Mac users - Any success with OSX other than El Capitan?

Started by HCarlH, February 01, 2016, 11:26:43 AM

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HCarlH

After years of Windows only PCs, I bought a used mid-2012 Macbook Pro (i7, 16GB RAM, 512 SSD) for live use with the FTP.
It came with El Capitan installed.

When I bought it, I had no idea the FTP software would not work as well as the Windows version. (VSTs loading with a blank window inside the TP software in El Capitan)
http://tripletalk.fishman.com/2015/10/fishman-tripleplay-not-currently-el-capitan-compatible/
I'd rather not go through the hassle of programming the VSTs as hardware synths as suggested in the workaround. I'd rather have it work as easily as the Windows version.
I'm thinking of (attempting) a downgrade of the OS....I think Yosemite will work(?).

Is anyone getting Yosemite to work correctly with the FTP software? (VSTs properly loading within the software).
If I downgrade, are there issues I need to be aware of?
Should I wait and hope that Fishman eventually has software that works with El Capitan?

GR-55 (or) Fishman TP + Kemper Profiling Rack -->> 
QSC K10 -->> FOH
Fender Squier Stratocaster Bullet (w/GK3), Ibanez AM93 (w/FTP pickup),  Stratocaster (w/FTP pickup)

Telecaster, Charvel SoCal ProMod, Gibson Les Paul, PV Wolfgang,

Elantric


gumtown

Probably why the mac book was sold.
I find hardware works better with the operating system that was around at the time it was made.
2012 hardware is a good fit for Mountain Lion OSX 10.8
Free "GR-55 FloorBoard" editor software from https://sourceforge.net/projects/grfloorboard/

HCarlH

Quote from: Elantric on February 01, 2016, 12:12:21 PM
I use Tripleplay with Mountain Lion and Mavericks  - no problems

Thanks, Elantric and gumtown.  Unfortunately, the comments below from one of the links worry me.  :-\
I may have to use one of my Windows boxes for gigs and wait for a solution from either Fishman or Apple.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"The problem with El Capitan is that once installed, downgrading to a previous version of the OS is not so simple as it used to be. I don't know if the author himself tried the simple time machine restore that he purports to work but I did and I've been looking for solutions to the mountain of other problems I've had ever since. While the problems with El Capitan and downgrading to Yosemite are not the authors fault, the poor information of this article most certainly is. If your readers wanted to know how to downgrade from Yosemite to Mavericks, this might have passed the sniff test. But considering all the problems I and everyone else has had trying to downgrade to Yosemite, reading this simple solution reworded from past OS versions, it is obvious the author himself merely gave a tutorial on what has always worked before without bothering to check his facts to see what works now. A simple downgrade from El Capitan to Yosemite will result in permissions errors galore and get ready to read "OS X needs to repair your library to run applications" time and time again."


    "He's right, whatever you do, FIGURE OUT A WAY TO WORK WITH EL CAPITAN.Trying to downgrade will result in more issues than you're previously having and it'll become a worse nightmare.Give Apple some time to workout the bugs and I am sure it'll work itself out."
GR-55 (or) Fishman TP + Kemper Profiling Rack -->> 
QSC K10 -->> FOH
Fender Squier Stratocaster Bullet (w/GK3), Ibanez AM93 (w/FTP pickup),  Stratocaster (w/FTP pickup)

Telecaster, Charvel SoCal ProMod, Gibson Les Paul, PV Wolfgang,

Elantric

#4
A little late  - but Ive been warning folks to steer clear of OSX 10.11 El Capitan for 4 months now

MAC OS X 10.11 El Capitan Update Advisory
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=16336.msg116696#msg116696

And in my experience, OSX (prior to El Capitan) will yield much lower latency than any computer running any version of MS Windows OS

scratch17

This trick might work for you. It worked for me. Get a blank Thunderbolt external drive and connect it to the Mac. An SSD would be best but a standard 7200 rpm drive will do.

Now make a Genius appointment and take your Mac and the drive to the Apple store. Tell them you need help to install the OSX version you want to run on your Mac. They should do it for you; they did it for me at no charge. I did own a licence for the older version of OSX (Mountan Lion) that I wanted to downgrade to.

Once you are up and running you can wipe the Internal drive and install whatever version of the OS you want. I never did because booting and running off of the TB connected SSD was so much faster than the HD on my iMac.

