Universal Audio Apollo

Started by scratch17, August 19, 2015, 12:56:30 PM

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scratch17

I recently added three Universal Audio Apollo interfaces to my studio. So I thought I'd share my first impressions with forum members.

I have had a MOTU Traveler Mk1 for years and added a used Traveler Mk3 about two years ago. These interfaces were great value and have really good overall quality. I've been looking at the MOTU AVB line as potential expansion of my studio interfaces. Having analyzed my exact needs, I came to the conclusion that I should go with the Universal Audio interfaces. The tipping point for me was the Apollo platform's more capable studio utility.

My Apollo Purchases

I started in early July with the purchase of a new Apollo 8 Duo (2 DSP's) and a deeply discounted 10 plug-in bundle. UA offers any 10 of their plugns at $120 each when you buy a new Apollo 8. I had 45 days to select my new plugins, and they are all available as full function demos. So I waited to make my selections.

I decided that I needed more inputs than I had with the Apollo 8 and two MOTU Travelers. I also saw that used Apollo Quad TB (AKA Silverface SF) with added plugins were selling for good prices on Ebay.

So I bought one. It came with a boat load of UA plugins (most of which I wanted). The original owner transferred the plugins to my account. I didn't need any more input / output. And I now had 6 DSPs. (BF and SF come with the same SHARCs). I was set.

Still, I was bitten by the "I want more plug-ins" bug. So I perused the bay and found another Quad TB SF with more plugins that I wanted. I bought another. So I now have an Apollo 8 Duo (BF) and two Apollo Quad TB (SF) models.

Basic Apollo Hardware Description

The Apollo line has real time DSP on board that runs the UA plugins. Even when inserted into a DAW, the DSP on the Apollo runs the plugins.

Current Apollo models come in three flavors, with one, two or four SHARC processors built in. All have built in Thunderbolt 2 connectivity. The previous models come with Firewire or Thunderbolt. There is an upgrade TB card available for older model Firewire Apollos. Firewire and TB cannot currently be mixed. UA says that situation should be remedied soon.

Up to four Apollo Thunderbolt interfaces can be connected. UA provides a control panel, meter and console software that makes use as close to plug and play as I've ever seen with pro audio equipment.

The Apollo 8 (AKA Blackface or BF) has 18 x 24 simultaneous input and outputs. Apollo 8 comes with 4 unison mic preamps. These inputs can be configured as line inputs. They have combo XLR / TRS jacks.  There are also two Hi Z inputs on the front, but their use shuts off one or both of the first two mic preamps. There are four more analog line inputs.  There are 8 line outs, a set of monitor outputs (switchable to fixed line outs) and two headphone outputs. Apollo 8 also has 8 channels of ADAT (SMUX) and 2 channels of coaxial S/PDIF inputs and outputs. There are two TB ports and word clock in and out as well.

Clock Synchronization is Simple across Multiple Interfaces

The synchronization between multiple Apollos is automatic. You choose which Apollo you want to be master by moving it to the top of the Apollo control panel. All others become slaves and synch.

What about other manufacturers' digital gear?

S/PDIF Connections

The S/PDIF inputs have a feature I find indispensable. They can take the 24/44.1 output of my Kemper or VG-99 and convert to a higher sample rate. This is a single setting in the UA console on the S/PDIF's track. I have three Apollos, so I have three stereo S/PDIF inputs and outputs. One connects my KPA. Another connects my VG-99.

ADAT Connections

I have an RMC Fanout Box. I connect its six analog outputs to four inputs on my Traveler MK1 and two on my Traveler MK3. I also connect the Fanout's stereo outputs to the third and fourth inputs on the Mk3. All of these are Hi Z inputs. That's why I kept my MOTUs.

I connect the MOTUs to the Apollo via ADAT. The Travelers can synch via ADAT or word clock. I output a word clock from the Apollo (set as master) and connect it to a Traveler (set as slave). I could use built in ADAT synch, but word clock is more reliable and it's quick and easy.

UA Console Software

You can run Apollo with or without the console, and with or without a DAW. Basically the console is a mixer and plugin manager for the UA plugins. The console automatically adds tracks to the console based on the hardware connected. So, for example, if you had an Apollo 8 Duo and an Apollo Twin Single, you'd have the 18 X 24 tracks of the Apollo 8 and the 2 x 6 of the Apollo Twin.

The console has 2 stereo aux buses and 4 stereo cue mix buses, as well as a stereo master bus.

During tracking, you can record plugins either dry, wet or both. Real time plugin latency is negligible. It is typically less than 2 ms.

