Godin LGX-SA / LGXT

Started by feloniouspunk, February 01, 2008, 08:04:33 AM

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blindjammer2015

I may look into that as well, as it would be good to have both synthes. But it's possible to help maximize tracking efficiency and tame errors and false triggers without the subsonic filters then? I'm on a low budget, and my wallet is still hurting after buying the Godin. lol

Autana

#276
Quote from: Elantric on September 01, 2016, 09:08:23 AM
This Primovasound GKFX-21 is an external sub filter - requires no technical knowledge to install and use.
http://www.primovasound.com/gkfx_21.html
http://www.primovasound.com/pdf/GKFX21_Manual.pdf


That's right, personally recommend it, I use two, one for the GR-55 and the other for the GP-10, although the latter does not need it since Roland/Boss noticeably improved sub frequencies filtering, but the plus of an additional input guitar, volume controls and pedal access to S1 / S2 switches convinced me to hold both.

Quote from: blindjammer2015 on September 01, 2016, 12:19:55 PM
Thanks! Will give this a look once I play around with the current setup a little more. Are there any benefits to these filters other than smoother playing of the analogue synthes? I play mostly worship and classic rock so am not sure how often I'm going to be using these necessarily other than for fun. Anyone used this particular subsonic filter? Impressions?

Quote from: admsustainiac on September 01, 2016, 12:42:59 PM
A sub filter  can reduce noise that occurs when you rest your hand near the Godin's Piezo bridge and reduce occurences of false triggered notes and tame  tracking errors of the GR-55's  Guitar to PCM Synth and Guitar to MIDI triggering as well.

Indeed!  and IMO the subsonic filtering improves performance in general in instruments with RMC bridge/& any piezos and even more noticeable with COSM sounds like simulation of archi-known Metheny/Fripp favorite GR-300 synth patch and also with some PCM tones like A.Piano. Also note as I point before that the Piezo EQ TONE controls PIEZO LOW (BASS) and PIEZO HIGH in 'System/Global Guitar Mode/GK setup' have no effect at all with the GR-55 GR-300 simulation and will no help with palm bridge mute noises with that COSM tone nor any of the six instruments under SYNTH category, Acoustic/NYLON, Acoustic/SITAR. For the rest of COSM instruments, Piezo EQ tone controls in System/Global/GUITARMODE - GK setup will work fine and help in fine tuning tweaking seeking a better tracking/response.

GR-55, GP-10, GI-20, Godin xtSA, GodinNylon MultiAc, Giannini classical, 3 GK-3'd gtrs, Cube 80XL, Primova GKFX-21 (x2)

Fear just pulls you out of being true to music, which is coming from a place of love. Love is the opposite of fear. I stay away from anything fear-related.
- Tal Wilkenfeld -

blindjammer2015

Seems like the filters help more with tracking for the synthe models. As I won't be using them much, I might wait to buy one until I need it, since that's a little out of my budget at the moment. But I'll definitely keep these in mind, though I didn't see any buying information on the page when I looked. Thanks all for this line of advice!Any other tips for this newbie are definitely welcome and appreciated.

CodeSmart

Blindjammer, I'm the guy building the filters. I'm more or less out if units right now, but will most probably refine the design and build more units during the winter. If you care to send an email to sound@primova.se I will contact you again later with my very lowest possible price.

I feel I do a good thing to myself if offering my things to students and disabled people at a different price level. When I was young I was there, I was poor. If interested, just send the mail and I'll see what I can do.

Robert
But I got more gear than I need...and I like it!

blindjammer2015

That's very generous of you... and I will drop you an email soon as I am able!

To be honest, the low budget has nothing to do with me being disabled... I just don't work full time and also don't play at any paid gigs, which explains my lack of a high musical budget. I don't consider my blindness any more than an occasional hastle or inconvenience, but that's not really for this thread. But I will definitely contact you soon and the offer is most certainly appreciated! Diving into this synthesizer deal is difficult enough without being able to fine tune things on the fly as I can't read the screens... the filter will hopefully help at least streamline the process and give me a few less things to worry about!

blindjammer2015

#280
Got a chance to play a bit more with the gr-55 today, and a friend was around to help me set things up a bit more. Using the base settings found in this thread and others for Godin guitars, I found that having the tone high at -3 DB cuts off a bit more trebble than I'd like so might raise it a little more somewhere between 0 and +6 maybe? Also, according to the system summary I was able to obtain using the gr-55 floorboard, it seems that some of my settings didn't save! I changed my settings for veloscity dynamics, play feel, nuance dynamics and trim parameters as well as string sensativity, but it doesn't appear to have saved it.. or my friend was giving me incorrect feedback. Pasting the settings I have here just for reference, in case there is something wrong that my friend wasn't able to spot as he knows nothing about guitars and the like. The scale says 10 in the text summary, but should it not say ST or 25.5? Thanks again all for being so patient and supportive in helping me get started!