Hamer Duotone, Brian Moore i213, Taylor 710 BCE 

VG-99, FC-300, RMC Fanout
RJM Mastermind GT10
Kemper Profiling Amp
Radial JDV Mk3, X-Amp
Mesa Recto Pre + 20/20
68 Fender Bandmaster (AB763)
Marshal AS80R

UA Apollo X6, Twin X, Logic Pro, Luna, Melodyne Studio

Elantric

QuoteThis trick might work for you. It worked for me. Get a blank Thunderbolt external drive and connect it to the Mac. An SSD would be best but a standard 7200 rpm drive will do.

Now make a Genius appointment and take your Mac and the drive to the Apple store. Tell them you need help to install the OSX version you want to run on your Mac. They should do it for you; they did it for me at no charge. I did own a licence for the older version of OSX (Mountan Lion) that I wanted to downgrade to.

Once you are up and running you can wipe the Internal drive and install whatever version of the OS you want. I never did because booting and running off of the TB connected SSD was so much faster than the HD on my iMac.

Agreed! ^

HCarlH

Quote from: scratch17 on February 02, 2016, 12:04:31 PM
This trick might work for you. It worked for me. Get a blank Thunderbolt external drive and connect it to the Mac. An SSD would be best but a standard 7200 rpm drive will do.

Now make a Genius appointment and take your Mac and the drive to the Apple store. Tell them you need help to install the OSX version you want to run on your Mac. They should do it for you; they did it for me at no charge. I did own a licence for the older version of OSX (Mountan Lion) that I wanted to downgrade to.

Once you are up and running you can wipe the Internal drive and install whatever version of the OS you want. I never did because booting and running off of the TB connected SSD was so much faster than the HD on my iMac.


Quote from: Elantric on February 02, 2016, 12:05:48 PM
Agreed! ^

I do know that in using my Eleven Rack as the audio interface for my guitar to the MBP, I was using the .4 MS setting for Amplitube. (That's point 4   :)  )  with no pops nor clicks....so I'm very happy with the performance of the MBP in that respect.

Scratch17, that's exactly what I did an hour ago. My appointment is for next week at the Genius Bar here.
My purpose for this MBP is solely music so a bleeding edge OS is not required.....only compatibility and performance.

Thanks, guys!
GR-55 (or) Fishman TP + Kemper Profiling Rack -->> 
QSC K10 -->> FOH
Fender Squier Stratocaster Bullet (w/GK3), Ibanez AM93 (w/FTP pickup),  Stratocaster (w/FTP pickup)

Telecaster, Charvel SoCal ProMod, Gibson Les Paul, PV Wolfgang,

HCarlH

I didn't want to wait for the Genius Bar appointment so I followed the instructions in the links Elantric provided.
I decided to wipe the disk for a clean install and to undo anything the previous owner may have done.

Mountain Lion is now installed and the suite of provided programs + the FTP software works great!   :)
Including all the presets. Another benefit is the computer starts WAY quicker.
Guitar Rig and Kontakt Player can't be updated due to ML being 10.8 and they require 10.9, but that's
not a big deal. As mentioned, the provided software works fine.

Whenever it has been proven the bugs have been eliminated, I'll upgrade...but not until then.
Thanks again, guys!  :)
GR-55 (or) Fishman TP + Kemper Profiling Rack -->> 
QSC K10 -->> FOH
Fender Squier Stratocaster Bullet (w/GK3), Ibanez AM93 (w/FTP pickup),  Stratocaster (w/FTP pickup)

Telecaster, Charvel SoCal ProMod, Gibson Les Paul, PV Wolfgang,

gumbo

...and it's amazing what you can get away with just on OS 10.6.8   ...if you hold your mouth right.. ::)
Read slower!!!   ....I'm typing as fast as I can...

Elantric

#10
At this hour it's a new day, and most vendors now have updated USB drivers and full compatibility with OSX 10.11 El Capitan.

concordal

Quotemost vendors now have . . . compatibility with OSX 10.11 El Capitan

Has anyone tried GR-55 Floorboard with El Capitan?  Was hoping it would work well without requiring a new release.