All connected Apollos use their built in SHARCs for any input track on that unit. If a track is on a unit that has four SHARCs, that's what's available for real time use. With my three Apollos, I can get 2, 4, and 4 DSPs on the hardware's respective tracks. I don't get 10 DSPs for use on a single track.

The master Apollo has the requirement of running all DSP on outputs in the current version of the console. So output tracks only get assigned DSP based on one connected Apollo ... the master unit.

Unison Technology

UA calls the BF and SF mic preamps "unison preamps". The unison descriptor refers to hardware interactivity between the mic preamps and the UA unison plugins. There are currently four of these: Neve 88RS, Neve 773, API Vision and UA 610. All are channel strips.

Quoting UA:

QuoteUnison-enabled UAD preamp plug-ins reconfigure the physical input impedance, gain staging response, and other parameters of Apollo's mic preamp hardware to match the emulated preamp's design characteristics.

For example, if you insert the new 610-A from the just-released UA 610 Tube Preamp & EQ Collection, your Apollo's front-panel controls are, in essence, transformed into the classic 610-A's control set, complete with its unique gain stage behaviors.

There are also three unison guitar pedal emulations which work with the Hi Z inputs (Apollo 8 only). They are RAW (a ProCo Rat), TS-808 (Tube Screamer) and Bermuda Triangle (Fuzz Face).

Differences Between SF and BF

SF has both XLR and separate TRS jacks for the first four (mic / line) inputs. BF has combo jacks. Some users like the SF better because they don't have to repatch from behind the BF units. I bought a Mamba combo XLR patch bay. It brings the rear panel to the front of my rack.

There is better converters and specs (about 3 db) on the new BF units, compared to the SF units. I haven't done mic recording yet, so I can't say if I can tell a difference.

The line preamps in the BF models can be turned off. This is a really nice feature. I have a Mackie Onyx 1620. I use 4 of its mic pres, connected via its direct outputs to my Apollo 8. Being able to shut off the internal UA preamps means I'm able to use the Onyx preamps direct to the A/D stage of my Apollo. The SF units cannot turn off their internal preamps.

The Hi Z inputs on the BF are Unison enabled. They are not on the SF units. To take advantage of unison guitar plugins on a SF you'd have to output your guitar into a DI connected to a unison mic/line input.

Monitoring

The headphone amps on the BF are upgraded compared to the SF. I have a pair of Sennheiser 700 headphones. I can hear a not so subtle difference when using the cans on the BF versus the SF.

Also new in console 2 is the ability to assign a pair of line outputs to a second set of monitors. It's a nice added feature that works for me. I currently use Event PS-8 and 20/20P monitors in a 5.1 setup. I'm looking to buy a pair of Genelecs for stereo use. So having two monitor buses will be nice for comparison purposes.

The UA Plugins

IMHO the plugins are top notch. I am blessed with almost every plugin I want. Originally most of the plugins were oriented towards mixing and mastering. UA has added more specialized plugins that include guitar oriented, as well as specialized plugins such as tape saturation, Moog, filters, etc.

Running UA Plugins in Your DAW

The UA plugins appear in your DAW as if they were from any other manufacturer. The difference is that they still run on your Apollo (or Satellite DSPs). This is a major plus if you need your CPU power for other plugins, etc. The UA hardware handles the plugins seamlessly, whether you run them in the console or your DAW. The UA software assigns the DSP to connected hardware as needed and available.

Of course whatever time it takes for a round trip through your DAW is added as extra latency.

Real Time Tracking Vs Mixing and Mastering

There are hardware differences between real time tracking use and mixing / mastering use.

I haven't previously mentioned the UA Satellite Thunderbolt DSP accelerators. They come in quad and octo DSP counts. These can be connected to the Apollos. Again, hardware limits are currently any four total units, regardless of type. Be aware that the Satellites currently add no DSP during tracking. They only add DSP power during mixdown and mastering.

As stated above, when you do tracking, you only get DSP on outputs from the master hardware unit. In my case, with my current hardware setup, I'm better off with a SF Quad as my master hardware unit. This way, I get 4 DSPs for output tracks.

Apollo in a Live Setting

I stated above that I chose Apollo over MOTU's AVB units due to my perception of greater studio utility by Apollo. That in no way means Apollo wouldn't be great in a live setting.

You can set up the console prior to a gig and simply connect Apollos hardware outputs to your PA system. You could even use Apollo's console as the main mixer for your PA if you didn't need a lot of mic inputs. Add an analog mixer for extra mic preamps, if needed.

And of course you get to run all of your plugins in real time. I did sound for a band in the 70s that covered Van Halen's Running With The Devil. We had a Roland (RE-201) Space Echo that I used to do the pitch change of the car horn at the beginning of the song.