**********Guitar Mode GK set 1**********

[name] =         
[Hex PU Type] = Piezo RMC
[Scale] = 10
[PU Phase] = Normal
[PU Direction] = Normal
[S1/S2 Position] = Normal
[Normal PU Gain] = 0 dB
[Piezo Low] = -2 dB
[Piezo High] = -3 dB
[String Distance PU Bridge 1st String] = 12.5
[String Distance 2nd String] = 12.5
[String Distance 3rd String] = 12.5
[String Distance 4th String] = 17.0
[String Distance 5th String] = 16.0
[String Distance 6th String] = 15.0
[String Sensitivity 1st String] = 11
[String Sensitivity 2nd String] = 20
[String Sensitivity 3rd String] = 20
[String Sensitivity 4th String] = 20
[String Sensitivity 5th String] = 20
[String Sensitivity 6th String] = 20
[Play feel] = 3
[Low velocity cut] = 5
[Velocity dynamics] = 5
[Nuance dynamics] = 5
[Nuance trim] = 5
[Down Shift] = 0


Any thoughts?

pilotron

Love the godin

only used it with
GP-10 and GR-55 and with softsynths via the usb from GP-10

still hava a lot to learn on this guitar midi stuff but fascinates the hell outta little me :)

Greetingz from Belgium

Pieter

blindjammer2015

You're definitely not alone. I've had it for three days and I love it... just want to get this gr-55 up and running so I can start using it live. Also, remove as many tracking problems as possible and see what about my technique needs to be cleaned up.

blindjammer2015

Yet another question. when selecting one of the three factory patches that support the normal pickups, I can only hear the normal pickups in the mixed position. Do I have to follow this topic's instructions to enable the guitar position as well?
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=3402.0
I understand what I have to do, just haven't been able to do it as I can't locate the setting and noone is around to help me read the bloody thing. Thanks!

P.S.: The topic says that I need the short cable from the GK input to the guitar output on the guitar... how does this work for piezo users like myself?

Elantric

With a Godin , you don't need the short 1/4" jumper cable

blindjammer2015

I didn't think so, I was just curious and wanted to make sure. Wish roland had given us a few more factory patches with normal pickups as part of the mix... will see if I can't get the switch to work in all three positions properly as, again, right now I can only hear the normal guitar pickups in the mixed position. Synthe only gives me the synthe sounds just fine... only the guitar position doesn't work.

blindjammer2015

Back again now that I've actually managed to get someone to help me tweek things a little. Normal pickups are now working fine in the patch I'm starting to build... just need to add effects and EQ. Still need to bring the guitar into the shop to get the fret buzz sorted out, but the rest should be ok... however, now I have another issue. The modelling tones I want to use in this patch, namely the acoustic guitars, all sound off to me. Too jangly and way too many high frequencies, but according to the demos I've watched of people running through the acoustic sounds in detail, they shouldn't be like this on a Godin guitar. See atatched wav sample... any thoughts on what I could do to get a warmer sound from the acoustics? Pasting my GK settings here again for reference.

**********Guitar Mode GK set 1**********

[name] =
[Hex PU Type] = Piezo RMC
[Scale] = 10
[PU Phase] = Normal
[PU Direction] = Normal
[S1/S2 Position] = Normal
[Normal PU Gain] = 0 dB
[Piezo Low] = -1 dB
[Piezo High] = -8 dB
[String Distance PU Bridge 1st String] = 12.5
[String Distance 2nd String] = 12.5
[String Distance 3rd String] = 12.5
[String Distance 4th String] = 17.0
[String Distance 5th String] = 16.0
[String Distance 6th String] = 15.0
[String Sensitivity 1st String] = 0
[String Sensitivity 2nd String] = 0
[String Sensitivity 3rd String] = 0
[String Sensitivity 4th String] = 0
[String Sensitivity 5th String] = 0
[String Sensitivity 6th String] = 0
[Play feel] = 2
[Low velocity cut] = 8
[Velocity dynamics] = 2
[Nuance dynamics] = 4
[Nuance trim] = 4
[Down Shift] = 0

Appologies for the recording quality. I had both outputs going to my soundcard... not sure why it only came out in mono. As always, any help is appreciated! I'm wondering if the stock Godin electric strings are too light or if it has something to do with how low the action is? Incidentally, the video I watched was this one from Kennis Russell.

Roland GR-55 Guitar Synthesizer: Acoustic Sounds Demo



Thoughts?

shawnb

#287
Blindjammer2015 -

Some options to experiment with to warm that up include:
  -  The "Body" setting for that COSM tone
  -  The "Tone" setting for that COSM tone  (this is fortunately easily accessed as one of the "basic" updates - clicking RIGHT when in the TONE menu)
  -  Your EQ

Also, some folks like using the EZ Edit.  That feature is easily accessed and worth experimenting with. 

