GR-55 - ALTERNATE TUNINGS SUDDENLY DON'T WORK.. HELP!!

Started by Paganini666, December 22, 2011, 07:07:26 PM

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godinloverguy

Hello Gentlemen!!

OK thanks for all your feedback and help. I was trying all your suggestions this morning, double checking everything with regard to the GR55 system settings etc.
Everything was set OK but I was still getting those annoying double-ghost notes, particularly on the
1-E and 2-B strings. I was also noticing that the volume from the E and B strings was much lower than the other 4 strings, so I started to raise the level of the GK-3 pup, only at the 1-E and 2-B stings.

I THINK I GOT IT NOW !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

WOW, all of a sudden the volume shot up and the alternate tuning note instantly became one clear note and the double ghost notes disappeared !!!!!!!! IT WAS LIKE FREAKING MAGIC !!!!
:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)

INCREDIBLE !!!!

So, what I surmise, is that the GK-3 pup height is EXTREMELY important with regards to alternate tunings.
The pup height is probably the single most important factor with regard to tracking and precision and alternate tunings. Infinitely more important than the distance to the bridge.
I know the factory specs say to adjust the bridge height to 1 mm spacing at each string. I guess I was a bit lazy in this regard when I initially double-sided taped the GK-3 to my guitar bodies. In retrospect, the spacing at the 6,5,4 strings was 1 mm, but at the 3,2 and 1 strings, it was maybe 1.2-1.3mm.
Those .2 and .3 mm differences MAKE A DIFFERENCE when it comes to tracking and alternate tunings !!!!!!!!!

OK I will have to cut up some more spacers and re-install my GK-3 pups. I will try to go for 0.9-1.0 mm across all the strings, and I will get back to you all.

Off to cut my grass, so I will get back to you tonight after I do the new installations.
Keeping my fingers crossed !!!........

If this works, especially on my hollowbody, it s MILLER TIME !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

admin

#51
QuoteSo, what I surmise, is that the GK-3 pup height is EXTREMELY important with regards to alternate tunings.
The pup height is probably the single most important factor with regard to tracking and precision and alternate tunings.


Correct - The GK-3 pup height ( 1mm between top of PU and bottom of Strings - as explained in the GK-3 Installation manual)  is EXTREMELY Crucial setting, to achieve all the advertised Functions of any GK 13 pin Guitar Processors ( Roland, Boss, Antares, Axon, Yamaha)

http://roland.com/V-Guitar/howto.html



QuoteInfinitely more important than the distance to the bridge.

Very True!  -but remember the GK PU distance to the bridge setting is mostly for the COSM PU Modeling to achieve best DSP Modeled Neck PU Tone , but if GK PU is closer than 10mm to the bridge , you get far less output level, and bad results 
For a GK-3 on a Guitar, I would be sure its at least 10mm away. 20mm is Optimal.

godinloverguy

Hi !
Just for clarification, you mention that if the GK-3 is closer than 20mm to the bridge, results are bad, but the owner's manual states that the ideal distance is 15 mm or even less.
Please let me know. Thanks !!

Elantric

#53
For all questions regarding GK-3 - review the area of the forums dedicated to these PU's
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?board=11.0

and specifically

Can GK-3 PU be too close to the bridge??
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=13322.0
For a GK-3 on a Guitar, I would be sure its at least 10mm away. 20mm is Optimal.

midiman

I have 4 guitars with GK3's attached and never have any tracking issues. This is what works for me. hopefully it will be of use to others:-

Try to ensure their is 1mm height above pickup with the string pressed down on to the last fret on the neck.
Ensure the correct scale setting is used i.e strat, LP etc
Distance - Between 15mm & 20mm is optimal. Measure with a tape measure and make sure that you set each string on the GR-55 accurately.
Adjust sensitivity on each string to get a level that is balanced across all strings.

godinloverguy

Hi Midiman et al!

I have been adjusting  my GK-3's for the past 2 hours.
OK here is what I have found:
Yes, midiman, 1 mm from pup to string  seems ideal. More than 1 mm leads to loss of output volume and increased frequency of ghost and double notes with alternate tunings.
I am aiming for 0.9-1.0 mm. This works well,
Distance to bridge of 15-20 mm. Yes !! Yes !!!!
I had mine set to 10mm. Way too close !!! At 10 mm, there was a loss of output volume and loss of clarity and precision of notes.
I just set the GK-3 on my Godin Flat Five X to 0.9-1.0 mm height, and to 15.0 mm distance. Working like a charm !!!!! Love it !!!!!
The GR-55 works well with the GK-3 at these parameters with my Flat Five X.