The UA emulation of the RE-201 is amazing. So are many of the other classic emulation plugins UA offers. Your guitarist might like to leave a huge amp home, and run one of the great amp sims. There are also bass amp sims, including a new Ampeg SVT set.

Want to record live? Just bring a laptop, an Apollo and you're set.

My Expected Hardware Changes

I plan on selling my two SF Quad TB units. One unit will be replaced by a used Apollo 8 Quad. The other will be replaced by an Apollo Twin and one or two mics.

I want the BF Quad because its line output preamps can be turned off. My SF Quad can't do this. So I can use all 8 Onyx preamps from my Mackie 1620. I'll also get the slightly better sound quality of the BF unit maintaining 4 SHARCs for output DSP.

I'm looking at a Twin Duo as replacement for my second SF Quad for a few reasons. First, I don't need 10 SHARCs. Eight is plenty for what I'm doing. Nor do I need the extra inputs and outputs another Apollo 8 would afford me. And a Twin Duo will bundled with a matched pair of AKG 314 mics will be about equal in cost to what I'll get for a SF Quad TB and my duplicate plugins.

How to Sell Duplicate Plugins

Something happened I didn't expect. UA gave me a Helios Type 69 EQ ($200) for free when I bought my new Apollo 8. I also got a $100 coupon towards another plug-in. I kind of expected the coupon, but a freeby? Very cool.

BTW, UA has gave me an extra $50 coupon in July (on top of the other coupon I got with the new Apollo BF). I received a $50 coupon at the beginning of August, and the an extra $25 coupon at mid month. And they put sales on regularly. So if you go with Apollo, watch the site regularly. Coupons magically appear in your account, so check it too.

The thing is, when I got the first SF, it came with the same Helios plugin. So I now had two licenses for the same plugin. If you have multiple Apollos, you get to use any plugin across all hardware with a single license. When I logged into my account, I saw that I now had a "system 2" listed with the second license. No hardware was listed in system 2.

Then I bought the second SF and suddenly I had a system 3 listed with the Helios 69, and my system 2 had it and other duplicate plugins worth almost $1800.

The thing is, you cannot sell plugins by themselves. You must sell them with UA hardware. So, in my case, I will ask UA to transfer one of my SF Quad TB units to my system 2, and one to system 3. They've already confirmed that they will do so.

By the way, when you sell the hardware, you have the option of keeping plugins or selling them with the hardware. Even if you sell hardware without duplicate (for purchase only) plugins, the new owner will get a free bundle with his or her new hardware. In the case of the Apollo SF or BF, the new owner will automatically get the Realtime Analog Classics Plus bundle, a selection of 10 plugins that cover most basic recording needs.

Universal Audio Support

I spent a lot of time researching my first Apollo purchase. That included at least five calls to UA support with some technical questions pertaining to hardware differences between models. At this time I didn't own any UA products. The support was extremely friendly and technically spot on. I was never rushed by the agent to get off the phone so he could get to an actual UA product owner.

After I purchased my first Apollo, I needed UA support to answer questions about plug-in license transfer, DSP sharing, and selling of software and hardware. Again, support was excellent.

Agents even helped me with questions about selling duplicate plugins after I bought used hardware that came with plugin software I would never need to buy from UA. To me, that is superb.

The Sound

Obviously, no matter how good design or structure is, with a pro audio product the bottom line is, "How does it sound?".

I have had the privilege to spend a week on a Neve console and 24 track Studer analog based studio in the late 70s. As far as I can remember, my Apollo system nails the sound of that analog studio.

I have not had time to do any recording through microphones yet. I've used instrument tracks and high quality audio loops in Logic pro X running at 24/96. The sound (without any plugins) is stunning through my cans and the Apollo 8.

I have a ton of plugins, that I'm dying to try out. I've got tape emulations (Studer A800 for input, Ampex ATR-102 for output), unison channel strips, reverbs to die for (Lexicon 224, EMT 140 & 250, Ocean Way Studios, AMS RMX16), guitar amp sims (Marshall Plexi, Chandler GAV-16T, Freidman amps), modulation and delay effects (Roland Space Echo and Dimension D, Boss CE-1, EP-34, Moog Multimode), and compressors, limiters and gates (LA-2A, 1176, etc.) and mastering (Vertigo Sound VSM-3 mix satellite. To name just a few.

I just haven't the time to play with them yet because I'm moving to a smaller house.

When I've moved, I'll get to really delve deep into my Apollo system, and if anyone here wants, I'll post followup impressions.

Is Apollo Right for You?