HCarlH

It appears IK Multimedia is still having a problem with at least one of their products.

http://cgi.ikmultimedia.com/ikforum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=10812&p=62834&hilit=el+capitan#p62834

I have just taken advantage of their current promotion of the full version of Sampletank 3 bundled with iRig Keys products....waiting for it to arrive.
I'm still leary of re-installing El Capitan when other products of theirs aren't working properly.
I'm going to try Yosemite soon to get as close of an update of OS X as possible while still working with the FTP.
GR-55 (or) Fishman TP + Kemper Profiling Rack -->> 
QSC K10 -->> FOH
Fender Squier Stratocaster Bullet (w/GK3), Ibanez AM93 (w/FTP pickup),  Stratocaster (w/FTP pickup)

Telecaster, Charvel SoCal ProMod, Gibson Les Paul, PV Wolfgang,

scratch17

BTW, you can partition an external drive and add boot partitions for various versions of OS X. Just hold the option key down at startup. You can select any partition from a list that comes up before the boot process completes. Then you boot into whatever OS version you want.

I intend to try El Capitan that way, while keeping Yosemite available if I need it for something not yet EC compatible.
Hamer Duotone, Brian Moore i213, Taylor 710 BCE 

VG-99, FC-300, RMC Fanout
RJM Mastermind GT10
Kemper Profiling Amp
Radial JDV Mk3, X-Amp
Mesa Recto Pre + 20/20
68 Fender Bandmaster (AB763)
Marshal AS80R

UA Apollo X6, Twin X, Logic Pro, Luna, Melodyne Studio

Elantric

#14
QuoteI intend to try El Capitan that way, while keeping Yosemite available if I need it for something not yet EC compatible.

The big hurdle today for folks with a brand new Mac loaded with OSX 10.11 El Capitan, is :
Where to obtain legal boot images of OSX 10.10 Yosemite, 10.9 Mavericks, 10.8 Mountain Lion, 10.7 Lion  ??
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OS_X

and depending on the physical hardware of the Mac, it may be impossible to revert to a version of OSX that is already 5 years old.

And (like clockwork) in a few months we will have yet another new set of issues when Apple releases OSX 10.12 in September
http://www.macrumors.com/roundup/os-x-10-12/
QuoteOS X 10.12 will likely be previewed in June, at Apple's Worldwide Developers Conference. Apple has not yet announced dates for the conference, but based on scheduling information at the Moscone Center where Apple holds the event, it could take place from June 13 to 17.

New software updates are often highlighted on the first day of WWDC, with developers provided with access to the new operating system shortly after to begin work on compatible apps taking advantage of new features.


Papablosky


gregjon

Quote from: Elantric on April 08, 2016, 08:56:42 AM
At this hour it's a new day, and most vendors now have updated USB drivers and full compatibility with OSX 10.11 El Capitan.
What is the minimum Mac I should get to use FTP with their software ?
Since it is now Aug 2016 does that now mean I can safely get a laptop with El Capitan ?


Thanks



Fender 50th Anniversary Strat with GK3 pickup.
Godin Freeway SA
Godin Multiac Nylon SA
Fishman Triple Play
GR-55
GR-20
SUGS Selector
RFX Midi Foot Control Pedal
Ipad Air, Apps: Bias, Jam Up Pro, Flying Haggis, Tone Stack, Audiobus, Garage Band,

Elantric

#18
There remains a bloat with El Capitan
I remain on Yosemite and I never buy new - current fave is a late 2011 17" MacBook Pro with I7 ( the last good Mac IMHO because the user can upgrade the Ram to 16gb and install Dual SSD drives or one SSD and one BluRay burner still has built in SPDIF I/O and 24 bit stereo Line level I/O and a PCI Expresscard34 expansion port I use for proprietary A/V hardware (Matrox/ RME)

They killed that goose after the passing of Steve Jobs

Seek one of those  while you can

if you want to work and be productive a long time , use a dedicated DAW / Music Computer and never connect to Internet. That's what the remaining pro studios enforce with their Protools computer.

Always use a separate computer to try new things or connect to the net , but by design you accept the pre planned obsolescence that occurs when you apply the latest updates of your OS and Apps

They want to make you unhappy with the performance loss after the latest bloat ware is installed which forces you to buy a newer faster computer every few years. Its by design

A gently used 2012 Mac Mini is Good and fast and affordable

My 2013 15" MacBook retina ( like all new MacBooks ) has soldered down Ram and no ability to upgrade. I have 8gb but that's not enough ( need 16gb IMHO which is around $110 , but compare prices of a new Mac with 16GB RAM , Apple is laughing all the way to the bank with the premium they charge for RAM

Get an i5 or I7 with ability to upgrade RAM and hard drive

That restricts you to a very expensive new Mac that will be buggy in  9 weeks when OSX 10.12 arrives.

