen to and share yours with them. Lastly, a nice feature worth mentioning is the Sleep Timer, which lets you program when the app should stop playing and let you sleep peacefully.

You'll also be happy to note that Songza features a beautiful tablet-optimized interface, that makes full use of the landscape orientation in tablets.
Conclusion

Songza clearly has an interesting vision on how and when to deliver the right music at the right time. It learns to suggest the appropriate playlists based on what you are likely to do at a specific time. Using the application when working out, for instance, is a real pleasure: it knows what genre to play without you having to touch your phone or change tracks – unless you really don't like a song, that is. I personally believe Songza and Pandora are both great solutions and are not meant to replace each other.

Even though the application is only available on the American and Canadian Play Stores, it does work outside of these countries. This is delightful, as you can still use the app when working out at your hotel gym during a business trip, for example, something you can't do with Pandora...

Les

Quote from: thebrushwithin on April 10, 2013, 02:24:19 PM
Thanks Elantric! Cd Baby is who I am using now, and though it is not their fault, I had recent sales of 54 songs, and made a little over $10 !!! They send out your songs to all of the big electronic players, and actually iTunes paid the most. Pirates ( i.e. music companies) complaining about piracy. Some things just never change. Thanks again, I'll read the link info.
One thing worth noting is the difference between music collectors, music buyers and music consumers.

Music consumers are everywhere but although they are probably the largest segment of the market, I doubt that they are a good source of income from music sales.  They likely own some mp3s and a few CDs but they probably get most of their music from radio or online streaming or copying from friends. 

I use the term music buyers to refer to people who actually purchase most of their music but do so based on "the whim of the day" -- that is, they hear a song they like so they buy it -- but they don't necessarily follow any one artist or buy albums or have significant favorites, etc.  And they probably treat music as "disposable" -- i.e., when their IPod gets full or they haven't listened to a song in quite awhile, they probably just delete stuff and move on.  They represent a lot of music sales but how many songs you will actually sell to any one of them isn't a bright prospect.  There are a lot of musicians hawking songs compared to the number of buyers. 

Music collectors, on the other hand, buy music regularly but tend to have "band loyalty" (as opposed to "brand loyalty" :) ).  I am a music collector.  Like most that I know, I tend to be a "complete-ist" (i.e. I find an artist I like and I want to own their complete catalog).  I watch my favorite artists for new material.  I do my best to support them in both sales and attending live performances where I can and for my favorites, I do my best to promote them to others.  And while I do not know how I compare in this regard to other collectors, I almost never buy mp3s.  I like CDs.  I like having the whole album rather than just one song.   I like the artwork.  I like having something tangible, not just a recording.  And when I want to promote them to my friends, I can buy a stack of CDs and hand them out -- not something I can conveniently do with MP3s.  Most collectors I know are mainly CD collectors as well, but I don't know if that is typical.  There aren't a lot of collectors, relatively speaking, but if they like your music, they will likely be among your best customers.  Record labels have never catered to collectors because the size of their markets are so large and their catalog of artists so vast that they can do just fine marketing to music buyers.  Individual artists on the other hand would probably do a lot better to try to court collectors rather than buyers.  I don't necessarily know how one does that, but in my case an excellent first step is to sell CDs.

- Les

thebrushwithin

After much soul searching on the subject of musicians being paid a pittance for their creative work, I realized that this is just the world we live in. I complain about receiving 1 penny for a song that costs 99 cents, and then I realize that most of my recording tools were assembled by Chinese slave labor, where the people get almost nothing for working on an assembly line, making these gadgets for us to compute our music on. Perhaps it is karmically fitting that the end user makes very little money...

LPHovercraft

ReBeat Digital. Keep 85% of online sales. They just added CD on Demand through Amazon. Highly recommended.
Houston Haynes - LPHovercraft

thebrushwithin


montyrivers

Quote from: thebrushwithin on April 18, 2013, 07:04:46 AM
After  much soul searching on the subject of musicians being paid a pittance for their creative work, I realized that this is just the world we live in. I complain about receiving 1 penny for a song that costs 99 cents, and then I realize that most of my recording tools were assembled by Chinese slave labor, where the people get almost nothing for working on an assembly line, making these gadgets for us to compute our music on. Perhaps it is karmically fitting that the end user makes very little money...

Eff that!!  My Carvin is made in the USA!  My Roland gear is made in Japan!  I want return of investment!  I support a well payed, skilled labor force!  This s**t is expensive.   ;)

thebrushwithin


montyrivers

I think you're missing the tongue in cheek nature of my reply, sir-  But since you asked.  I built it from parts.  The motherboard, heatsink and ram are from Thai based companies.  The case is a Rosewill, and I don't know where Intel made their Core2 processors.  Power supply is an Earthwatts, not sure where that's made.  MSI Graphics card with nvidia chipset. 

thebrushwithin

Yes, I thought you might be serious.. :o.. my real point is that we should all be conscious of cheap labor, being used to make our recordings possible, ie computers. As a result, it seems musicians are also considered "cheap labor". Globalization has turned artists' works into commodities, where only the consumer benefits, mostly without regard of the work that goes into it. And of course, corporations are the kings that care nothing about any of the work force they profit from. Don't get me wrong, I am certainly not a "buy American only" guy. Workers of the world should all make a decent living wage!
.....He said as he typed the message on a Chinese iPad..... ;)