Negatives

So you thought I worked for UA, didn't you? Yes, I have given a glowing review so far. But no, I don't have any affiliation with UA. So here are the negatives I find with the current Apollo platform.

1. Apollo is expensive. Entry level is a Twin Single at $700. An Apollo 8 Duo is $2500. A quad will run you $2500.

OTOH, a used Apollo Quad TB SF will run between $1250 and $1600 with the base Analog Classics Plus bundle. The SF is still a really great interface.

2. Console is stereo only. As a die hard surround sound fan, this means I must eschew 5.1 monitoring while I track. Not a deal breaker, but I wish UA would add a 5.1 output bus.

3. Console only has two stereo aux buses. I'd like to see at least 8 of them.

4. Firewire and Thunderbolt hardware are not compatable at this time.

5. Total DSP power is limited to a single hardware unit on outputs when tracking.

6. No Apollo Satellite units on tracking. For users with need of huge amounts of DSP, this is not good.

7. No Octo SHARCs available in Apollo 8.

8. No native plugin support. You must buy an Apollo to run any UA plugins.


Positives

1. Superb sound quality.

2. Plugins run on hardware leaving your computer's CPU to power native plugins from other manufacturers.

3. Realtime plugins while tracking with no discernible latency.

4. Easy to expand inputs, outputs and DSP power.

5. Very good software console. UA made large improvements to its original console software with console 2. What might console 3 bring?

6. Unison preamps and plugins. The closest emulation of boutique console strips and mic preamps you can get, without spending a fortune on real hardware.

7. Fantastic range of plugins. But be aware, these plugins are like eating peanuts. Once you get a few, you can't stop until you have them all.

Hamer Duotone, Brian Moore i213, Taylor 710 BCE 

VG-99, FC-300, RMC Fanout
RJM Mastermind GT10
Kemper Profiling Amp
Radial JDV Mk3, X-Amp
Mesa Recto Pre + 20/20
68 Fender Bandmaster (AB763)
Marshal AS80R

UA Apollo X6, Twin X, Logic Pro, Luna, Melodyne Studio

Elantric

Thanks for posting this comprehensive review!

Ive heard very good things regarding the UA Apollo Interfaces and DSP Plug in FX  Bundle   

fokof

Funny , I have multiple UA products and I am looking to buy A MOTU Ultralite AVB  :)


I have an Apollo Quad and two PCIe UAD2 cards , loads and loads of plugins , big UA fan of the concept.
Their new Ampeg plugins are the best I've heard so far.

One thing I feel I should mention is that I absolutely hate their software and drivers , they are REALLY BAD.
With the console , you can only use 8 inserts , only have 4 stereo busses.
The unit is Mega fussy with the order you power on things.

I've been using MOTU product for 18 years , you can "Hot" plug their unit in any order , strong drivers etc.... not with UA.
I'm really hoping they'll bring up that game a little.

I use the Apollo mainly as an FX insert machine at work (In an M7CL) , it froze on me a couple of time , one of wich , the main vocal was in a preamp ........ not funny having to stall a show to Replug a mike in a console ...... Since then , I only use it as FX.

I wouldn't use that in a live context where my sound depends on it. Not yet.
In a studio and controlled environment : best thing since Sliced bread.


fokof

#3
I'm so impressed by The Ampeg plugins ......  Impressive !!!!!!!

One other disadvantage of using these Live:  You need the computer that acts as a dongle (Uber deluxe dongle)
It can work without the CPU once booted , but you need to bring the CPU everytime when you power on the damn thing.....


Don't get me wrong : if I would be able to power on these without a CPU , with the last setup on memory , I would be all over a Twin Solo for my Live setup but since You can't do that and their driver is ....... Meeeehhhhhh at best , I'll keep the machine in the studio

fokof

Latest 9.0.1 drivers gives my 1st gen Apollo access to Console 2.0

All Ampeg plugins are now Unison compatible.

New interesting plugins.

Let's hope the driver is more stable.

http://www.uaudio.com/uad/downloads/

scratch17

UA has a promo through 12/31. Buy any Apollo 8 rack interface and get a free UAD-2 Quad Satellite accelerator.

So for example, if you bought an Apollo 8 Duo ($1999 at Sweetwater), you get a $999 value satellite accelerator free.