That's why I sought out a used Mac and saved $$

Can't wait to go 100% Linux

rolandvg99

Agree with Steve on this one. Linux is what I'm hoping to use in the future.

My Macmini is a 2011 server and still does a great job. When I'm buying a new machine sometimes in the future it's most likely not going to be a Mac. While I'm not very fond of Windows, they do at least offer a touch screen option and the possibility to run customized hardware. Apple refuses to see any use of this tech out of fear to lose iPad sales and control of their end users. Mixing with my Motu AVB rig live is not a good experience using MacOS, but my ASUS works great and can take a few upgrades as well.
To V or not to V: That is the question.

My little Soundcloud corner

yuri

 I with my FTP has never had any   problem with EL capitán version  - i use MacBook pro retina 15'' ( 2014) -2,2 Ghz  intel Core i7 - 16 GB ram

braccio

I've been working with El Capitan since it was in beta with no issues with any audio programs that I've been running. This is on a 2014 iMac and a 2013 MacBook. Also used it on a 2011 iMac and 2015 iMac at work (Network Administration for a marine research facility) and have had no issues there either.

Not sure what problems others are actually seeing. I just hear a lot of "it doesn't work", but no details.

Pete

Elantric

#22
it all depends on what you are doing -
i do more than just work with Roland  / Boss hardware.

But my old Juno-G requires older version of OSX to launch its Editor, that is not supported in El Capitan.

Also official Apple Support for firewire Core Audio ceased, and my old Matrox Expresscard based Video capture hardware (MXO2 Mini-Max) lacks OSX  El Capitan drivers    - but does have Yosemite drivers
http://www.matrox.com/video/en/support/downloads/
Some issues listed at link below remain valid with no fix :

https://ask.audio/articles/5-reasons-musicians-producers-and-djs-should-avoid-updating-to-os-x-1011-el-capitan-today

http://www.sweetwater.com/sweetcare/articles/el-capitan-mac-os-x-10-11-compatibility-information/
Apogee
Apogee has included OS X 10.11 in its list of supported operating systems for its products' that use Thunderbolt and USB. Unfortunately, Apogee's FireWire interfaces can no longer be supported due to Apple's decision to cease development of its FireWire Core Audio Driver. This doesn't mean they won't work, just that Apogee will not offer support if they do not. If you choose to upgrade and are using one of Apogee's interfaces, you will be doing so on your own accord (you likely received an e-mail from Apogee with this information).




Avid
On July 22, 2016 Avid announced that Mac OS X 10.11.4, 10.11.5 & 10.11.6 are not qualified and not recommended for use with Pro Tools 12. Click here for details.

For more information, including compatibility information regarding Avid's software and El Capitan, see Avid's full statement here.




PreSonus
PreSonus has announced several incompatibilities with its product line and OS X El Capitan. You can view PreSonus' full compatibility statement here.
http://support.presonus.com/entries/105171633-Mac-OS-X-10-11-El-Capitan-Compatibility-Statement?flash_digest=d977ff311b0316ecd40eb3161bcdcfe6f573af5f


Known Problem: Starting with Mac OS X 10.11, AudioBox VSL control software no longer works, the control panel will not pass audio (i.e. no audio input, no meters, no audio playback from system) with AudioBox VSL Software installed. Please refer to this article here that explains the issue in more detail and how to resolve it. 


braccio

If you follow the link on the PerSonus page, you get to another page that says:

"Changes in the Mac OS X operating system (OS X 10.11 El Capitan) prevent the VSL control panel from functioning as designed. Fortunately the AudioBox 1818VSL, 44VSL and 22VSL are fully class-compliant Core Audio devices and can be used on Mac OS X without the AudioBox VSL software installed. By using the built in Audio MIDI Setup Utility found in the Applications / Utilities folder, all inputs and outputs can be managed manually within the operating system. By removing the VSL software, you can take full control of all of your Inputs and Outputs by managing them in your Digital Audio Workstation. "

Additional details are there as well: http://support.presonus.com/hc/en-us/articles/210044533

In fact, it looks like all the other PreSonus issues were solved by MacOS release 10.11.1 or by firmware releases.

I've been using ProTools and haven't noticed those issues.

Just sayin'

rolandvg99

Main problem with Presonus' approach is that these devices are almost useless in a studio environment without the VSL mixer software. The latencies these devices operate at without the near-zero latency monitoring are mildly off putting.
To V or not to V: That is the question.

My little Soundcloud corner