Now onto the adjustments with my second GK-3 mounted on a Godin A6 Ultra.
Will be back with news.

Thanks  so much guys for all your help!!!!!! Last week at this time, I wanted to take a baseball bat to my GR-55!!!

Deacon Blue

I understand that problem completely. It's really strange when forget to move your gk switch from mix to synth..lol

"When your project isn't working, look for the part that you didn't think was important"
www.Bandmix.com/katylyst

rmarton123

#57
I am setup with Acoustic patch and setup Double Drop D High and Low e dropped 2 steps. Low string is good. only single note playing but the High string plays both the natural note and the dropped note at the same time.

I have my head phone out jack direct into my mixer and am listening via headphones through the board. I am also connected to my computer via USB and the Computer is into my Mixer as well. I shut off the volume of the computer so I am only hearing my Headphone jack out from the GR-55.

With it sounding like this I'm afraid my Alternate tunings will go to the live setup when practicing with the band and subsequent gigs.

Please help me diagnose this issue.

Brent Flash

You are hearing the string sound. Put on some headphones and turn it up and you will no longer hear the string acoustically.

Brent Flash

Or, just turn up the speakers until it covers the sound coming from the string.

sixeight

And make sure the normal PU sound is switched off.

rmarton123

You gave me 3 alternatives but you didn't read that I've already read the Discussions and have done each of those items. So when I turn my amp up or listen to a loud amp or have the Normal PU turned off and it still makes the ghost note what then.

I need help other than those 3 repeated suggestions as I've tried all of them none of them worked.

Brent Flash

#62
Quote from: rmarton123 on October 15, 2016, 06:29:28 AM
You gave me 3 alternatives but you didn't read that I've already read the Discussions and have done each of those items. So when I turn my amp up or listen to a loud amp or have the Normal PU turned off and it still makes the ghost note what then.

I need help other than those 3 repeated suggestions as I've tried all of them none of them worked.
Every case in the past has been that the problem was hearing the untransposed string straight from the guitar to your ear. We have had people with this problem even record the signal and listen and they realize that it is not coming out of the unit, they are hearing it from the guitar in their lap. If that is not the case then I suggest you send it off for repair.

Add: Go back to the beginning of this thread, it covers every possibility just in case we forgot to mention something.

Kevin M

Post a direct (no mic) recording and share your patch so others might be able to help you troubleshoot this issue.

CVS

I just finished making an open G patch (think Rolling Stones). I have had the same problems as others in this thread. I am hearing 2 sounds out of only my high e string (I hear the D note and I think I am hearing the E note (much lower in volume than the D note) plus I am getting a warbling sound occasionally (not all of the time). All other strings are OK. I tried headphones and I hear both sounds - no difference between amp and headphones. I lowered the sensitivity of the high E sting - no improvement. I turned off both PCM's and COSM and no sound - so no conflict between std tuning and alt tuning as far as I can tell.

Unless someone has another idea, I was thinking about checking the Pick Up distance between the string and the pickup.

Thoughts.

admin

Quote from: CVS on January 20, 2018, 03:30:11 PM
I just finished making an open G patch (think Rolling Stones). I have had the same problems as others in this thread. I am hearing 2 sounds out of only my high e string (I hear the D note and I think I am hearing the E note (much lower in volume than the D note) plus I am getting a warbling sound occasionally (not all of the time). All other strings are OK. I tried headphones and I hear both sounds - no difference between amp and headphones. I lowered the sensitivity of the high E sting - no improvement. I turned off both PCM's and COSM and no sound - so no conflict between std tuning and alt tuning as far as I can tell.

Unless someone has another idea, I was thinking about checking the Pick Up distance between the string and the pickup.

Thoughts.
post a recording direct from  GR-55 output - (use GR-55 as USB audio interface and ASIO driver if you are on Windows)

CVS

Quote from: admsustainiac on January 20, 2018, 03:32:31 PM
post a recording direct from  GR-55 output - (use GR-55 as USB audio interface and ASIO driver if you are on Windows)

Thanks very much for your response. I am a bit technically challenged - but I am going to do my best to post. May take a day or two. Are there any more detailed instructions on how to do what you suggest?

CVS

I should add that I am using a Roland GR 55 with a fender strat GK3 pick up. Also, I went and checked other alternate tunings. I hear 2 sounds on any string which has been modified by the alternate tuning with headphones on. This is also the case on my open G tuning (contrary to what I said in an earlier post) - both E strings and the A string sound 2 notes. I also tested a number of different patches that came from different sources and the problem is the same on all of them.