Be aware, to qualify, the Apollo must be new, not refurbished. Also, this promo applies to the current Apollo Firewire (Silver Face model). If you buy a Thunderbolt unit, you get a Thunderbolt satellite. If you buy a Firewire unit, you get a Firewire satellite.
Hamer Duotone, Brian Moore i213, Taylor 710 BCE 

VG-99, FC-300, RMC Fanout
RJM Mastermind GT10
Kemper Profiling Amp
Radial JDV Mk3, X-Amp
Mesa Recto Pre + 20/20
68 Fender Bandmaster (AB763)
Marshal AS80R

UA Apollo X6, Twin X, Logic Pro, Luna, Melodyne Studio

fokof

I should report that driver 9.0.1 IS more stable.
Haven't had an issue since I've updated.


scratch17

UA just announced a new line of their Apollo Twin interfaces at NAMM.

The Twin MK2 line now comes in three DSP levels: Single, Duo and Quad.
Prices for the Single and Duo stay the same at $699 and $899. The new Quad
model is $1299. That sounds like a lot, but compared to an Apollo 8 Quad at $2500
it makes sense for someone on a budget. The Twin series has a single S-MUX ADAT
input port, so it's inputs can be expanded by adding a second interface you might
already own.

If you are going with UA for the first time, I would consider the Twin Quad,
but not the Single or Duo.

One of the limitations of the UA platform is that you can only utilize DSP cores
in the hardware you are tracking through. So even if you have a second Apollo hardware
unit, you cannot share its DSP cores with a Single or Duo core unit during tracking.

Once the track is printed however, any available DSP cores in any connected unit
can be used. On the Mac, up to four Thunderbolt Apollo units can be connected.
Windows 10 TB support just became available, but the UA people announced
multi-Apollo systems using TB on Windows is coming soon.

I am considering an Apollo Twin Quad myself, even though I already own an
Apollo 8 Duo and an Apollo Quad Silverface with a TB card.

The MK2 Twins have a new monitor control section that is intuitive and simple.
It will also work with my Apollo 8, so I can easily switch between three pairs of monitors.

There are also new parameter control functions with the Unison pre-amp strips,
and the Unison guitar amp and pedal sims. It isn't clear to me yet whether all
of the UAD plug-ins can be controlled by the Twin's main knob. Only the Unison
plug-ins were demoed in the video I saw on Sonic State.
Hamer Duotone, Brian Moore i213, Taylor 710 BCE 

VG-99, FC-300, RMC Fanout
RJM Mastermind GT10
Kemper Profiling Amp
Radial JDV Mk3, X-Amp
Mesa Recto Pre + 20/20
68 Fender Bandmaster (AB763)
Marshal AS80R

UA Apollo X6, Twin X, Logic Pro, Luna, Melodyne Studio

scratch17

It turns out the Twins' main knob controls only the Unison plugin parameters.

However, Softube made the announcement at NAMM that their Console 1 Mk2 will control many of the UA plugins in the compressor, gate and EQ categories. The supported plugins are "pre-mapped and ready to go." Console 1 is essentially a hardware front end for the plugins it supports.

There is also some DAW control, depending on which you are using. Sonar and Studio One have the most control available.

There is a list of the first UA plugins which they will support on their website. Looks like about 40 UA plugins initially. Other UA plugins that Console 1 will control are promised.

Softube dropped the price of the Mk2 model to $499 retail and is including their well regarded SSL 4000 E channel strip.

So I am looking at getting Console 1 MK2, as I own about 35 of the UA plugins on the supported list.

Hamer Duotone, Brian Moore i213, Taylor 710 BCE 

VG-99, FC-300, RMC Fanout
RJM Mastermind GT10
Kemper Profiling Amp
Radial JDV Mk3, X-Amp
Mesa Recto Pre + 20/20
68 Fender Bandmaster (AB763)
Marshal AS80R

UA Apollo X6, Twin X, Logic Pro, Luna, Melodyne Studio


scratch17

New with Apollo Console II, version 9.10: DSP Pairing.

Essentially, if you have an available DSP chip, it can be 'paired' with the track's initial chip to allow you to create longer, more complex plugin chains.

For example, say you wanted a channel with a Manley VoxBox channel strip and the new Capitol Chambers reverb plugin. You could not load both with a previous version of Console II. However, you can load both by setting up DSP Pairing on the channel while running Console II V9.10.

This only works with Apollo (SF, BF or X Series) and Twin Duo or Quad. It is unavailable with Satellites or PCIe accelerators.

See this article for some description and setup information.

https://help.uaudio.com/hc/en-us/articles/360030068452
Hamer Duotone, Brian Moore i213, Taylor 710 BCE 

VG-99, FC-300, RMC Fanout
RJM Mastermind GT10
Kemper Profiling Amp
Radial JDV Mk3, X-Amp
Mesa Recto Pre + 20/20
68 Fender Bandmaster (AB763)
Marshal AS80R

UA Apollo X6, Twin X, Logic Pro, Luna, Melodyne Studio