Is Roland mistargeting you with its demos?

Started by Rhcole, May 21, 2014, 12:53:03 AM

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Rhcole

I posted the informal survey of VGuitar users on this site a few weeks ago
www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=11223.msg81944#msg81944

because I wanted to know more about who we are. We only got 12 people to fill it out so far, but there were a few obvious points.

I looked over the responses, and there wasn't a single response (so far) by somebody who primarily plays metal or shred styles. We have lots of multi-style, jazz, rock, blues players, but thus far no metal. This stuck out to me because I just watched a GP-10 demo where the player probably devoted 80% of the demo to fast metal and shred licks. I remember this also from other demos for the GR-55 and VG-99. And you may have noticed how many of the presets on these boxes are devoted to hard core metal sounds.

I wonder if that's who's buying these products. Roland might be better off showcasing somebody using their products in a cover band, for example. Or a solo act in a bar.

Personally, I usually wait for the demo guy to finish his lightening-fast mega licks in the demos to glean some information I can use, but that's just me. I absolutely respect the skills, talent, and dedication of these musicians, but I'm trying to learn how I can use the Vproducts, not be amazed by the player.

Thus far, it seems like the people who get into this stuff are using them for studio/cover band/solo gigs where the artist wants to fill out the sound, avoid hiring other musicians, or explore unusual styles. If true, that's who Roland should be trying to reach more of.

NOW, if you play metal or hard core music, more power to you, but heck, fill out the survey, will ya'?

jburns

in my eyes their marketing seems to target underdeveloped players. everything from their videos to the boxes the gear comes in, is childish corny and unprofessional. i would gather the message there is "you can be good if you buy this" / "its everything you need". maybe what you are seeing is not 80percent shred solos, but the message of "buy this so you can do this too".

as someone that does play 80 percent metal synth solos i personally don't see them showing that off or shipping with those patches. i understand the preset that was showcased for the gr55 was even named "metal synth solo". but to me i wouldn't use it for anything. and the patches shipped on my vg99, every single one that was related to keyboard or metal was imo garbage. in fact i think the vg-99 is horrible for anything heavy. but i use it anyway for its ability of control. when i listen to patches guys here have made, and look at what they are doing I'm amazed. i wish elantric, bill r, and rolandvg99 played strictly metal so i could use their patches!

if you clash our two outlooks together rhcole, i would say the result is that roland is just using younger performers to try and help sell a product. and that may be one the few things roland is doing right. ive found that most of roland's gear is able to contribute alot more in a cover band than say a death metal band.

i also wanna point out that most of rolands personnel showcase very little of the gear. rob marcello, who is their shred-solo-80s metal guy usually does EXACTLY what you posted. however, he often talks more about the gear he is demoing than any of their other guys. he'll show off a whole slew of patches, chorus and wah types, clean and driven sounds etc and his vids have always given me more a description of what a pedal is capable of. the rest of their guys, like alex huchings, seem to only use one or two sounds typically in a demo. i know for a fact metal shreders aren't the ones buying anything in the GK line lol. and the ones who are like myself are better suited in the "multi-style" group you offered. i don't think roland knows who IS buying these things, which is why they don't have anyone showing what they can be used for. since roland's guys demo all their products, when they get to the vg/gr side your gonna then see horrible demos of those lines. what they need is someone to specifically cover these things and for the reasons you mentioned. i don't see them using anyone to do that anytime soon though. the truth is these guys CAN'T showcase the Vguitar line and thats why we only see the dress-to-impress kind of demos you are talking about. i agree with you all the way. but my "brutal" side wanted to add that they do a horrible job at metal patches as well. thats the only side of me that considers using other gear so i thought it was worth mentioning.

aliensporebomb

Informal survey where?  Link please?  Responses on the rest forthcoming.
My music projects online at http://www.aliensporebomb.com/

GK Devices:  Roland VG-99, Boss GP-10, Boss SY-1000.