In my experience piezos are brighter than mag PUs for the modeling tones.  Some of that is just the nature of the beast. 
Address the process rather than the outcome.  Then, the outcome becomes more likely.   - Fripp

blindjammer2015

Just curiouus as to how Kennis Russell was able to get the consistently warm tone from all the models before playing with them, as I'm assuming the LGX-SA and XT-SA share the same RMC board. I'll give those suggestions a try and see what helps. Anyone else have any thoughts?

shawnb

Good question.

It's possible he created his own patches.

Another big factor is his amp and eq settings on it.

Also, I am sure he was in a better recordings environment.    The room makes a difference.   How he mic'd his amp makes a difference.

Finally, the volume level used makes a huge difference as well. 

Address the process rather than the outcome.  Then, the outcome becomes more likely.   - Fripp

blindjammer2015

Well, from the video, according to what he was saying, he was working with a completely empty patch. But EQ settings might be the answer as right now I'm running the gr-55 directly through studio speakers as I don't have a suitable amp.

Elantric

#291
QuoteI'm running the gr-55 directly through studio speakers

Thats actually one of the best methods to run the GR-55 

Set the GR-55's Output Mode to : LINE/PHONES  - feed GR-55 outputs into flat response near field powered studio speakers

blindjammer2015

No other thoughts on the jangly acoustic tones? Still trying to figure this out. Looking to try using this setup on a gig running direct into the PA for a worship session on Monday. Hoping to have at least some better results by then. haha.

Elantric

#293
Several GR-55 Acoustic patches are here

https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?board=74.0

And verify you have moved the Godin built in Piezo PU volume to zero (upper slider far right

blindjammer2015

Thanks. Will try these after I find a way to upload them to the gr-55... since the floorboard, unfortunately, isn't accessible.

shawnb

#295
blindjammer2015-

He does in fact do most of the video with "body" set to 80.   The Body setting goes from 0-100, with 100 being the fullest sound, so his setting of 80 will warm it up a fair amount. 

He also has Tone at 0.   Tone goes from -50 (very warm) to +50 (very bright). 

He also has his high E string level set to 80, where all other strings are at 100, so that cuts highs a bit. 

Later, from about 5:45 on, he demonstrates different settings of body & tone. 

However...  Even these settings aren't enough.  I've tried it with my piezo guitar, and with EVERYTHING but model off, I get the same thin results you do.   I am convinced he has either an AMP effect and/or some EQ enabled.  Or, he is doing EQ or amp sim post video production. 

The 4th amp, Full Range, is intended to work with acoustics.  Things improve a lot if you do that & adjust bass, mid, treble & presence.   

The 1st amp, Boss Clean is pretty interesting with acoustics, it sounds "live", but a bit too warm.   

Try amp#15, VO Clean also.
Address the process rather than the outcome.  Then, the outcome becomes more likely.   - Fripp

blindjammer2015

Hmm. I'll play around with these a bit more maybe on Monday before my church gig when I can get someone to read those screens to me. I didn't have an amp set for that patch yet, and that might play into it a little. The results I had in the test file were passable as an acoustic sound, but it did sound a little too thin and not warm enough for my tastes as I like fuller and rich sounds from acoustics when amped up. And there was no indication he had an EQ going on during the demo, which was why I was confused as I got the implication that he was just using a wiped patch and playing with the model tones with different body and tone settings. Will mess around with the amp selections and see what better results I get, if any. Strings might also be a factor.

Singwas

Yesterday i used my LGX SA (2006) for the first time with normal outputs (not 13-Pin). The upper output (piezo + Humbucker) seemed to be louder than the other while only using the Humbuckers (played without piezo). Even the Volume Controller seemed to be more sensitive. Is this possible? I played into a Behringer U-Control UCA222 USB-Interface via CCK with Jam Up Pro on an iPad 2.
GR 55
Godin LGXSA
Roland Testgitarre

admin

#298
The upper mag + Piezo Jack is active buffered output and may be louder ( and brighter / higher frequency range ) with some gear , compared to the lower Mag PU only passive output Jack

The gear you feed might be more sensitive to these differences

ChrisF

#299
I played a friend's Godin LGXT through a VG-99 and fell in love with the instrument. Now I want to buy one! Looking online, I've seen some folks say that Godin improved the electronics around 2012, so get a newer one. Other folks say the new ones have a Richlite fingerboard instead of ebony, so go with an old one. Also, some seem to think the synth pickups (RMC?) used by Godin are inferior to Roland's GK-3.

I would be grateful for any feedback from anyone with experience with the LGXT! Thanks.