Elantric

post a recording direct from  GR-55 output

QuoteI am a bit technically challenged

GR-55 F.A.Q.
https://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=3137

gumtown

If all else fails, try backing up a copy of all your User patches and System/global settings, and perform a factory reset of the GR-55.
Occasionally the GR-55 can go a bit stupid, and a reset and reload of patches can help.
Free "GR-55 FloorBoard" editor software from https://sourceforge.net/projects/grfloorboard/

sixeight

QuoteUnless someone has another idea, I was thinking about checking the Pick Up distance between the string and the pickup.

Make sure the normal pu path is switched off. And make sure you are not hearing the acoustic sound of your electric guitar. If the sound gets better when you turn up the main volume of the GR55, then that is the cause of your problem.

CVS

Quote from: gumtown on January 20, 2018, 09:59:07 PM
If all else fails, try backing up a copy of all your User patches and System/global settings, and perform a factory reset of the GR-55.
Occasionally the GR-55 can go a bit stupid, and a reset and reload of patches can help.

Did factory reset. Unfortunately, that did not solve the problem. I also found a factory patch called Stolling Rones 12-2 in the Rhythm bank. Same issue as my patch.
I really would like to post an audio but I am unsure how to do it. I have no studio software of any type on my computer (I do have GR55 Librarian). Could it be something in my system settings? Just speculating. Thanks again for any input you have

admin

#72
Quote from: CVS on January 21, 2018, 11:55:19 AM
Did factory reset. Unfortunately, that did not solve the problem. I also found a factory patch called Stolling Rones 12-2 in the Rhythm bank. Same issue as my patch.
I really would like to post an audio but I am unsure how to do it. I have no studio software of any type on my computer (I do have GR55 Librarian). Could it be something in my system settings? Just speculating. Thanks again for any input you have

WHat make  / model computer?
If its windows - download a free recording app that supports ASIO Audio interface  and start recording
https://shop.presonus.com/products/studio-one-prods/Studio-One-Free

chrish

#73
Quote from: CVS on January 21, 2018, 11:55:19 AM
Did factory reset. Unfortunately, that did not solve the problem. I also found a factory patch called Stolling Rones 12-2 in the Rhythm bank. Same issue as my patch.
I really would like to post an audio but I am unsure how to do it. I have no studio software of any type on my computer (I do have GR55 Librarian). Could it be something in my system settings? Just speculating. Thanks again for any input you have
you can also download a simple program like Audacity for free, assuming audacity recognizes the gr 55 as the audio interface.

It's set up like an analog tape deck for the transport controls and fairly easy to learn to use.

So basically you record into the audio program via the gr 55 as the audio to computer interface.

Once you have the recording you render* the track mix (*or whatever that particular program calls the process of Final Mix down to wav file) and export that rendered mix

and you save as a WAV file to your choice of location. ( assuming you have Windows cuz I don't know nothing about Macs)

This site does not allow wav files to be loaded so you'll need to convert to an MP3 file.

So you would also have to load a WAV file to MP3 file converter into your computer. Nch
has one but they seem to have had issues with hacking. I remember them issuing a warning about one of their programs being corrupted.

There is also a way to load an MP3 converter directly into Audacity. Audacity cannot provide that directly because of Licensing issues, but they tell you where to get that program and how to load it.

Once you have an MP3 file then all you have to do is Click attachments and other options on the post page here. Your computer should already go to where you have your MP3 files stored and simply click on that file  and it will load your MP3 file to the site.

There's probably a thread here somewhere about how to hook your gr 55 to the computer.

admin

Quote from: chrish on January 21, 2018, 01:33:12 PM
you can also download a simple program like Audacity for free.

It's set up like an analog tape deck for the transport controls and fairly easy to learn to use.

You would also have to load a WAV file to MP3 file converter. Nch
has one but they seem to have a lot of issues with hacking and have had viruses inserted into if you have there programs.

There is also a way to load an MP3 converter directly into Audacity. Audacity cannot provide that directly because of Licensing issues, but they tell you where to get that program and how to load it.

Once you have an MP3 file then all you have to do is Click attachments and other options on the post page here. Your computer should already go to where you have your MP3 files stored and simply click on that file  and it will load your MP3 file to the site.

There's probably a thread here somewhere about how to hook your gr 55 to the computer.

But Audacity does NOT support ASIO devices  - like the low latency GR-55 ASIO USB Audio driver