Elantric

#3
QuoteInformal survey where?  Link please?  Responses on the rest forthcoming.

If you subscribe for Notifications on specific areas of the forum, while this may cut down on traffic of no interest, it may also restrict your participation on threads posted in other areas - this "poll" was posted in the General Discussion Area here:

The Great VGuitar Informal and Not Officially Approved Survey of Gigs
www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=11223.msg81944#msg81944


FWIW - How to read / browse all recent threads:

https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?action=recent

   

gandolf

Hi rhcole,

Really interesting point you've raised.  I'd be interested to see the marketing research that goes on at Roland....another interesting thing to see would be the product development at concept level and how they work through that stage....

Your survey on the forum is a great idea...but you'll have to moderate the results  bit.....since you are really only surveying "forum" users...that may not include certain other sets of gr/vg users?

So to be more meaningful, you'd cast a wider net....maybe survey the line6 site...could be the gr/vg " shred/metal" guitarists are all over there...??

As far as targeting the products to shred/metal players....perhaps the reason for this is that (maybe) the jazz/multi guys are more likely to "not be turned off" by a good shred lick....whereas more so metal guys might be dismissive of someone playing "all the things you are"...???

I don't know...just some devils advocate stuff I'm adding to the discussion...

supernicd

Interesting - I didn't know what you were going for when I filled out the informal survey.

To answer your question from the subject line, yes, and no.  Roland's demos were enough to intrigue me but not to get me to the sale.  I don't play metal but I have a respect for it.  It's a very technical genre.

To get me to buy a GR-55 what was needed was about 6 months of browsing this site, reading posts, listening to sound clips, and watching videos created by the VGuitar community.  A lot of the folks here contributed to my purchase decision.  I think it was Kennis Russell's videos that might have finally tipped me over the edge, since he produced so much content, and really showed the spectrum this box could cover.
Strat w/ GK-3, Godin LGXT
VG-99, GR-55, GP-10
---------------------------------------------------------------

thebrushwithin

Actually, this is typical American marketing....." You too can be as cool as me, just buy this and you will be as successful as I am"!!!!!!! The only thing missing is " BUT WAIT, THERE'S MORE!!!".
I would love to see one of the project managers, who maybe doesn't play so well, give a complete explanation of each feature, perhaps narrating while a tasteful player performs the engineer's narrative.
But you know, it wouldn't surprise me if the engineering is dealing only with algorithms, and has no means of interpreting it, in real world utilization, so they hire players, who just do what they do, and as anyone who remembers their youth knows, speed is the answer. (Not!) I would just love to see them utilize Adrian Belew, David Torn , Brian Eno, our own Bill Ruppert, etc. to actually show how they build a patch....you know.... The expansive approach, which might even have a side effect like showing the young, hungry market the correct approach to becoming an artist, instead of a sad clone, with a NASCAR mentality. I'll bet the engineers would approve.

GraemeJ

In pretty much the same vein, I find guitar manufacturers fail to produce demos that really show off the specifics of their instruments. 

They nearly all put their instrument in the hands of a really good player (although there is nothing inherently wrong with that) who then proceeds to stuff it though an overdriven amplifier and play stuff that many of us could only dream of doing.  The net result is that they añl sound pretty much the same! 

What the potential purchaser wants to hear is what the guitar sounds like in the hands of a competent player - we don't need a load of electronic mush and masterful playing ability hiding the true sound of the instrument. 

DreamTheory

#8
What got me on GR 55 was the breadth- including modeling, FX, and PCM, plus other bells and whistles.

As far as videos, I was most impressed by the rather nice clean jazzbox model I heard Jack Thammarat playing in his cover of a Pat Metheny song.



Not just the tasty playing but that a nylon guitar could sound that much like a a 335.
electric: Epiphone Dot semihollow body, acoustic: mahogany jumbo, recording: Cubase Artist 11 or Tascam DP008